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Old 05-05-05, 03:09 PM   #1
anniehall
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My neighbor's pit bull

The reason I am posting this is because I have been doing endless research on how to protect myself, my family and my dogs from our neighbor's pit bull. I googled Halt spray and I found this forum.

My neighbor's behind us have a pit bull. I have never really noticed the dog before until the other night when my dogs were out back barking madly. I looked up and that dog's head and front paws were hanging over the 6ft privacy fence. I scrambled to get my dogs in my house and not even 30secs later a 50lb pit bull was in my back yard. A massive dog!

I flagged down one of the dog's owners to come and get him. I told him that his dog can never be in my backyard- ever. I tried to stress the importance of this, but he really didn't listen or seem to care.

Last night I took my dogs out and within a minute the pit bull was hitting the fence and I could see his head bobbing up and down- my neighbors were sitting at their dining room table watching out the widow and they did nothing. I am terrified- animal control told me that something has to transpire before they can really do anything. My husband is away on business (at least for a couple months) and I am truly terrified. Does this product really work?
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Old 05-05-05, 03:24 PM   #2
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Probably...some dumbass at the local high school decided to run through the halls spraying a similar product, the whole school had to be evacuated and 10 people went to the hospital due to breathing problems caused by the spray. So if it can effect humans that much then it can probably drive a dog away easily.
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Old 05-05-05, 03:38 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anniehall
but he really didn't listen or seem to care.
Every time the dog barks - call animal control.
Every time it leaves its yard or tries to - call animal control.
Call animal control and suggest that the dog may be vicious - even if it isn't.
Call the police and make a similar complaint about once per month to keep it fresh on their record.
Check with a local magistrate about a restraining order.
Take photographs of the dog in order to have a record. Take photos of any damage it does. Take photos when you see it loose or otherwise misbehaving.
Arm yourself somehow. If the dog does indeed turn vicious and attacks you will not be able to stop it with your hands.
At some point you may well have to take legal action against the owner. Be prepared.
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Old 05-05-05, 03:51 PM   #4
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anniehall, I can sympathize with your situation.

My neighbors had a pit bull that progressively wreaked my fence. HIs name was Killer. Every time I went outside, that thing would throw itself against the fence to try and get to me. My neighbors wouldn't fix the fence, animal control and police said they could do nothing. At least my neighbors - when I told them - would keep the animal inside while I fixed the fence myself. How considerate...

I told my kids if that thing ever looked like it was going to get through the fence to get into the pool asap. If the dog followed you in...well...who's the better swimmer? Wait for at least three big bubbles.

Now if that dog is only 50#, there's no way it could be hanging over a 6' fence unless there's steps on the other side. You have a very valid complaint that the pit bull's owners are not taking proper steps to keep the dog in the yard.

If that dog gets into your yard again, call the police right away. Let your neighbors twist in the wind.

I don't understand why people keep animals like that. I may be overgeneralizing, and I may get flamed for it, but the behavior you describe seems to be typical of pit bull owners I have run across.
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Old 05-05-05, 03:56 PM   #5
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I have owned pitbulls they could easy climb a six foot fence if so motivated. If this dog acts like you described the owners have trained it to be that way, they are not inherently aggresive. Check your local leash laws, if the animal is required to be on a leash or in a fenced area, try and get it to come over the fence and call animal control.
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Old 05-05-05, 04:04 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madbiker555
Probably...some dumbass at the local high school decided to run through the halls spraying a similar product, the whole school had to be evacuated and 10 people went to the hospital due to breathing problems caused by the spray. So if it can effect humans that much then it can probably drive a dog away easily.
Cool =then it will work on the jerk dog owner, after all, that's who deserves the spray down.
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Old 05-05-05, 04:06 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eubi
I may be overgeneralizing, and I may get flamed for it, but the behavior you describe seems to be typical of pit bull owners I have run across.
That's a pretty accurate generalization about the "owners" (guardians) of pitbulls, and the main reason that the breed has such a bad rap.

They are inherently a very strong breed, so insecure humans want them to make themselves look tougher and more intimidating. These are the people who promote viscious behavior in the breed, and are irresponsible dog guardians like your neighbor.

But the pitbull breed can also be extremely sweet and effectionate given the proper adult parenting. Two of the sweetest dogs I've ever met (and I'm always around dogs) have been pitbulls with responsible human parents.

I'm just pointing this out because people need to realize that the issue is infact with the type of people who usually choose to adopt pitbulls, not the evil nature of the breed.
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Old 05-05-05, 04:11 PM   #8
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You are right on the money gonesh9. They can be very good pets but do need specialized training and care.

