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  1. #1
    '05 NUEser EJ123's Avatar
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    Whats a DS3 connection?

    On Call of Duty 2 someone said they had that, and Ive never heard of it before. They said that a 56k is 56,000 kbits/s or something while the ds3 is 450,000,000kbits/s. Dang I want that connection. I wonder if its available

  2. #2
    DEADBEEF khuon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJ123
    On Call of Duty 2 someone said they had that, and Ive never heard of it before. They said that a 56k is 56,000 kbits/s or something while the ds3 is 450,000,000kbits/s. Dang I want that connection. I wonder if its available
    A DS is an electrical digital signalling standard. All speeds are based on the digital signal of a DS0 which is 64Kbps which is the standard voice B-channel in a telco PRI. A DS1 is what carries the signal in a T-1 carrier and delivers 1.54Mbps (24 DS0s). A DS3 is 672 DS0s aggregated (timeslotted on a TDM system) and delivers 54Mbps over what is known as a T3 carrier. There are higher speeds for data communications but they are typically delivered over optical rather than copper so they're denoted by the OC (optical carrier) rating of the STM (synchronous transmission mode) in the SDH (synchronous digital hierarchy) whchy defines the signalling rates for SONET (synchronous optical network). An OC-3 (STM-1) is rated to deliver 155Mbps, STM-4 is OC-12 (622Mbps), STM-16 is OC-48 (2.4Gbps) and so on. There are also electrical equivalents (STS-3, STS-12, STS-16, etc). The biggest pipes currently deployed today use DWDM (dense wave division multiplexing - phased descrimination on a single optical transmission line) to deliver OC-768 (over 39Gbps).

    A DS3 is typically delivered using a repeater technology so it's quite an expensive circuit. Over copper, you'd be looking at $250/mo for a dry (first-mile) circuit and probably anywhere from $2,000 to $12,000 per month for a wet circuit depending on distance and provider as well as any SLAs (service level agreements) that might be attached.
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  3. #3
    riding once again jschen's Avatar
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    Okay, you piqued my curiosity. What's a "dry circuit" and a "wet circuit"?
    If you notice this notice then you will notice that this notice is not worth noticing.

  4. #4
    2-Cyl, 1/2 HP @ 90 RPM slvoid's Avatar
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  5. #5
    SERENITY NOW!!! jyossarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by khuon
    A DS is an electrical digital signalling standard. All speeds are based on the digital signal of a DS0 which is 64Kbps which is the standard voice B-channel in a telco PRI. A DS1 is what carries the signal in a T-1 carrier and delivers 1.54Mbps (24 DS0s). A DS3 is 672 DS0s aggregated (timeslotted on a TDM system) and delivers 54Mbps over what is known as a T3 carrier.
    Oh, so close Khuon. It's a 45 Mbps circuit, not 54 Mbps circuit. All the rest is right. Electrical DS3s used to have capacitance build up the further the circuits got from the C.O. so impedance coils were used to cancel it out. Nowadays, fiber is used to deliver DS3s embedded within STS-1 signals in OC-n transport signals. A mux at the customer prem is used to pull the signal off the OC-n transport circuit.
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  6. #6
    DEADBEEF khuon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jschen
    Okay, you piqued my curiosity. What's a "dry circuit" and a "wet circuit"?
    A dry or dark circuit is basically just a wire or cable with no service on it. It's not even technically connected to anything other than the carrier equipment. You can't really push a packet over it. A wet or lit circuit is connected on one end to at least a service side meaning you have something to communbicate with. For an end-user this is typically the ISP. You push and pull useful packets of data from them. The component costs for a network connection are typically/generally:

    1. Circuit - cost of the wire and physical interconnects
    2. Port (on the service provider equipment) - cost of the bandwidth you're using on the transit provider's network.
    3. Service/Transit - Cost of the type of service. In most cases, this is IP transport. There are of course other types.
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  7. #7
    2-Cyl, 1/2 HP @ 90 RPM slvoid's Avatar
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    Don't correct chuck norris just because you work at a phone company!

    Quote Originally Posted by jyossarian
    Oh, so close Kuon. It's a 45 Mbps circuit, not 54 Mbps circuit. All the rest is right. Electrical DS3s used to have capacitance build up the further the circuits got from the C.O. so impedance coils were used to cancel it out. Nowadays, fiber is used to deliver DS3s embedded within STS-1 signals in OC-n transport signals. A mux at the customer prem is used to pull the signal off the OC-n transport circuit.

