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  1. #1
    Cheese toThinkistoBe's Avatar
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    I feel surrounded by simple-minded imbeciles who do not have the poor luck of naturally being simple-minded imbeciles, but instead, choose to be.

    I cannot even recall a woman I have met that truly thought for herself. Does our society make women out to be meek, simple-minded, and emotion driven? Do women fall right into this niche? I know it works both ways. There are many men who fall into the one of the many niches society has created for them.

    My current situation leaves me questioning where I want to be/go.

    I have a son with the woman I live with.

    Let me take a second to describe myself, our relationship, and changes within.

    Over the course of our time together, I have gone through a lot of psychological changes, self-induced psychological changes.

    High school was indescribably odd. I had many friends. I did well in classes. I never really had any reason to complain, but there was always something... odd.

    Shortly after high school, I realized it wasn't just high school that was... odd. Large parts of our society just didn't 'click'. Why do people act the way they do? Why do people act like they want things to be better, but are obviously making things worse for themselves, others, or for everyone involved, then lying to themselves about it when questioned. Why do people feel like they have to spend all nearly all their time earning money so they can buy things that they think will bring them closer to other people (or themselves)?

    Honesty has become a huge part of my life. I question everything for the sake of betterment and happiness.

    Nearly every person I meet cannot handle honest questioning. I cannot think of a time where my intetions are negative. I would like to say that they never are, but I'm not claiming to be perfect.

    If I were to pose a simple question like "I wonder if doing _blank_ instead of doing _blank_ would be better," I would receive a highly defensive response, a change in mood, an unspoken idea that my intentions are questionable, and countless other things that confuse the hell out of me.

    I realize that most people in our society are lying, greedy, selfish people, and that causes most people to assume that everyone's intentions are as such, but I think that after a few years of living with someone you would come to trust them.

    Anyway. She wants to seperate. I can handle seperation. I can handle it if she no longer loves me. I can handle all the things that would normally cause one person to not want to be with another person.

    The thing that is really driving me crazy is her answer to my question, "Why are you not happy?"

    She is not happy, because I question things. This makes absolutely no sense to me.

    The majority of my intentions for things consist of attempts to make things better for people or to make people happy(ier).

    I dont do this by forcing my opinion on people, or by telling them what they should/shouldn't do.

    I support a live/let live philosophy. I simply offer advice or pose questions to help others see from another perspective and possibly make them or others around them happier. I am never forceful with my advice.


    I dont really know what all this is about, or really why I'm posting it. Maybe I can find some insight through someone else here in the forums.

    I dont like make-up. Its so fake looking. What is the deal with make-up.


    edit: Why do people wear underwear? Why do people do things that dont really have a purpose just because other people do them?
    Last edited by toThinkistoBe; 10-21-05 at 08:14 AM.
    "Physics makes us all its *****es."

  2. #2
    On my TARDIScycle! KingTermite's Avatar
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    With your "honest questioning", you sound more emotion driven the the women you are dissin' at the beginning of your post. Quit annoyng people with meaningless questions and go ride your bike!
    Quote Originally Posted by coffeecake View Post
    - it's pretty well established that Hitler was an *******.

  3. #3
    Theodore Roosevelt's idol TheKillerPenguin's Avatar
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    It sounds like we're a lot alike. I question things, and try to be honest and blunt so as to not lose meaning, and my girlfriend used to hate it. Made things really difficult for us for a long time (seriously like a year). She got all depressed because she thought I hated her, because I kept questioning, and because I was honest. I tend to be logical, and she tends to run on emotion, and as a result it really nearly cost us the relationship a few times. But, I can say after 4 years she's finally used to it, and realizes that I'm not attacking her as a person, but just trying to get her to question her motives and their validity. She also realizes now that when I say she could use some exercise it doesn't mean I think she's ugly and I hate her and want to break up with her and sleep with her worst enemy (but that one took a while). In my experience, honesty seems hard for people to accept. Most don't want to be questioned about what they do, because they're used to doing it and don't want to take the time to question why or to change. Most don't want to be told they look ugly when they ask "Do I look ugly?", so they feel that if you answer honestly and say "yes", it's an attack on them personally. It also breaks social norms when you do this kind of stuff which makes people feel even more uncomfortable.

    Yeah, I don't know where i'm going with this either. I don't have a solution to the problem, and looking back at history and how people who question are usually treated, I'm not so sure that there is one.
    Masochism is a training adaptation.

