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Old 11-18-13, 03:49 PM   #1
brakemeister 
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Just got a warning ...hmmm?

Just got a warning from the mods in charge...

answering on the question about Dahon or Tern ... which I am somewhat an expert on. I think the problem was that I needed to add the common pricing to the various models. After all there are 4 of them. To make the decision at least a little bit more clear.
No link to the bikes was in the post.

Hmm? I am a little miffed about that, if thats the new direction around here I might just walk away and find other places which are not censored.

what you guys think ?

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Old 11-18-13, 04:00 PM   #2
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Thor goes, we all go. That's not (just) solidarity, its self interest - Thor's posts are a pillar of the folding community here....
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Old 11-18-13, 04:29 PM   #3
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I think
They didn't tell you specifically why? I'd ask for an explanation if your not sure why they warned you, the warning is pretty much worthless if you don't understand why.
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Old 11-18-13, 04:59 PM   #4
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Even though you've been as rude as hell to me on several occasions, and despite the fact that you seem to think that Dahons are the best thing to come along since sliced bread and will accept no criticism of them whatseover, I do hope that you won't be banned or decide to stop posting here as you do make an interesting post once in a blue moon.

I imagine the mods don't appreciate your using this subforum to peddle your merchandise. Can you blame them?
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Old 11-18-13, 05:19 PM   #5
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I imagine the mods don't appreciate your using this subforum to peddle your merchandise. Can you blame them?
He has a lot of interesting input and advice due to his extensive first-hand knowledge. Just because he stands behind certain makes and sells them doesn't diminish the worth of his comments. If I decided to open a bike shop and sell Bike Fridays, Bromptons and Citizens, does that mean I can no longer post about their attributes or why I like them?

As for the warning, I've seen a lot of baseless warnings from the moderators of many forums... every Mayberry has their Barney Fife.
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Old 11-18-13, 05:22 PM   #6
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I might just walk away and find other places which are not censored.

what you guys think ?

Thor
where will you go? there really isn't any other forum quite like this that pings so highly in internet search results. you know that.

this is a moderated forum and you have pretty much free reign to plug your products on a very frequent basis. if once in a while you get checked it's probably for the good of the forum community as a whole.

if this were an "uncensored" forum it would frankly be abysmal. imagine endless flame wars and every other post being spam from faceless product hawkers. it would be useless to enthusiasts and the fact is they are the ones who give the forum vitality and attract new members.

you've got a pretty great social media marketing tool here. don't be a whiner threatening to take your toys and leave. it's unattractive.
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Old 11-18-13, 08:02 PM   #7
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what you guys think ?

Thor
I'd guess it was not a single event but probably cumulative .. if you didn't receive a clear explanation from a moderator, I'd ask for one .. I'd also review the forum guidelines concerning dealers selling their products or services via the general forums .. I found THIS .. smallwheeler makes some good points .. not really seeing this as censorship .. hang in there..
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Old 11-18-13, 09:52 PM   #8
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you've got a pretty great social media marketing tool here. don't be a whiner threatening to take your toys and leave. it's unattractive.
+1.
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Old 11-18-13, 09:58 PM   #9
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He has a lot of interesting input and advice due to his extensive first-hand knowledge. Just because he stands behind certain makes and sells them doesn't diminish the worth of his comments. If I decided to open a bike shop and sell Bike Fridays, Bromptons and Citizens, does that mean I can no longer post about their attributes or why I like them?

As for the warning, I've seen a lot of baseless warnings from the moderators of many forums... every Mayberry has their Barney Fife.
"Standing behind" products and whitewashing them are two different things. I--and I'm not the only one--have had legitimate complaints about Dahon's products and service and he's flown into a rage and become insulting whenever I've dared come out and air my views.

Here's a classic example of his intransigence: http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...dahon%2C+ekdog

Last edited by Ekdog; 11-18-13 at 10:07 PM.
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Old 11-18-13, 10:25 PM   #10
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top lol, ekdog. i chuckled sensibly. got any more?

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Old 11-18-13, 10:35 PM   #11
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top lol, ekdog. i chuckled sensibly. got any more?

