Advertise on Bikeforums.net



User Tag List

View Poll Results: Is this a good idea in your mind?

Voters
8. You may not vote on this poll
  • yes

    8 100.00%
  • no

    0 0%
Results 1 to 19 of 19
  1. #1
    The Site Administrator: Currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes,please contact my assistnt admins for forum issues Tom Stormcrowe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    South Florida
    My Bikes
    Techna Wheelchair and a Sun EZ 3 Recumbent Trike
    Posts
    15,958
    Mentioned
    9 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)

    Need some Foopinions

    I have a paper for AMHist154. The subject I've chosen is a secondary analysis of Edward Bellamy's Looking Back, 2000-1887, which is a fictional work published in 1888. Bellamy was an advocate of Central Planning and a Marxist/Socialist economic model, from a Utopian's viewpoint. I thought it would be an interesting analysis of what he got right, what he got wrong and how his book, which was a best seller in his day affected US political and urban development.

    Now, your opinions: What ya think?
    on light duty due to illness; please contact my assistants for forum issues. They are Siu Blue Wind, or CbadRider or the other 3 star folk. I am currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes. I am making good progress, happily.


    . “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”- Fredrick Nietzsche

    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." - Immanuel Kant

  2. #2
    On my TARDIScycle! KingTermite's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Eastside Seattlite Termite Mound
    My Bikes
    Trek 520, Trek Navigator 300, Peugeot Versailles PE10DE
    Posts
    3,928
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    If its OK with the prof, it sounds fun. If you are on that same vein, you may want to read (quick read) "Anthem" by Ayn Rand as well. You may even want to throw it in to the mix. She also portrays a futuristic pure Utopian/Marxist society, but just as a fictional story, not a fictional history.
    Quote Originally Posted by coffeecake View Post
    - it's pretty well established that Hitler was an *******.

  3. #3
    Senior Member ModoVincere's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    1,626
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by KingTermite View Post
    If its OK with the prof, it sounds fun. If you are on that same vein, you may want to read (quick read) "Anthem" by Ayn Rand as well. You may even want to throw it in to the mix. She also portrays a futuristic pure Utopian/Marxist society, but just as a fictional story, not a fictional history.
    Not sure I would call it a "utopian" society Ayn Rand portrayed in Anthem.

    As to OP's question, I think it would be a lot of work, but fun to do also. I would vote yes.
    1 bronze, 0 silver, 1 gold

  4. #4
    ****** squegeeboo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    My Bikes
    Specalized Tri-Cross
    Posts
    875
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Depends on the teacher, and if your going to be nice or mean to socialism.

    If your teacher is the kind that grades poorly if you disagree with him, don't write the paper if your going to end up going against his viewpoint on socialism.

    If your teacher is the kind that grades based off of your research/support of your stance, then just make sure you write a good paper
    In the words of Einstein
    "And now I think I'll take a bath"

  5. #5
    On my TARDIScycle! KingTermite's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Eastside Seattlite Termite Mound
    My Bikes
    Trek 520, Trek Navigator 300, Peugeot Versailles PE10DE
    Posts
    3,928
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by ModoVincere View Post
    Not sure I would call it a "utopian" society Ayn Rand portrayed in Anthem.

    As to OP's question, I think it would be a lot of work, but fun to do also. I would vote yes.
    I can't see how you would see it any other way....but I'll PM you. Don't want to derail Tom's thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by coffeecake View Post
    - it's pretty well established that Hitler was an *******.

  6. #6
    ****** squegeeboo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    My Bikes
    Specalized Tri-Cross
    Posts
    875
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by KingTermite View Post
    I can't see how you would see it any other way....but I'll PM you. Don't want to derail Tom's thread.
    I think what he's getting at is that the majority of Utopian society books are actually dis-Utopian societys based off of a Utopian society idea that was around at the time the author wrote the book.
    In the words of Einstein
    "And now I think I'll take a bath"

  7. #7
    On my TARDIScycle! KingTermite's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Eastside Seattlite Termite Mound
    My Bikes
    Trek 520, Trek Navigator 300, Peugeot Versailles PE10DE
    Posts
    3,928
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by squegeeboo View Post
    I think what he's getting at is that the majority of Utopian society books are actually dis-Utopian societys based off of a Utopian society idea that was around at the time the author wrote the book.
    That's why I thin "Anthem" was one that broke the mold. It really was a Utopian society, unlike what the societies end up becoming (e.g. 1984). I believe Ayn Rand was showing that communism was wrong even at a fundamental level, that's why she portrayed the society as a pure Utopian Communist society.
    Quote Originally Posted by coffeecake View Post
    - it's pretty well established that Hitler was an *******.