I'm not up for that kind of maintenence on a pet. My golden lab will do just fine for me.
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Old 05-05-05, 04:41 PM   #9
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As much as I hate to agree with Merton, he's on the right track. Check your local laws about firearms discharge in the city and all that, but I suspect to protect yourself, you're OK. Then go outside with the shotgun or rifle when the neighbor's dog is doing his thing. MAKE SURE THE NEIGHBORS SEE THE GUN!! Once he gets in your yard and is coming at you, take aim and take him down.

Now, I don't say this lightly, being a dog owner and lover. But that dog does sound dangerous and I wouldn't hesitate to do that to a dog to protect my own dogs (though my hundred pound shepherd can do a pretty good job of that himself) or especially kids.

I suspect if your neighbors see a shotgun up against your shoulder, leveled towards their dog, they just might do something.

You also might put some barbed or constantino wire at the top of the fence, on your side. It'll only take once or twice before the dog learns his lesson and stops trying to jump over that fence. Charging it and tearing it up are another story and then you're back to the shotgun for when he gets through.

You can try the pepper sprays, but if a dog is gung ho enough, he can ignore it unless it is really powerful. Same thing for an electric fence/collar.

Also, document every incident. Video, pictures and calls to the police and dog catcher. Write letters to the mayor, too. And, if you could find out who insures your neighbors house, call them - they'll drop the insurance coverage for an agressive dog. Some companies will do it simply for the breed; my mom's company learned she had a German Shepherd in the house and sent her a cancellation notice. That might make them do something about the dog.

Good luck. People who encourage or don't prevent their dogs from acting like that really get me wound up!
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Old 05-05-05, 04:46 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anniehall
The reason I am posting this is because I have been doing endless research on how to protect myself, my family and my dogs from our neighbor's pit bull. I googled Halt spray and I found this forum. <snip>

I am terrified- animal control told me that something has to transpire before they can really do anything. My husband is away on business (at least for a couple months) and I am truly terrified. Does this product really work?

I think it's unfortunate that you feel terrified, and don't feel safe in your own backyard.
Halt could be an effective product if purchasing it makes you feel less terrified.
- But you need a better solution to this problem.

I completely agree with the other responses about the importance of involving the authorities.
(If you had a video of the scene you described, I bet somebody would do something...)

I also think it's pathetic that animal control told you 'something had to transpire' before they could act.
Surely they don't have to wait for blood to flow. From what you described, something actually did transpire
when your neighbor's dog scaled your fence and threatened you and your pets with aggressive behavior.
With hindsight, you probably should have called the police with the dog still in your backyard.



Quote:
Originally Posted by skiahh
<snip> And, if you could find out who insures your neighbors house, call them - they'll drop the insurance coverage for an agressive dog. Some companies will do it simply for the breed; my mom's company learned she had a German Shepherd in the house and sent her a cancellation notice. <snip>
Interesting!

Last edited by * jack *; 05-06-05 at 04:53 PM.
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Old 05-05-05, 05:55 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skiahh
And, if you could find out who insures your neighbors house, call them - they'll drop the insurance coverage for an agressive dog. Some companies will do it simply for the breed; my mom's company learned she had a German Shepherd in the house and sent her a cancellation notice. That might make them do something about the dog.
All good advice, until that suggestion.

Let's say the insurer is notified, and drops coverage. So when the dog keeper's insurance is cancelled, and they can't obtain replacement coverage, then an injured person (you, your children, any neighbor, or any child innocently walking on the sidewalk, or their neighborhood pet) finds that while they can sue, they won't recover for their injuries because of lack of insurance, how is that going to help? In Florida (as an example) collecting on the judgment might be very difficult because homesteads can be completely exempt along with retirement assets (one reason why it's a popular retirement state).

So, best to keep up the complaints, and document the complaints along with violations. Record events by videotape if possible (including the owner's nonchalant response to the demand that the animal be kept under proper control and restraint). I think you may have the right to set out poison in your own yard--post warning signs, and send a written notice to the dog owner--and would not be responsible if the dog owner decides not to restrain the animal known to have uncontrolled yearnings for liberty. Some localities have leash laws, some have prohibitions against certain breeds, some have prohibitions against animals that have a proven history of unprovoked aggression (so it may be a bad idea to encourage the dog to jump the fence again). Counties and/or states may have (such as Illinois) laws prohibiting unrestrained animals; here, each county sheriff is charged with enforcement and/or confiscation of loose animals with the discretion to destroy uncontrollable animals (whether viscious or not). Probably proof of vaccination can be demanded.

There are more ways to apply public pressure. If you're seriously motivated and creative, consider circulating neighborhood petitions, group letters to the editor (enclose evidence of requests to the owner, and any photo or video evidence of lack of restraint), group letters to the local governing bodies, requests for time to speak at local government meetings, filing complaints with local authorities who have jurisidction but otherwise prefer not to take action unless forced to (e.g. police), group petitions to state representatives and member of Congress.