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...dahon%2C+ekdog

More mirth served up here: http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...-heavier-rider

Last edited by Ekdog; 11-18-13 at 10:49 PM. Reason: Added link.
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Old 11-18-13, 11:38 PM   #12
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i softly chortled.

but, i'll see your thread and raise you two. i recalled reading these last year. thor and dahon steve trade licks on a bunch of hapless dahon/tern owners with shattered knees and broken toes after encounters with the dreaded "stock folding pedal". seems the pedals were great, its just that the owners weren't using them correctly! seems the numerous customers are injured idiots who need a class in the proper way to use a bicycle pedal. also, interestingly, as a result of numerous people experiencing catastrophic pedal failure, thor actually complains about that forum being uncensored - "lol thats the problem with the Interweb and unmoderated ( no censorship ) forums." whereas, here on bike forums he is complaining about being censored when trying to sell his wares.

http://www.ternbicycles.com/forum/my...al-has-snapped

http://www.ternbicycles.com/us/forum/folding-pedal-issue
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Old 11-19-13, 12:02 AM   #13
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Ok smallwheeler .. Now I have to bust in. I never said that the owners were using the pedals wrongly. Steve has a theory about foot placement, which I don NOT agree on. There is somewhere an official word from Tern about these pedals, which basically says that if you don't like them you can give them to your dealer and get different ones for free... Still I want to find out, why the same pedals which are used by many many other manufacturers including Dahon, obviously showing a higher failure rate on Terns than on any other bike.

Where do I complain about The Tern forum being uncensored ? The Tern forum allows every post, every picture of a broken part, every critique you want to write. Same as the old Dahon forum. I would not participate on a manufacturer owned forum if it would be censored. Somehow you clearly must have misunderstood me. Its the opposite what you write. Or did you quote me completely out of context ?

I also did not think that the folks who have broken a pedal are idiots and I did not say that. You are throwing stuff out there which is pretty hard core stuff.

while I am here .. Ekdog. Thanks for the links, as they clearly state that I helped Steely Dan to a new frame, even after the warranty was over and he got the official no, before I send him a new frame and fork. Not bad customer service for somebody who bought the bikes somewhere else, wouldn't you agree ?

Helping my friends on bikeforums with free parts, solve problems their own dealers couldn't handle, etc etc ...I thought that service through bikeforums would allow me a little wiggle room and push some info at times, which eventually leads to a sale once in a while. I must have thought wrongly. Yes if I ship stuff out of the country I need the freight paid, and for example to Spain its very expensive, I cannot pay that out of my pocket.

Its not whining, I spent a lot of time here. Much more time than dealers who sell ten times as much as I do.

So what happens if somebody ask for a spare wheel or sparepart he cannot find elsewhere ? I cannot say that I have in in stock ? Just because I am a dealer, who spends thousands of dollars to have said spare part, versus the majority of dealers who are happy to sell a bike but don't care about the customer down the road ?

again I thought that I had a little wiggle room at times, but it seems that's not the case

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Last edited by brakemeister; 11-19-13 at 12:13 AM.
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Old 11-19-13, 12:14 AM   #14
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again I thought that I had a little wiggle room at times, but it seems that's not the case
you have plenty of wiggle room here, dear friend. everybody here enjoys your comments and contributions.

i have also had comments deleted by mods. don't take it too personally.

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So what happens if somebody ask for a spare wheel or sparepart he cannot find elsewhere ? I cannot say that I have in in stock ?
maybe its better to PM the person requesting parts?

Last edited by smallwheeler; 11-19-13 at 12:21 AM.
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Old 11-19-13, 01:03 AM   #15
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I happen to like brakemeister's posts. While I don't own a Dahon, his posts are generally interesting and informative. He is also far less pushy than a certain someone who remains nameless immediately asking me where I lived when I expressed interest in a bike.
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Old 11-19-13, 01:15 AM   #16
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I happen to like brakemeister's posts. While I don't own a Dahon, his posts are generally interesting and informative. He is also far less pushy than a certain someone who remains nameless immediately asking me where I lived when I expressed interest in a bike.
Where are you located?

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Old 11-19-13, 01:30 AM   #17
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Hmmm...I was slowly scrolling my way down the thread, reading the posts and thinking to myself "It's about time for one of those cat pictures" when I came upon the short vid of Big Red enjoying the latest issue of Sensible Chuckle.

As for Thor, I say let him stay - he is not the most egregious violator of the solicitation clause, though I'll grant he is a rabid defender of his product. Just to be clear Thor, I'm a fan.

Also, I'm glad that I read those linked threads - I'll be sure to look for a "stomp" label on my pedals.
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Old 11-19-13, 02:45 AM   #18
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Yes if I ship stuff out of the country I need the freight paid, and for example to Spain its very expensive, I cannot pay that out of my pocket.
Although I don't want to see you banned, let me make something perfectly clear: I wouldn't do business with you if your shop were across the street. The way you automatically place the blame on the owner for any problem that arises on a Dahon or Tern is unethical.
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Old 11-19-13, 02:51 AM   #19
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"Standing behind" products and whitewashing them are two different things. I--and I'm not the only one--have had legitimate complaints about Dahon's products and service and he's flown into a rage and become insulting whenever I've dared come out and air my views.