  4. #4
    Non Tribuo Anus Rodentum and off to the next adventure (RIP) Stacey's Avatar
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    Questioning is a good thing... to a point. It's when one questions just for the sake of questioning, akin to being argumentative, this creates a problem for others.

    IE: Why did you bake the chicken and not fry it. Why do you put the TP roll on so it comes over the top, not down the back. Get my drift.

    I believe in healthy skepticisim & cynicisim. I don't catagoricially believe everything everyone tells me. "They" have their motives and agendas to promote and one needs to objectively disect the infromation to expose the root of whats being said.

    How critical is your analisys?

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    Cheese toThinkistoBe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingTermite
    With your "honest questioning", you sound more emotion driven the the women you are dissin' at the beginning of your post. Quit annoyng people with meaningless questions and go ride your bike!
    I'm not 'dissin' anyone.

    What makes you say, "you sound more emotion driven the the women"?

    Why do you think my questions are meaningless?

    I'm currently in the market for a bike, actually. Been watching ebay pretty closely. I would LOVE to go ride my bike
    "Physics makes us all its *****es."

  6. #6
    On my TARDIScycle! KingTermite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toThinkistoBe
    I'm not 'dissin' anyone.

    What makes you say, "you sound more emotion driven the the women"?

    Why do you think my questions are meaningless?

    I'm currently in the market for a bike, actually. Been watching ebay pretty closely. I would LOVE to go ride my bike
    You just sound a lot like an ex-girlfriend I had who was the most emotionally driven human I've ever seen. She also had to play 20 questions CONSTANTLY.....I mean every day might have, on average, a few HOURS worth of question answering. To me, the consant questioning thing is a sign of being emotionally driven.
    Quote Originally Posted by coffeecake View Post
    - it's pretty well established that Hitler was an *******.

  7. #7
    Non Tribuo Anus Rodentum and off to the next adventure (RIP) Stacey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingTermite
    You just sound a lot like an ex-girlfriend I had who was the most emotionally driven human I've ever seen. She also had to play 20 questions CONSTANTLY.....I mean every day might have, on average, a few HOURS worth of question answering. To me, the consant questioning thing is a sign of being emotionally driven.

    Why are you being so ugly?

    Was it something I said?

    You don't like my jeans?

    Do they make me look fat?

    You really want to be with Sally, don't you?

  8. #8
    On my TARDIScycle! KingTermite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stacey
    Why are you being so ugly?
    Was it something I said?
    You don't like my jeans?
    Do they make me look fat?
    You really want to be with Sally, don't you?
    Ooooh....if you only knew how little of the tip of the iceberg that honestly is. I can't believe it took me so long to dump the crazy nut case.

    All those and 100x worse. Imagine the hell I had to go through if traffic caused me to be 10 minutes late? OMG.....the horror!!
    Quote Originally Posted by coffeecake View Post
    - it's pretty well established that Hitler was an *******.

  9. #9
    Cheese toThinkistoBe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PenguinDeD
    But, I can say after 4 years she's finally used to it, and realizes that I'm not attacking her as a person, but just trying to get her to question her motives and their validity.
    We have been together for about 4 years and that would be a huge leap in our communication. Any pointers?

    Quote Originally Posted by PenguinDeD
    It also breaks social norms when you do this kind of stuff which makes people feel even more uncomfortable.
    This is the part I'm worried about. Doesn't it bother anyone else that the social norm is to not question things? to just accept things for how they are?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stacey
    It's when one questions just for the sake of questioning, akin to being argumentative, this creates a problem for others.
    I dont understand why it creates a problem sometimes, but other times its seen as a good thing (or even romantic).

    If I have shown that you can trust my honesty. Out of everything I say, why would you (anyone) disbelieve me when I say my intentions are for 'your' happiness?

    Whether I like it or not, my mind is always questioning things. How could I come across less argumentiative? I always put a lot of thought into my wording and tone before saying anything. And often I dont say anything at all because I think it might be misinterpreted.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stacey
    How critical is your analisys?
    first thing that pops into my head:

    "I know it was my idea, but on second thought, I think it may not have been the best solution (referring to sending dylan to his room when he is doing something undesireable). I dont think we should establish a relationship based on fear. We should establish a relationship based on trust. I think sending him to his room may be more selfish than helpful."

    response is higly defensive and/or '*****y' when it wasn't even her idea in the first place.



    Also, When something I say looks misunderstood, or miscommunicated, I am very quick to explain myself and/or assure her that I'm not attempting to insult her or anything remotely similar.


    I think she thinks my questioning of her intentions for not 'being happy' are an act of desperation on my part.