Also, you can identify groups nationwide who have collected materials regarding attacks by dogs, and also probably know whom best to contact in your area. Perhaps model your efforts on campaigns to identify and remove sex offenders from children in the neighborhood.
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Old 05-05-05, 06:37 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seamless
All good advice, until that suggestion.

Let's say the insurer is notified, and drops coverage. So when the dog keeper's insurance is cancelled, and they can't obtain replacement coverage, then an injured person (you, your children, any neighbor, or any child innocently walking on the sidewalk, or their neighborhood pet) finds that while they can sue, they won't recover for their injuries because of lack of insurance, how is that going to help? In Florida (as an example) collecting on the judgment might be very difficult because homesteads can be completely exempt along with retirement assets (one reason why it's a popular retirement state).
The point being that - assuming they don't own their house outright - they'll HAVE to have insurance. That means they'll have to give up the dog. Not go uninsured. If they get a notice of cancellation, then so will their bank. Then they'll have to pay that outrageous bank imposed insurance for property damage only. I suppose it's possible they could pay that and have no liability in that case, but I think that's pretty unlikely in this day and age. Also, I think in your own yard, your insurance would cover anything that theirs wouldn't.

Oh, and one other reason for making sure you document the dog's behavior. If the dog does ultimately attack someone, you can then turn over your videos, pictures, letters and log of complaints to the cops so they can be held criminally liable for not training their dog. Also, you might have a case against the town for not taking any action.
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Old 05-05-05, 07:19 PM   #13
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Annie,

First, are you sure it's a pit bull? There are other dogs that look similar and most "pit bull" attacks are not by pit bulls. This breed has gotten a bad rap because of our sensationalist news media. I've spent my life around dogs and while I've been bitten by many I've never been bitten by a pit bull. The breed a dog is doesn't mean much, the one year old daughter of a coworker just had her face severely bitten by their lab. Most dog attacks are by mutts, not pitbulls.

How long have you lived there? Did the neighbors just move in or just get the dog? Is it a male or female?Since your two dogs were barking madly maybe your neghbor is worried about their dog and their safety.

It really sounds to me like either the dog wants to come over and play with your dogs or maybe feels that they are a threat to his home. I strongly suggest going over for a friendly visit with your neighbor. Maybe bake some cookies or a pie to bring over. Meet them and their dog - he and they probably aren't the monsters you are fearing. Either way once the dog meets you in his home you won't be as much of a stranger to him or to your neighbors. It really is just common sense and common decency to make every effort to work this out in a friendly and neighborly manner.
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Old 05-05-05, 07:28 PM   #14
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hmm phinney has a very very valid and good point.

ehhh screw it who has the shotgun?


IM just kidding, I really like that idea, if they give you the cold shoulder or something to that extent then start putting some effort into it.
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Old 05-06-05, 12:50 AM   #15
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Thesis:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seamless
I think you may have the right to set out poison in your own yard--post warning signs, and send a written notice to the dog owner--and would not be responsible if the dog owner decides not to restrain the animal known to have uncontrolled yearnings for liberty.
and
Quote:
Originally Posted by MERTON
heh.. that gave me a great idea... go to the drug store and get a whole bunch off alaksetzer. put it all in a bowl of water. the see if the dog will drink it... man...
Antithesis:
Quote:
Originally Posted by phinney
I strongly suggest going over for a friendly visit with your neighbor. Maybe bake some cookies or a pie to bring over. Meet them and their dog ... It really is just common sense and common decency to make every effort to work this out in a friendly and neighborly manner.
Hmm. I just wonder if there isn't any possible way to synthesize these diametrically-opposed approaches... what to do, what to do?
Say, dogs like homemade cookies, right?
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Old 05-06-05, 03:12 AM   #16
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very sorry to hear about your situation. i've had to live near a dog/owner situation like yours. i couldn't convince the owner to train, restrain, or even walk her dog. she kept it penned in the yard 24/7 all year long. the dog has never been outside to my knowledge. no amount of complaint to the police or animal control produced any real results.

i've seen big german shepards clear a 6' fence and i've seen a 20lb african terrier/pointer pounce right over a 10 foot fence.

i'm afraid skiahh's suggestion about barbed wire thing is the bestsolution for you.

you can complain and document each incidence and befriend the owner, but in the meantime your children may still be in danger

i love dogs, i just have problem with some of the owners
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Old 05-06-05, 04:10 AM   #17
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Yeah, let's be blunt about it.

Kidnap a baby from its pram at the supermarket. Put it out in the backyard. Dog comes over fence and molests or kills kid. Dog is put down by authorities.

You get done for kidnapping, but plead temporary insanity for undue duress caused by the dog's invasion of your property, and get a suspended 12-month jail sentence (light sentences for death and mutilation work for motor vehicle drivers, so why not you?).