  8. #8
    ****** squegeeboo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    My Bikes
    Specalized Tri-Cross
    Posts
    875
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by KingTermite View Post
    That's why I thin "Anthem" was one that broke the mold. It really was a Utopian society, unlike what the societies end up becoming (e.g. 1984). I believe Ayn Rand was showing that communism was wrong even at a fundamental level, that's why she portrayed the society as a pure Utopian Communist society.
    It wasn't Utopian. There was technological regression, a lottery system for job placement, as well as still at least some form of police, and corporal punishment (the guy getting burnt at the stake), the society may not have been as screwed up as the ones in 1984, or Animal Farm, or Brave New World, but it was still far from the definition Excellent or ideal but impracticable


    Also, HA, so much for not derailing.
    In the words of Einstein
    "And now I think I'll take a bath"

  9. #9
    The Site Administrator: Currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes,please contact my assistnt admins for forum issues Tom Stormcrowe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    South Florida
    My Bikes
    Techna Wheelchair and a Sun EZ 3 Recumbent Trike
    Posts
    15,958
    Mentioned
    9 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)
    My Professor is intellectually honest. He wants us to defend our actual views rather than parrot his. Great teacher!
    Quote Originally Posted by squegeeboo View Post
    Depends on the teacher, and if your going to be nice or mean to socialism.

    If your teacher is the kind that grades poorly if you disagree with him, don't write the paper if your going to end up going against his viewpoint on socialism.

    If your teacher is the kind that grades based off of your research/support of your stance, then just make sure you write a good paper
    on light duty due to illness; please contact my assistants for forum issues. They are Siu Blue Wind, or CbadRider or the other 3 star folk. I am currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes. I am making good progress, happily.


    . “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”- Fredrick Nietzsche

    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." - Immanuel Kant

  10. #10
    Banned. timmyquest's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Woodstock
    Posts
    5,770
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Sounds pretty fun, not sure how you'd prove how it effected policy though...and as a result the difficulty is turning it into a history paper.

    I suppose you could use it as a tool, a window if you will, to the mindset of society and how these fears/predictions directed soceity?

  11. #11
    You Know!? For Kids! jsharr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Just NW of Richardson Bike Mart
    My Bikes
    '05 Trek 1200 / '90 Trek 8000 / '? Falcon Europa
    Posts
    6,005
    Mentioned
    10 Post(s)
    Tagged
    3 Thread(s)
    Sounds interesting to me, which sadly means it is mostly likely a bad idea.
    Are you a registered member? Why not? Click here to register. It's free and only takes 27 seconds! Help out the forums, abide by our community guidelines.
    Quote Originally Posted by colorider View Post
    Phobias are for irrational fears. Fear of junk ripping badgers is perfectly rational. Those things are nasty.

  12. #12
    ****** squegeeboo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    My Bikes
    Specalized Tri-Cross
    Posts
    875
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Stormcrowe View Post
    My Professor is intellectually honest. He wants us to defend our actual views rather than parrot his. Great teacher!
    Have you had him before? Most of my teachers claimed such a thing, all but 3 of them in my History/Politics/English courses failed to live by it. I learned that the hard way in my first college English class, did a paper on the TVA, and the New Deal in general (the assignment was to pick one aspect of the New Deal, and tie it into the overall picture FDR was going for), that was lets say, less than complementary. Tons of citations, tons of research, tons of red marks from the teacher. After that I started spending time getting to know my teachers before doing any major writing assignments.
    In the words of Einstein
    "And now I think I'll take a bath"

  13. #13
    The Site Administrator: Currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes,please contact my assistnt admins for forum issues Tom Stormcrowe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    South Florida
    My Bikes
    Techna Wheelchair and a Sun EZ 3 Recumbent Trike
    Posts
    15,958
    Mentioned
    9 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by timmyquest View Post
    Sounds pretty fun, not sure how you'd prove how it effected policy though...and as a result the difficulty is turning it into a history paper.