Here's a classic example of his intransigence: http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...dahon%2C+ekdog

Well, this is from 2008.... more than 5 years ago - anything since ? The thing with the internet is stuff lasts forever, in the real world people will have moved on.

I am not committed to Dahon, but the free advice and wisdom Thor hands out are worth their weight in gold. Would we like each other if we met ? Who knows, and I don't really mind. Declarations of interest are good, but the inside info we get from Thor is really interesting.
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Old 11-19-13, 02:58 AM   #20
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Well, this is from 2008.... more than 5 years ago - anything since ? The thing with the internet is stuff lasts forever, in the real world people will have moved on.

I am not committed to Dahon, but the free advice and wisdom Thor hands out are worth their weight in gold. Would we like each other if we met ? Who knows, and I don't really mind. Declarations of interest are good, but the inside info we get from Thor is really interesting.
He asked for opinions about the warnings from the mods, and he's getting them.

I tend not to forget when I have a problem with a product I've purchased and someone who represents the company comes along and blames me instead of trying to help. Disgruntled customers have long memories.
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Old 11-19-13, 03:02 AM   #21
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Well, this is from 2008.... more than 5 years ago - anything since ? The thing with the internet is stuff lasts forever, in the real world people will have moved on.

I am not committed to Dahon, but the free advice and wisdom Thor hands out are worth their weight in gold. Would we like each other if we met ? Who knows, and I don't really mind. Declarations of interest are good, but the inside info we get from Thor is really interesting.
and Hank is really helpful too, so thanks Hank. I think there is a fine line here. I live in an area well populated with LBS's and a number sell folders. But they do so while looking down their noses at you, and really, not least through reading these forums, I know more about the product often than the guy trying to sell.

Maybe other people are luckier than me. When it comes to the 2008 argument, it seems to me that it is accepted that Dahon has problems with parts (although when there was a grommet missing from my DH hammerhead I got new, it arrived the next day at the LBS, thanks to Mark Bickerton, now with Tern, and these forums). So one reason I come here is the expertise. The other is that I meet people from all walks of life I wouldn't otherwise, for whom the values of peace love and understanding are evidence in their joint commitment to small wheels and the fold. Most of the time, anyway

However, if you have the good fortune in most respects to live in Seville (I am really enjoying the Inspector Falcon books set there at the moment, highly recommended) and are ordering your stuff from a guy Olney Illinois, then it seems to me the problem is with the manufacturer and distributor rather than the guy in the US. Who for all I know may be a grumpy old man, but then aint we all.
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Old 11-19-13, 04:48 AM   #22
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I personally don't want to see Thor leave. I've learned a lot from his posts. When I have posted on numerous occasions about finding a bike for my wife, Thor never once jumped in to try and push his products for a sale, and when I was having problems with my heart, Thor sent me a PM asking how I am doing.

Thor, you are a person of high integrity. Stay where you are please!!

Cheers
Wayne
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Old 11-19-13, 05:35 AM   #23
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However, if you have the good fortune in most respects to live in Seville (I am really enjoying the Inspector Falcon books set there at the moment, highly recommended) and are ordering your stuff from a guy Olney Illinois, then it seems to me the problem is with the manufacturer and distributor rather than the guy in the US. Who for all I know may be a grumpy old man, but then aint we all.
I never ordered anything from Illinois for my Dahon. I did everything through my local Dahon dealer, and it took months for them to send parts down from their distributor in Vitoria, Spain. Getting a bolt required months of emails, telephone calls and photographs of the part. Anyway, I've got a Brompton now, so those days are behind me.

I didn't know about those Inspector Falcon books. I think I'll read one. Thanks for the tip.
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Old 11-19-13, 06:09 AM   #24
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Most forums have a TOS/TOU that you agree to when you sign up for the forum. In many cases commercial members are held to a higher standard than the general populace. I moderate on a very large forum and we have about 2% of the people that "don't get it". FWIW on that one questioning moderators' decisions in public can get you banned. People quite often forget that forums are privately owned and the owner sets the rules. Also the moderation staff is typically all volunteer and they are human.

In this case I would inquire as to what the exact issue is. On the forum I moderate it takes a staff consensus prior to any real action. There are a few notable exceptions where an individual moderator can pull an offending post, but then it is followed up by a team effort. From what I have seen here on BF a similar system is used.

I have purchased parts from Thor and he has been helpful on the newer Dahon's. IMHO Dahon itself is quite often the problem.

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Old 11-19-13, 09:17 AM   #25
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Where are you located?

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Norman, Oklahoma USA
Yes, that would be me. This is a worldwide forum. When someone posts a question, the best answer/explanation often depends on the poster's location. Thus, I believe it is helpful to know the poster's location, and the forum member's profile can provide this information. Maybe the member's location should be required, and the moderators could enforce clear and meaningful location descriptions.

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