Anyway, there will be huge controversy about the case, there will be a montrous outpouring of owners pleading the innocence of pitbulls. And eventually the government will ban the dogs.

It's a long, convoluted process, and leaves you open to excessive defence lawyer costs.

Or just dose up a big piece of juicy steak with some sort of off-the-shelf poison, leave it in the yard, induce the dog over the fence, remove the body to some remote burial site, and sympathise with the neighbours about their loss. Simple and cheap, really.

Here in Australia, the New South Wales government has just totally banned the keeping, breeding, trading, giving away or dealing in any way with pitbulls and their variants. Owners currently with those dogs MUST have them desexed. It comes after a series of incidents in which people, most children, have been attacked by the dogs. The history goes back to elderly people on their own properties being killed by attacks by these dogs.

Frankly, if this is a real risk to you, you might have to consider moving house. It's the way with dog owners -- they couldn't give a damn about anyone else but themselves and their f*****g dogs. Just ask a cyclist.
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Old 05-06-05, 04:40 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MERTON
heh.. that gave me a great idea... go to the drug store and get a whole bunch off alaksetzer. put it all in a bowl of water. the see if the dog will drink it... man...

Nah, chocolate ExLax... by the handfull!
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Old 05-06-05, 04:59 AM   #19
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Pitbulls were bread for one thing and that is fighting. Dogs fight in a "pit" thus the name pitbull they have a lockjaw death grip once they get a hold on something, they can't help it.

Wolves have all the steps dogs usually only have a few depending on what they were bread for. The steps are: search, spot, stalk, chase, take down, kill, eat.

All dogs have their own personality which determines what the dog chooses to apply those steps to and the aggresivness.(training as to what they search spot chase and kill in other words, athough aggesivness is easy to add and hard to remove)

Heard dogs for example have the chase instinct but not the take down or kill steps.
Pointers have the search and spot but not the stalk step.
Pit bulls have the kill bite which is good for pit fighting(you cant pry those beefy jaws apart it's nuts)
Retrevors do not have the kill or eat steps because you don't want the game bird squished or ate.

BTW dogs were originally bread for function not fashion and it is the function that gives a breed its look. Its a hormone thing, they all carry the genes of wolves, the hormones give the dogs their look and instincts you can't really have one without the other. This is according to dog-olygists who study genes and so on, Not dumbass breaders and dogshow judges(who have created usless sickly totally inbread strains from what were once very strong usefull breads by judging on looks and family tree, rather than performance. Collies come to mind, once they were Lassy, now their sculls are so narrow there brains don't have enough room, due to arbitrary AKC guidlines. Purebred means inbred anymore.)

Wow, I totally didn't answer the question.
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Old 05-06-05, 06:26 AM   #20
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I have two words for you: Electric fence
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Old 05-06-05, 07:11 AM   #21
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A neighbour of mine, who is a real peasant, suggested a can of this ....................
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Old 05-06-05, 07:15 AM   #22
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...........and some of this mixed together will solve the problem! With any luck your neighbour will then get a sensible dog.

Try baby or toddler flavour dog food if you can find it - seems to attract Pitbulls and Rottweillers better than other flavours.
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Old 05-06-05, 07:21 AM   #23
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I am absolutely sure it is a pit bull- the owners even said so themselves. He is a male and he is not neutered. My heart truly goes out to the dog- they don't pet him, interact with him, or even bring him in during extreme weather. Long ago I called animal control because I was worried about him. Of course they said the couldn't do anything.

And you are right, maybe he just wants some attention, but I can't risk the safety of my little girls or myself. We all know any dog can turn on you- but if this one did he would do some serious damage. He is huge- my other neighbor said he has never seen one quite that big. All I want is for the owner's to take responsibility and ensure that he can't get out.... they could give a crap less.

In fact, a police officer from a different district told my dad that if we shot it - we would not face any penalties as long as it was on my property. Kind of a crazy solution to this huge disaster- sitting on the back porch with a loaded shotgun waiting to shoot a pit bull.

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Old 05-06-05, 08:11 AM   #24
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My mother-inlaw had a very agressive chow. Halt did not work on him, he didn't seem to notice it at all. The dog had a bad habit of biting people. I finally put him down, which as an animal lover was hard, but the only solution for an agressive dog that would randomly attack people.
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Old 05-06-05, 10:06 AM   #25
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Neighor on the left has a pitbull that is gentle and well trained, he only barks when he needs to and doesn't bother me and my family. Neighbor on the right has a German Shepard that can be excitable, but not aggressive. Us in the middle have a miniture daschhaund that will snarl and growl and chase you all over town if you let her. However, my dog was rescued and is still in obedeence school. Her mother died not too long after she was born, and was malnorished when I got her.

It's not the dog, it's the owner.
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