    I suppose you could use it as a tool, a window if you will, to the mindset of society and how these fears/predictions directed soceity?
    Are you sure we aren't somehow related? That's the exact track I'm planning on using
    on light duty due to illness; please contact my assistants for forum issues. They are Siu Blue Wind, or CbadRider or the other 3 star folk. I am currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes. I am making good progress, happily.


    . “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”- Fredrick Nietzsche

    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." - Immanuel Kant

  14. #14
    Senior Member ModoVincere's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    1,626
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by timmyquest View Post
    Sounds pretty fun, not sure how you'd prove how it effected policy though...and as a result the difficulty is turning it into a history paper.

    I suppose you could use it as a tool, a window if you will, to the mindset of society and how these fears/predictions directed soceity?
    precisely...you can't say that this book actually effected the policy in the past, but you can correlate its predictions with what happened. Do this in conjunction with additional information from other sources, such as the social/political climate during the times in question, and you could make some interesting conclusions.
    1 bronze, 0 silver, 1 gold

  15. #15
    The Site Administrator: Currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes,please contact my assistnt admins for forum issues Tom Stormcrowe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    South Florida
    My Bikes
    Techna Wheelchair and a Sun EZ 3 Recumbent Trike
    Posts
    15,958
    Mentioned
    9 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by squegeeboo View Post
    Have you had him before? Most of my teachers claimed such a thing, all but 3 of them in my History/Politics/English courses failed to live by it. I learned that the hard way in my first college English class, did a paper on the TVA, and the New Deal in general (the assignment was to pick one aspect of the New Deal, and tie it into the overall picture FDR was going for), that was lets say, less than complementary. Tons of citations, tons of research, tons of red marks from the teacher. After that I started spending time getting to know my teachers before doing any major writing assignments.
    I've known him for 5 or 6 years. I know him well enough to predict his reaction to a paper designed to appeal to him specifically and the result ain't pretty. He wants our views, not a reflection of his. If the paper is an honest reflection of what you are thinking and you can successfully defend your position, then you're golden.
    on light duty due to illness; please contact my assistants for forum issues. They are Siu Blue Wind, or CbadRider or the other 3 star folk. I am currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes. I am making good progress, happily.


    . “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”- Fredrick Nietzsche

    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." - Immanuel Kant

  16. #16
    ****** squegeeboo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    My Bikes
    Specalized Tri-Cross
    Posts
    875
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Stormcrowe View Post
    I've known him for 5 or 6 years. I know him well enough to predict his reaction to a paper designed to appeal to him specifically and the result ain't pretty. He wants our views, not a reflection of his. If the paper is an honest reflection of what you are thinking and you can successfully defend your position, then you're golden.
    Sweet, do it up then. And try and tie in 'Sesame Street' somehow.
    In the words of Einstein
    "And now I think I'll take a bath"

  17. #17
    Banned. timmyquest's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Woodstock
    Posts
    5,770
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Stormcrowe View Post
    Are you sure we aren't somehow related? That's the exact track I'm planning on using
    I dunno, we're both good looking guys who enjoy reading about medial temporal activation in correlation to PFC activation during WM tasks (did you know you can predict the accuracy of memory recall based on PFC activation during encoding?), when these begin to bore us...a little marx-related literature is good for a pick-me-up.

    Otherwise, i'd have to say no

  18. #18
    On my TARDIScycle! KingTermite's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Eastside Seattlite Termite Mound
    My Bikes
    Trek 520, Trek Navigator 300, Peugeot Versailles PE10DE
    Posts
    3,928
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by squegeeboo View Post
    It wasn't Utopian. There was technological regression, a lottery system for job placement, as well as still at least some form of police, and corporal punishment (the guy getting burnt at the stake), the society may not have been as screwed up as the ones in 1984, or Animal Farm, or Brave New World, but it was still far from the definition Excellent or ideal but impracticable


    Also, HA, so much for not derailing.
    Taking it to PM to un-derail.
    Quote Originally Posted by coffeecake View Post
    - it's pretty well established that Hitler was an *******.

  19. #19
    Non Tribuo Anus Rodentum and off to the next adventure (RIP) Stacey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Posts
    9,163
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Ummmm..... Quail? Pie? 42?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •