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Old 02-14-07, 05:29 PM   #1
Tom Stormcrowe
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I am In PAIN and I got a Violation of lease notice!

I finally decided that the only way I was going to get out of the apartment was to violate the lease and dig out myself! That's right, it's a violation of the lease to shovel snow as a tenant! Well, I did and also got warned by security! When our lease expires, I'll be looking for a new apartment! I didn't see the clause when I signed it, it's buried in a huge lease. By the way, a question for the lawyers....is that enforceable? I mean, we'd been snowed in for a couple of days and were getting cabin fever. Not getting evicted, it was a warning, but that stinks, we've been here three years and I hate moving.

Now, as to the pain....I forgot how much you hurt after shoveling snow!
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Old 02-14-07, 05:33 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by Tom Stormcrowe
I finally decided that the only way I was going to get out of the apartment was to violate the lease and dig out myself! That's right, it's a violation of the lease to shovel snow as a tenant! Well, I did and also got warned by security! When our lease expires, I'll be looking for a new apartment! I didn't see the clause when I signed it, it's buried in a huge lease. By the way, a question for the lawyers....is that enforceable? I mean, we'd been snowed in for a couple of days and were getting cabin fever. Not getting evicted, it was a warning, but that stinks, we've been here three years and I hate moving.

Now, as to the pain....I forgot how much you hurt after shoveling snow!
Shoveling snow does hurt my back, that is why i'd rather stay indoors and watch it melt.
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Old 02-14-07, 05:36 PM   #3
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And they're not shoveling it? That's lame. What do they expect you to do?
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Old 02-14-07, 05:40 PM   #4
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that's pretty crazy, Tom.

hope your back gets to feeling better soon!
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Old 02-14-07, 05:42 PM   #5
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Well, they are, but they are overwhelmed. Not too overwhelmed for a &%$^ Security guard to hassle me though. You'd think they'd appreciate the help! One of my neighbors is over 80 and had to go to the doctor today, so I dug us out to take him because he was nervous about driving the roads, they are still pretty bad when you get off the Snow Emergency routes.
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Old 02-14-07, 05:43 PM   #6
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Ibuprofen is my friend right now, believe me!
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Old 02-14-07, 05:46 PM   #7
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What is the penalty for violating the shovel the snow clause?
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Old 02-14-07, 05:49 PM   #8
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3rd offense = eviction!
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Old 02-14-07, 06:07 PM   #9
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Tom, part of my lease agreement is that I HAVE to shovel when it snows. I live in a four unit building and share the responsibility with a neighbor to clear the East side of my building. Trouble is, I was already nursing back pain from carrying some furniture pieces to be restored yesterday, and upon commencement of today's enormous task I found out why my neighbor's car hadn't moved much in the past two weeks.

My snow moving partner is an NYC Policeman who was recently involved in a fairly serious accident in his patrol car. I gave him my best wishes for a speedy recovery and (half) jokingly asked him if he had to apply CPR anytime recently.

As for feeing the painful after effects - ooh ya. My arms are so dead I can barely type this but, then, excreta happens .
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Old 02-14-07, 06:39 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Stormcrowe
I finally decided that the only way I was going to get out of the apartment was to violate the lease and dig out myself! That's right, it's a violation of the lease to shovel snow as a tenant! Well, I did and also got warned by security! When our lease expires, I'll be looking for a new apartment! I didn't see the clause when I signed it, it's buried in a huge lease. By the way, a question for the lawyers....is that enforceable? I mean, we'd been snowed in for a couple of days and were getting cabin fever. Not getting evicted, it was a warning, but that stinks, we've been here three years and I hate moving.

Now, as to the pain....I forgot how much you hurt after shoveling snow!
Your landlord is responsible for the snow clearance within reason. If you cannot even leave due to their negligence you can break the crappy lease. Document the occurrences and take him to small claims court. No lawyer needed.
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Old 02-14-07, 06:41 PM   #11
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That is really weird. Why would they get mad at you for shoveling yourself?
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Old 02-14-07, 06:50 PM   #12
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Maybe you shouldn't have dug out, but had a little "falling accident."