    PenguinDeD,

    Did your girlfriend just ignore your questions? Often she just doesn't want to question things. She'll say something like "I dont have to think about that" to which i respond somethign like "I know, I'm not trying to force you to do anything, I'm just curious why..."



    Quote Originally Posted by KingTermite
    I mean every day might have, on average, a few HOURS worth of question answering.
    1. I dont do that.

    2. Questioning directly correlates with emotions?

    you'll have to better explain that one.
    "Physics makes us all its *****es."

  10. #10
    On my TARDIScycle! KingTermite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toThinkistoBe
    2. Questioning directly correlates with emotions?

    you'll have to better explain that one.
    It depends on the questions.

    "What do you want for dinner?" is not an emotionally driven question, but when the girl is leaving and you instead of just asking "why are you leaving?" you jump straight to "why are you not happy?" which sounds like the emotional version of the question. Sounds like you are about to jump into "how does this relationship make you feel?" and "Did you associate happiness with me?" and other emotional type questions.

    That crazy girlfriend I mentioned above would often ask things like "how you feel....its important for me to know how you feel?". And my standard answer "I feel annoyed to have to answer questions all the time" wasn't sufficient for some odd reason.
    Quote Originally Posted by coffeecake View Post
    - it's pretty well established that Hitler was an *******.

  11. #11
    Cheese toThinkistoBe's Avatar
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    KingTermite,

    My questions aren't like those Stacey has posted.

    Things more like.

    Why do people wear underwear?

    Why do people care so much about a tiny scratch on their car?

    Why does our society demand unattainable perfection in many ways?

    Why is a conspiracy theory automatically something only a crazy person would believe?

    Why do people believe everything they see on TV?

    Why do people choose not to think?

    Why do more bikes not have eyelets to mount racks?

    etc
    "Physics makes us all its *****es."

  12. #12
    Gravity Is Yer Friend dirtbikedude's Avatar
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    She said you ask too many questions and that is why she is not happy. Well, what type of questions are you asking? Do you ask the same questions over and over? Are you asking questions that may show her you do not trust her? There are questions of curiosity with the intent to gain knowledge and a better understanding and then there are the ones that are just asked to check up on some one, which ones are you asking?

    The majority of my intentions for things consist of attempts to make things better for people or to make people happy(ier).


    This statement makes me think you are, or at least she precieves you are, trying to change her.

    Not knowing you and your significant other means I can give no advice since I have nothing to base it on other then what you say. Have you asked any of your friends? You said you have met a few people that can be honest, why not ask them? Have you asked your significant other what questions are driving her away?

    We can give you ideas but she is the only one who can give you the real reason for the change in her.

    DBD

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    Cheese toThinkistoBe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingTermite
    It depends on the questions.

    "What do you want for dinner?" is not an emotionally driven question, but when the girl is leaving and you instead of just asking "why are you leaving?" you jump straight to "why are you not happy?" which sounds like the emotional version of the question. Sounds like you are about to jump into "how does this relationship make you feel?" and "Did you associate happiness with me?" and other emotional type questions.

    That crazy girlfriend I mentioned above would often ask things like "how you feel....its important for me to know how you feel?". And my standard answer "I feel annoyed to have to answer questions all the time" wasn't sufficient for some odd reason.
    1. Why dont you like to discuss your emotions with your girlfriend?

    2. That's not the kind of questioning i'm talking about.
    "Physics makes us all its *****es."

  14. #14
    On my TARDIScycle! KingTermite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toThinkistoBe
    KingTermite,
    My questions aren't like those Stacey has posted.
    Things more like.

    Why do people wear underwear?
    Why do people care so much about a tiny scratch on their car?
    Why does our society demand unattainable perfection in many ways?
    Why is a conspiracy theory automatically something only a crazy person would believe?
    Why do people believe everything they see on TV?
    Why do people choose not to think?
    Why do more bikes not have eyelets to mount racks?
    etc
    Well, those don't sound too emotional, but if you were constantly tirading with questions like this, it would be awfully darned annoying. Not everybody wants to spend all their free time contemplating questions that don't really have definitive answers. Sounds like you should be a philosopher if you want to contemplate these things constantly.
    Quote Originally Posted by coffeecake View Post
    - it's pretty well established that Hitler was an *******.

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    Gravity Is Yer Friend dirtbikedude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toThinkistoBe
    KingTermite,

    My questions aren't like those Stacey has posted.

    Things more like.

    Why do people wear underwear?

    Why do people care so much about a tiny scratch on their car?

    Why does our society demand unattainable perfection in many ways?

    Why is a conspiracy theory automatically something only a crazy person would believe?

    Why do people believe everything they see on TV?

    Why do people choose not to think?

    Why do more bikes not have eyelets to mount racks?

    etc

    I type slow so you posted that before I finished To many of those questions are just f***ing anoying. Now and then they are not bad but if there is a constant barrage well... try keeping them to your self for a while.

    DBD

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    is as Gurgus does. Gurgus's Avatar
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    I think these are the kinds of things that all relationships go through from time to time; I'm currently going through the same thing with my wife. Unfortunatly, these are the types of things you learn to live with or they are the straw that break the camel's back. It's ultimatly up to you and her to decide. Myself, I love my lady but I don't like some of the things we do to each other. But I'm not going to give up on us because of these things.
    I love my wife and my boys too much to split just because we get on each other nerves from time to time.

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    . Namenda's Avatar
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    If I may, I'd like to cut to the chase here...

    You say the intention of your actions is to "make people happy(ier)."

    Your actions (the constant questioning, which to some people is known as "pestering" or "harassing") is making your girlfriend UNhappy.

    The answer-Stop doing the things that are making her unhappy. My wife does this sort of thing from time to time. It is what I call "nagging". Constant, unending nagging has been the death of innumerable relationships.

  18. #18
    . Namenda's Avatar
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    And one more point-if the first line in your original post is how you really feel about most, if not all, other people, I don't blame her for leaving you.

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    Theodore Roosevelt's idol TheKillerPenguin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toThinkistoBe
    PenguinDeD,

    Did your girlfriend just ignore your questions? Often she just doesn't want to question things. She'll say something like "I dont have to think about that" to which i respond somethign like "I know, I'm not trying to force you to do anything, I'm just curious why..."
    She wouldn't so much ignore the questions, she'd respond by getting upset and defensive. She used to break out into tears though, because she was convinced that when I did that it was me trying to change her because I hated who she was. I'm not really sure how it changed. I kept reassuring her that it wasn't me hating who she was, and after a couple of thousand times hearing that she finally believed it. And, I kept asking questions. I suppose she just got used to it after a while? It's still difficult sometimes depending on the subject, but now she's willing to engage in discussions and adopt new views on things if hers are proven to be wrong. She gets more defensive and almost angry when we discuss firmly held beliefs of hers (debating drug use, porn, etc.) than when we're discussing other things. She seems to be getting better with that though.
    Masochism is a training adaptation.

  20. #20
    Cheese toThinkistoBe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtbikedude
    She said you ask too many questions and that is why she is not happy.
    Its not that I ask too many questions. Its just my quesioning period.

    Do you ask the same questions over and over?
    no.

    Are you asking questions that may show her you do not trust her?
    no

    There are questions of curiosity with the intent to gain knowledge and a better understanding and then there are the ones that are just asked to check up on some one, which ones are you asking?
    the first one.

    This statement makes me think you are, or at least she precieves you are, trying to change her.
    Somehow I failed to mentions this already. She does think that. I am not trying to change her. I have a lot of thoughts running through my head about this topic, but none are really coming together to text form. I'll try to come back to it.

    Have you asked your significant other what questions are driving her away?
    Questioning in general. Asking that question drives her away.

    We can give you ideas but she is the only one who can give you the real reason for the change in her.
    I know. I'm just trying to find other perspectives, I guess. Thanks for the input

    Quote Originally Posted by KingTermite
    Not everybody wants to spend all their free time contemplating questions that don't really have definitive answers. Sounds like you should be a philosopher if you want to contemplate these things constantly.
    I dont want to spend all my free time doing this. I want to spend some of my time doing it. Most people want to spend none of their time doing it.

    How can one go through life just accepting everything for how it is?

    Quote Originally Posted by KingTermite
    Sounds like you should be a philosopher if you want to contemplate these things constantly.
    I can't help but think about these things. Its not really a choice. I dont understand how people can choose not to think.

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtbikedude
    To many of those questions are just f***ing anoying. Now and then they are not bad but if there is a constant barrage well... try keeping them to your self for a while.
    Its certainly not a constant barrage of questions, and I do keep the majority of them to myself. But I dont understand why they are annoying.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gurgus
    I think these are the kinds of things that all relationships go through from time to time; I'm currently going through the same thing with my wife. Unfortunatly, these are the types of things you learn to live with or they are the straw that break the camel's back. It's ultimatly up to you and her to decide. Myself, I love my lady but I don't like some of the things we do to each other. But I'm not going to give up on us because of these things.
    I love my wife and my boys too much to split just because we get on each other nerves from time to time.
    I agree. I'm all about compromise. I'm all about self-sacrifice for the benefit of others. She acts like a rebelious teenager towards me but at the same time acts like she's the "responsibile" one. Like she thinks if one of us is being responsibile, the other one can't be. Its very confusing and she wont talk about any of it.

    Her solution for things she doesn't understand is not to try to understand them better, but to 'throw it away'.

    Quote Originally Posted by Namenda
    Stop doing the things that are making her unhappy. My wife does this sort of thing from time to time. It is what I call "nagging". Constant, unending nagging has been the death of innumerable relationships.
    I think you're mistaking my questioning similarly to KingTermite.
    "Physics makes us all its *****es."

  21. #21
    Overacting because I can SpongeDad's Avatar
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    Can't recall a woman who thought for herself - maybe they just didn't want to explain themselves to you.

    Being honest and questioning can be just as pretentious as the hippy pose of "not being judgmental."

    What do you not understand about the mother of your child? She wants to separate because you're annoying. She wants a little peace in her life. If your so bound up with your quest for honesty that you would rather lose this woman, then I think she's better off without you.
    “Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm." (Churchill)

    "I am a courageous cyclist." (SpongeDad)

  22. #22
    Lex
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    Quote Originally Posted by toThinkistoBe
    KingTermite,

    My questions aren't like those Stacey has posted.

    Things more like.

    Why do people wear underwear?

    Why do people care so much about a tiny scratch on their car?

    Why does our society demand unattainable perfection in many ways?

    Why is a conspiracy theory automatically something only a crazy person would believe?

    Why do people believe everything they see on TV?

    Why do people choose not to think?

    Why do more bikes not have eyelets to mount racks?

    etc

    She's probably thinking, "Why do you waste your time and energy on idle speculation."

    Life is about a balance. You are who you are and you believe what you believe but arriving at that point is a process. As a teenager you have life all figured out. This is what your future will be and this is exactly what the end of your life will look like. By your twenties, you realize that your plan is crap and will never work and you need a new plan for who you really are....but first you have the answer the question of who you really are.

    My first thought when looking at the questions is....do you really care about her answers? I'm sure you're a really nice person but how much would her input and talking it have to do with what you think? While she's living her life with her focus on the here and now.

    Just my thoughts,
    Lex

  23. #23
    Cheese toThinkistoBe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpongeDad
    Being honest and questioning can be just as pretentious as the hippy pose of "not being judgmental."
    I'm not sure what you're saying here.

    Quote Originally Posted by SpongeDad
    What do you not understand about the mother of your child?
    Quote Originally Posted by SpongeDad
    She wants to separate because you're annoying.
    Why is it annoying to question things? - that's what i dont understand.

    If your so bound up with your quest for honesty that you would rather lose this woman, then I think she's better off without you.
    You make it sound like honesty is a bad thing.
    "Physics makes us all its *****es."

  24. #24
    Lex
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpongeDad
    Can't recall a woman who thought for herself - maybe they just didn't want to explain themselves to you.

    Being honest and questioning can be just as pretentious as the hippy pose of "not being judgmental."

    What do you not understand about the mother of your child? She wants to separate because you're annoying. She wants a little peace in her life. If your so bound up with your quest for honesty that you would rather lose this woman, then I think she's better off without you.
    I do know a woman who thinks for herself - me. Does that mean I'll argue endlessly with anyone to try to change their mind....no. I'm a very bottom line person so if I argue the case and you don't buy my bottom line, I'm not going to ramble endlessly in an attempt to change your basic ideology.

    I once had dated a man who questioned endlessly. He had changed his name to "Gray" (because "Life is the shade of...") and preferred to spend endless hours lying on the couch and contemplating the meaning of life. It didn't last long. LOL

    This has been Lex's deep thought for the day. I will now go back to my vacuous contemplation of nail colors. LOL

  25. #25
    Cheese toThinkistoBe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lex
    She's probably thinking, "Why do you waste your time and energy on idle speculation."
    Its not a waste of time when I substitute watching TV with thinking, is it?


    Quote Originally Posted by Lex
    My first thought when looking at the questions is....do you really care about her answers? I'm sure you're a really nice person but how much would her input and talking it have to do with what you think? While she's living her life with her focus on the here and now.
    The quoted list of questions aren't necessarily posed to her. Just me questioning things. When I ask her questions, yes, I honestly really do care about her answers.
    "Physics makes us all its *****es."

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