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  1. #1
    Trans-Urban Velocommando ax0n's Avatar
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    Politics, Religion, and Operating Systems (Not a P&R Discussion)

    Most forums have a few zealots on both sides of the religion and politics fences. These are generally considered to be "hot-button" or even "taboo" topics. Not because they're both matters of pure opinion, but because the only people who actually participate in such discussions are zealots whose mind will never be changed to "the other side". Thus, those discussions, if left unmitigated, degrade quickly into elaborately-worded f-yous

    Another forum I'm on has a different breed. The Operating System zealots. In this arena, you have the people who think Steve Jobs will save the world, then you have a few wild-eyed savages wearing Dellcrosoft undaroos, and finally, you have a few fanboys waving Linux flags.

    By the way, I'm posting this from FireFox on an old PC (running on OpenBSD) with a Powerbook (running OSX) sitting on a stack of 3 Sun Microsystems machines (1 running Solaris, others: OpenBSD) on my right. Good luck figuring out my stance on OSs.

    I haven't seen it here yet, but does that pretty much sum up the geek fooster atmosphere? Are OS Zealots just as stiffly opinionated as the P&R guys here?
    ax0n: Geeky and bikey
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  2. #2
    CPM M4 BananaTugger's Avatar
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    Just get Ubuntu and be happy.

  3. #3
    . botto's Avatar
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  4. #4
    Tiocfáidh ár Lá jfmckenna's Avatar
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    ^^ HA Ha LOL

    I use both and guess what? I am more marketable because of it.

  5. #5
    The quieter you become... Falkon's Avatar
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    My personal computer runs Windows XP to do everything. My laptop ran Debian. My server ran FreeBSD about a year ago, and I've switched it to Debian.
    Quote Originally Posted by TechKnowGN
    San Jose has to be the most boring place I've ever been. And I live in Ohio.

  6. #6
    My bicycle is fixed Brian Sorrell's Avatar
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    Debian.

    Never owned an MS "os" -- though I'm trapped in them where I work -- though I use cygwin to run the fun stuff off of the server that I finally convinced them to buy so that I could actually do some programming.... that's another story. That server runs RedHat, because they insisted that they purchase "support". I lobbied, unsuccessfully, against that. Oh well.

    But my all time favorite was probably BeOS. Man I loved that thing.

  7. #7
    Unique Vintage Steel cuda2k's Avatar
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    I work in a Microsoft certified house so we're all running one form of windows or another, developing C# and VB, on one generation of Visual Studio or another.

    I never did sit down and learn the Linux enviroment properly. I keep telling myself I'm going to do it. I had a SUSE box running for a while, but have since retired that machine. And I have 30gigs of unpartitioned space on my main PC at home that was intended for a dualboot setup. That never got finished after I finished installing XP Pro.

    Oh, and I dispise Java for anything but simple jsp or servelet apps, or command line.

  8. #8
    Up on the Down Side CyLowe97's Avatar
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    I'm on my Commodore 64 right now. It took me 2 hours and 12 minutes to post this reply.

  9. #9
    Chairman of the Bored catatonic's Avatar
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    Rules of life:

    1) avoid politics if at all possible
    2) Everything worth doing has politics invovled in it
    3) get over it, now
    -------- __@
    ----- _`\<,_
    ---- (*)/ (*)
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Ring Ring, Ring Ring, the bell went Ring Ring Ring.

  10. #10
    Tiocfáidh ár Lá jfmckenna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyLowe97
    I'm on my Commodore 64 right now. It took me 2 hours and 12 minutes to post this reply.

    Pffft the TRS 80 could run circles around your 64

    It only took me 1 hour and 45 minutes to post.

  11. #11
    Third World Layabout crtreedude's Avatar
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    Use DOS or die! Oops - did I type that?!

    I have coded for so many different OSs that I have lost count. They all have their strengths and weaknesses - and I really have been doing it so long that it is hard to remember what OS or Language that I am in at the time.

    When all you have is a hammer everything looks like a nail. For me, an OS is a tool. It is a good thing to pick up the right kind. The only all purpose tool I know is a hammer - which is very useful sometimes with computers - fear causes them to obey...

  12. #12
    Trans-Urban Velocommando ax0n's Avatar
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    I'll bite. I don't really care for how the whole "Linux" thing is going.

    Entities suing other entities because of it, no standardised package distribution system, too many distributions, the kernel developer clique has grown out of control, and a number of other reasons.

    I do like debian's way of doing packages, but I like Gentoo's way better -- mostly because it's how BSD does it. I loathe RPM, despite my "second wind" inspiration for Linux came from Red Hat 4.2 in 1997 or so. I was a slackware guy before that, starting in 1993.

    Anyhow, FreeBSD took me away from most of that in 1998, and I finally tried OpenBSD after buying a copy from Theo himself at DefCon 6 in Las Vegas. I shortly thereafter discovered NetBSD while looking to make my old Mac SE/30 useable for something, and I had it at DefCon 7. NetBSD on an old Mac. People thought I was lying and I'd somehow put a 386 in the case.

    Anyhow, I still know Linux and Windows - I use them at work (because I have to). But my general stance is "don't use Windows or Linux unless nothing else will work".