That really sucks, Tom. Why don't you move here and commute?

BTW, isn't there some section in the Indiana state statutes about tenants' rights with regard to breaking a lease? Might check there.
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Old 02-14-07, 06:51 PM   #13
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wow, this is unbelievable Tom!
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Old 02-14-07, 06:57 PM   #14
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Best of luck with this. I must say it's singularly one of the dumbest things i've ever heard of. I wonder if someone has hurt/killed themselves shoveling there before, because it sounds like a cover-your-*ss clause.
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Old 02-14-07, 06:58 PM   #15
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Check with your Tenant's Council. I'm sure if things got real bad, a judge or a jury will find in your favor. It is just common sense. Especially because they won't shovel, and barring others from doing that renders the apartment unlivable.
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Old 02-14-07, 07:00 PM   #16
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Don't worry, Tom, I coming up there with my cigar smoking uncle that likes to spit. We'll lean on these guys for you!
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Old 02-14-07, 07:04 PM   #17
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Go Tom! Recover soon, because the groundhog said spring is right around the corner... and the groundhog... even if we did retaliate on him for lying, or being an idiot - just wouldn't taste very good in a stew.

Note - the above sentence makes as much sense as the clause in your lease.
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Old 02-14-07, 07:06 PM   #18
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Old 02-14-07, 07:11 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Stormcrowe
3rd offense = eviction!
I imagine since they failed to live up to their part of the contract - removing the snow - to the point where someone's health was jeapordized, the judge would probably toss em out of court with burning ears...unless, of course, the brother-in-law clause is invoked.
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Old 02-14-07, 07:15 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Stormcrowe
it's a violation of the lease to shovel snow as a tenant! ... I didn't see the clause when I signed it, it's buried in a huge lease. By the way, a question for the lawyers....is that enforceable? I mean, we'd been snowed in for a couple of days and were getting cabin fever.
Not legal advice, as I'm not admitted in your state.

One reasonably would expect that if you're not allowed to dig yourself out, then unless your rent is furnished by the government (i.e., incarceration or tracking ankle band) the landlord has a corresponding obligation to make sure that you are able to get out within a reasonable period of time after snow. If the landlord fails their part of the bargain, thereby imprisoning you inside, then they have no valid basis to protest the necessity for your self-help. One exception might be if they would reimburse you if you were forced to call a professional snow removal service to get you out.

Hard to believe a court would allow them to force you to choose between imprisonment or risking injuries.
You may be covered by legislation (city, county, state) that prohibits various unreasonable lease restrictions.

A possible issue is enforceability of a clause buried in a long document for a consumer transaction. Sometimes courts hold those ineffective as not printed sufficiently prominent; and sometimes they're invalidated as unconscionable resulting from a lack of bargaining power (especially for a preprinted form supplied by the landlord).

To help protect yourself, it might help to take photos of the before/after conditions, and note snowfall dates/times, amounts, temps involved, and your calls to management to complain about being trapped inside, the purpose of your needing to escape (e.g., going to work; to buy groceries) how long management took to respond to you complaints, and how long it takes the snow removal company to get around to all of the walks and parking areas once they start work (they may not employ sufficient number of workers or have proper equipment, which shouldn't be held against you).

If they are such bozos about this, wonder why you don't have a tenants' association in place already.
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Old 02-14-07, 07:15 PM   #21
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Snow Job Apartments
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Old 02-14-07, 07:16 PM   #22
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Yeah, what Chip said. Its a safety issue. Landlords have been known to write stuff into leases that actually violates the law.

By the way...I just got done snow blowing, I would love someone else to do it for me!
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Old 02-14-07, 07:17 PM   #23
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I actually like shoveling snow.
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Old 02-14-07, 07:20 PM   #24
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Shoulda gave the rent a cop the shovel and told him to make himself useful.
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Old 02-14-07, 07:20 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Ritehsedad
Yeah, what Chip said. Its a safety issue. Landlords have been known to write stuff into leases that actually violates the law.

By the way...I just got done snow blowing, I would love someone else to do it for me!
Frost bit on the lips?
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