  8. #8
    DEADBEEF khuon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jyossarian
    Oh, so close Kuon. It's a 45 Mbps circuit, not 54 Mbps circuit.
    You're right. I got dyslexic after typing out the speed for a T1.
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  9. #9
    SERENITY NOW!!! jyossarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by khuon
    [*]Service/Transit - Cost of the type of service. In most cases, this is IP transport. There are of course other types.[/list]
    Yeah EJ so you can get a DS3 to an ISP, but you have to choose your class of service. You can either get full bandwidth or pick a burst rate based on the statistical likelihood that your traffic pattern demands. For Call of Duty 2, I'd suggest full-rate so you have the full pipe and port available so you can kill people before they even turn on the game.
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  10. #10
    DEADBEEF khuon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jyossarian
    Nowadays, fiber is used to deliver DS3s embedded within STS-1 signals in OC-n transport signals. A mux at the customer prem is used to pull the signal off the OC-n transport circuit.
    That's not always the case. An ADM can be pretty expensive and is usually deployed in the colo. The delivery to the CPE/demarc is done however is most economical. Many times, it's still cheaper to bring it in over dry copper. Admittedly, ADM cabinets and minicabs are getting cheaper. Perhaps you are thinking about metro-agg off a fibre ring which is an entirely different story.
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  11. #11
    SERENITY NOW!!! jyossarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slvoid
    Don't correct chuck norris just because you work at a phone company!
    so i'm guessing you don't need phone service. or wireless service. or internet access. don't mess w/ the phone company dude.
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  12. #12
    SERENITY NOW!!! jyossarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by khuon
    That's not always the case. An ADM can be pretty expensive and is usually deployed in the colo. The delivery to the CPE/demarc is done however is most economical. Many times, it's still cheaper to bring it in over dry copper. Admittedly, ADM cabinets and minicabs are getting cheaper. Perhaps you are thinking about metro-agg off a fibre ring which is an entirely different story.
    You're right. Most metro business bldgs and officeparks have telco rooms and are cabled for fiber. For EJ, it'd be over whatever copper's left in the street unless he's in a new development where fiber's being deployed (like FIOS).
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  13. #13
    '05 NUEser EJ123's Avatar
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    Woah Khuon very informative answer lol. Oh so thats what it is ahah.

  14. #14
    2-Cyl, 1/2 HP @ 90 RPM slvoid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jyossarian
    so i'm guessing you don't need phone service. or wireless service. or internet access. don't mess w/ the phone company dude.
    I prefer to steal wireless from one of my 3 neighbors. Like right now I'm using this guy jyossarian's unsecured wireless connec

  15. #15
    DEADBEEF khuon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jyossarian
    For Call of Duty 2, I'd suggest full-rate so you have the full pipe and port available so you can kill people before they even turn on the game.
    Bypass the ISP and get an OC-3 direct to your opponent's house. Then crank the op-amp on the long-reach laser up and fry them before they even can reach for the controller pad. You'll need to dial it up past 400W though.

    Do not stare into fibre with remaining good eye!
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  16. #16
    '05 NUEser EJ123's Avatar
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    Haha my friend did that. But the neighbors moved lol.

  17. #17
    SERENITY NOW!!! jyossarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slvoid
    I prefer to steal wireless from one of my 3 neighbors. Like right now I'm using this guy jyossarian's unsecured wireless connec
    that's impossible. i'm stealing mine from some tard w/ a ds3.
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  18. #18
    SERENITY NOW!!! jyossarian's Avatar
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    EJ, you got a laser. Just get some fiber and point it into the fiber and pass your hand in front of it really fast to create the digital signals you need.
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  19. #19
    2-Cyl, 1/2 HP @ 90 RPM slvoid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jyossarian
    that's impossible. i'm stealing mine from some tard w/ a ds3.
    I just had my cousin cut power to some idiot playing call of duty 2. By your logic, I shouldn't even be onl

  20. #20
    DEADBEEF khuon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jyossarian
    EJ, you got a laser. Just get some fiber and point it into the fiber and pass your hand in front of it really fast to create the digital signals you need.
    I notice that I get better service when I can trace it into the form of a bat against the clouds.
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  21. #21
    SERENITY NOW!!! jyossarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slvoid
    I just had my cousin cut power to some idiot playing call of duty 2. By your logic, I shouldn't even be onl
    i guess EJ's not playing call of duty 2 anymore....

    [e] btw, ds3's delivered via 1+1 protected sonet rings can be cut and will switch to the protect path so you stay online. and adm's can have battery backups.
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  22. #22
    '05 NUEser EJ123's Avatar
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    This connection process is very confusing.

  23. #23
    2-Cyl, 1/2 HP @ 90 RPM slvoid's Avatar
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    As a side note (because I KNOW phantomcow is reading...), you can also direct a really powerful laser at a peice of metal (kinda like pounding metal on an anvil to induce surface stress features). The laser energy causes the surface to "pop" and it get slammed repeatedly really fast, like a full surface shot peening.

  24. #24
    '05 NUEser EJ123's Avatar
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    Hey you poeple need to buy COD2 so we can all play

  25. #25
    DEADBEEF khuon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jyossarian
    [e] btw, ds3's delivered via 1+1 protected sonet rings can be cut and will switch to the protect path so you stay online. and adm's can have battery backups.
    Also works if you are MPLS-FRR protected. Either way, just make sure your provider actually does diverse path on their transit links. And if you've previously purchased diverse path, make sure your provider hasn't groomed you onto common path later. Been there and felt the pain.
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