    Needless to say, most people in OS debate discussions write me off as a Mac zealot, but I'm not really. My license plate and my avatar say OpenBSD, so I'm probably an OpenBSD zealot with a Mac addiction problem.
    ax0n: Geeky and bikey
    My latest tip: Carrying your laptop
    My latest geeky project: Ethernet-testing cuff links

  13. #13
    Trans-Urban Velocommando ax0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Sorrell
    But my all time favorite was probably BeOS. Man I loved that thing.
    I love BeOS. You know it's back, right? http://www.zeta-os.com/cms/news.php
    ax0n: Geeky and bikey
    My latest tip: Carrying your laptop
    My latest geeky project: Ethernet-testing cuff links

  14. #14
    Banned.
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    I can see it now, 15 wild-eyed Linux terrorists flying planes into buildings.

  15. #15
    Chairman of the Bored catatonic's Avatar
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    Linux: the fact that there seems to be a "flavor of the month" pisses me off to now end....how about all working on a unified distro, and perfecting it, instead of everyone doing one thing right, but ignoing everything else?

    I think Linspire is a great idea for the home user, but I prefer RedHat....why? because it's been around for ages, and they have been improving steadily. Their only downfall is the same downfall all of linux has: a clunky-ass software install system. It's not even close to elegant or simple....the fact that the installer can't just go to sourceforge and DL/install packages that are needed is quite annoying....then you have packages that just won't compile, since it doesn't like another package you have installed......
    -------- __@
    ----- _`\<,_
    ---- (*)/ (*)
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Ring Ring, Ring Ring, the bell went Ring Ring Ring.

  16. #16
    Forum Admin lotek's Avatar
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    personally I like z/OS 1.7 that I'm currently using, although
    some of the new features of z/OS 1.8
    (particularly some of the ISPF features, and the variable length move in ALC)
    look really good.

    marty
    Sono più lento di quel che sembra.
    Odio la gente, tutti.

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  17. #17
    The Site Administrator: Currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes,please contact my assistnt admins for forum issues Tom Stormcrowe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ho hum
    I can see it now, 15 wild-eyed Linux terrorists flying planes into buildings.
    Nope, 15 terrified Windows users whose plane is hitting the building because they don't have SP2 installed!
    on light duty due to illness; please contact my assistants for forum issues. They are Siu Blue Wind, or CbadRider or the other 3 star folk. I am currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes. I am making good progress, happily.


    . “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”- Fredrick Nietzsche

    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." - Immanuel Kant

  18. #18
    Chairman of the Bored catatonic's Avatar
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    I was thinking the windows airplane hit the building because the navigation system had a blue screen
    -------- __@
    ----- _`\<,_
    ---- (*)/ (*)
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Ring Ring, Ring Ring, the bell went Ring Ring Ring.

  19. #19
    Unique Vintage Steel cuda2k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by catatonic
    I was thinking the windows airplane hit the building because the navigation system had a blue screen
    Sounds like an airbus.

  20. #20
    Senior Member dauphin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyLowe97
    I'm on my Commodore 64 right now. It took me 2 hours and 12 minutes to post this reply.

  21. #21
    The quieter you become... Falkon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by catatonic
    Linux: the fact that there seems to be a "flavor of the month" pisses me off to now end....how about all working on a unified distro, and perfecting it, instead of everyone doing one thing right, but ignoing everything else?

    I think Linspire is a great idea for the home user, but I prefer RedHat....why? because it's been around for ages, and they have been improving steadily. Their only downfall is the same downfall all of linux has: a clunky-ass software install system. It's not even close to elegant or simple....the fact that the installer can't just go to sourceforge and DL/install packages that are needed is quite annoying....then you have packages that just won't compile, since it doesn't like another package you have installed......
    This is the reason for a good package management system. There is a huge number of packages for debian, and RPMs can be converted into debian packages as well. I like FreeBSD, but when I used it, the ports databased often had to be fixed to account for variations in dependencies such as a dependency being upgraded and a package looking for *.so.2 when the new package installed *.so.3 It's weird like that. That's why I like Debian's package management.
    Quote Originally Posted by TechKnowGN
    San Jose has to be the most boring place I've ever been. And I live in Ohio.

  22. #22
    Banned wagathon's Avatar
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    Now that my HP laptop poked its eye out and swallowed its brain, I guess I'll have to consider a MacBook Pro for my next home laptop.

  23. #23
    Trans-Urban Velocommando ax0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by catatonic
    Linux: the fact that there seems to be a "flavor of the month" pisses me off to now end....how about all working on a unified distro, and perfecting it, instead of everyone doing one thing right, but ignoing everything else?

    I think Linspire is a great idea for the home user, but I prefer RedHat....why? because it's been around for ages, and they have been improving steadily. Their only downfall is the same downfall all of linux has: a clunky-ass software install system. It's not even close to elegant or simple....the fact that the installer can't just go to sourceforge and DL/install packages that are needed is quite annoying....then you have packages that just won't compile, since it doesn't like another package you have installed......
    That's why I like OpenBSD. If you can't find a binary package, just use the ports tree, and it will go hunt down all the dependency source code, install those deps, then compile the program you want. Here's a log I captured installing Audacity on OpenBSD. Notice it had to find several dependencies. The "progress bar" showed up on multiple lines, sorry about that.

    http://www.focushacks.com/temp/audacity.log


    It's as simple as "make install" (or "sudo make install" if you're paranoid like me and never use root for anything)

    The "ports" system is in all major BSD flavors, and "Portage" (emerge) for Gentoo Linux is similar.
    ax0n: Geeky and bikey
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    My latest geeky project: Ethernet-testing cuff links

  24. #24
    Senior Member Brian's Avatar
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    $15.4 million bucks! His ex-wife must be spewing!

  25. #25
    Banned
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    I think Jesus would use linux if he was alive today. He is after all, a communist.

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