Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Foo Off-Topic chit chat with no general subject.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-27-09, 09:49 PM   #1
USAZorro
Señor Member
Thread Starter
 
USAZorro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Florence, KY
Bikes: 1954 Hetchins M.O., 1959 Viking Severn Valley, 1970 Raleigh Pro, 1972 Fuji "The Finest", 1974 Raleigh Superbe&Comp, 1976 Raleigh Team Pro, 1996 Giant Iguana, 2000 Bob Jackson Arrowhead
Posts: 14,422
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Pinewood Derby Question

OK - I know there are some of you leaders/parents out there. I have a question for you.

How are cars brought to a stop on the track your boys race their cars on? We set up towels at the end for cars to plow into, but I know there has to be a better technique out there.
__________________
In search of what to search for.
USAZorro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-09, 09:52 PM   #2
jsharr
You Know!? For Kids!
 
jsharr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Just NW of Richardson Bike Mart
Bikes: '05 Trek 1200 / '90 Trek 8000 / '? Falcon Europa
Posts: 6,157
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
On our track the tire grooves get deeper so the cars end up with their wheels in the air. This part of the track is covered in a foam material





If you have a wooden track, you can make a finish section out of wood. We made our return track and used a router to do this. At the finish end, we just set the bit deeper to achieve the same effect. That is the two lane return track in the back ground.

__________________
Are you a registered member? Why not? Click here to register. It's free and only takes 27 seconds! Help out the forums, abide by our community guidelines.
Quote:
Originally Posted by colorider View Post
Phobias are for irrational fears. Fear of junk ripping badgers is perfectly rational. Those things are nasty.

Last edited by jsharr; 02-27-09 at 10:10 PM.
jsharr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-09, 09:53 PM   #3
vja4Him
Biking 4 Life
 
vja4Him's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Modesto, California
Bikes: 27-speed Surly Long Haul Trucker, 2009; 18-speed Mongoose Switchback (1990); 21-speed Electra Townie (2008)
Posts: 666
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAZorro View Post
OK - I know there are some of you leaders/parents out there. I have a question for you.

How are cars brought to a stop on the track your boys race their cars on? We set up towels at the end for cars to plow into, but I know there has to be a better technique out there.
I can't remember how they stopped our cars! But I do remember the high tech computerized timing device, which registers each cars time on a computer! My oldest boy won several races. I think I made like 5th or 6th place one year.

Our first car only travelled on three wheels, and still made I think like 3rd place!
vja4Him is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-09, 09:58 PM   #4
rsyb
Senior Member
 
rsyb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Athens, IL
Bikes: Vision VR40 LWB
Posts: 155
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
One of the fathers built an addition onto the end of our track. Basically extending the lanes about 2.5 to 3 feet. The extension created a gradual incline to the lanes so that the wheels of the cars were lifted off of the track. Some thin foam rubber weatherstrip or 1 inch sand belts (can't remember which worked best) was applied to the surface of the incline for friction.

Worked in 90% of the cases. Of course we still had plenty of foam rubber surrounding the finish area.
rsyb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-09, 10:00 PM   #5
jsharr
You Know!? For Kids!
 
jsharr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Just NW of Richardson Bike Mart
Bikes: '05 Trek 1200 / '90 Trek 8000 / '? Falcon Europa
Posts: 6,157
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Zorro, our pack's track is in my garage, I can get measurement or snap some pics off the wooden finish section if you need.
__________________
Are you a registered member? Why not? Click here to register. It's free and only takes 27 seconds! Help out the forums, abide by our community guidelines.
Quote:
Originally Posted by colorider View Post
Phobias are for irrational fears. Fear of junk ripping badgers is perfectly rational. Those things are nasty.
jsharr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-09, 10:08 PM   #6
dgodave
Behold my avatar:
 
dgodave's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SW Colorado
Bikes: 2106 Specialized AWOL, 2013 Surly Krampus, 1983 Trek 620
Posts: 588
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 81 Post(s)
It would look cool if they plowed through water, or flaming oil.
.
BTW, do you have to use pine wood?
.
dgodave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-09, 11:18 PM   #7
Wanderer
aka Phil Jungels
 
Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: North Aurora, IL
Bikes: 08 Specialized Crosstrail Sport, 05 Sirrus Comp
Posts: 7,552
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Yep, it's a kit - pine block, axles, wheels.
Wanderer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-09, 11:24 PM   #8
JF1
Senior Member
 
JF1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Kaysville, Utah
Bikes: 2006 Giant OCR 3 Composite
Posts: 544
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Ours is just like jsharr's. Those pics show it perfectly.
JF1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-09, 11:40 PM   #9
dgodave
Behold my avatar:
 
dgodave's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SW Colorado
Bikes: 2106 Specialized AWOL, 2013 Surly Krampus, 1983 Trek 620
Posts: 588
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 81 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wanderer View Post
Yep, it's a kit - pine block, axles, wheels.
Is every block of pine the exact same density?
.
dgodave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-09, 11:45 PM   #10
vja4Him
Biking 4 Life
 
vja4Him's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Modesto, California
Bikes: 27-speed Surly Long Haul Trucker, 2009; 18-speed Mongoose Switchback (1990); 21-speed Electra Townie (2008)
Posts: 666
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dgodave View Post
Is every block of pine the exact same density?
.
When you are finished building your car, it can't weight over a certain amount. I can't remember what the weight limit is. Usually people carve the block of wood into various shapes, then add weights to the bottom. I've seen some people who just kept the block of wood the original rectangle shape though.
vja4Him is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 01:33 AM   #11
Engineer101
Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Southwest Central, IL
Bikes: late 80's Trek 400; POS MTB
Posts: 44
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
We always just folded a blanket up and had a couple kids kneel on it at the end of the track, so the cars would stick under it or bounce off.
Engineer101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 09:24 AM   #12
jsharr
You Know!? For Kids!
 
jsharr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Just NW of Richardson Bike Mart
Bikes: '05 Trek 1200 / '90 Trek 8000 / '? Falcon Europa
Posts: 6,157
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dgodave View Post
Is every block of pine the exact same density?
.
Nope, they are all different, but the complete kit out of the box is around 4 oz. Most pack's have a weight limit of 5 oz. and the scouts that want to go fast are within a few hundreths of an ounce of the max weight. Many of the boys in our pack were at 5.00 ounces.
__________________
Are you a registered member? Why not? Click here to register. It's free and only takes 27 seconds! Help out the forums, abide by our community guidelines.
Quote:
Originally Posted by colorider View Post
Phobias are for irrational fears. Fear of junk ripping badgers is perfectly rational. Those things are nasty.
jsharr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 12:13 PM   #13
RazorWind
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 1,225
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
When I was in cub scounts, the track they used was just like jsharr's. I won first place in my pack, my first year as a webelo. :cool:

Edit: Is it weird that I want to do pinewood derby again, now?
RazorWind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 01:20 PM   #14
rsyb
Senior Member
 
rsyb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Athens, IL
Bikes: Vision VR40 LWB
Posts: 155
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
BTW, check the pre-cut axle grooves in the kit. Many times we found they were not square to the block. Can't get your car to go in a straight line if the wheels aren't square!
rsyb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 01:24 PM   #15
jsharr
You Know!? For Kids!
 
jsharr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Just NW of Richardson Bike Mart
Bikes: '05 Trek 1200 / '90 Trek 8000 / '? Falcon Europa
Posts: 6,157
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
If the rules allow it, get a drill press and drill axle holes. The jig for this is a decent investment if you do not have a drill press.
__________________
Are you a registered member? Why not? Click here to register. It's free and only takes 27 seconds! Help out the forums, abide by our community guidelines.
Quote:
Originally Posted by colorider View Post
Phobias are for irrational fears. Fear of junk ripping badgers is perfectly rational. Those things are nasty.
jsharr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 01:45 PM   #16
SpongeDad
Overacting because I can
 
SpongeDad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: The Mean Streets of Bethesda, MD
Bikes: Merlin Agilis, Trek 1500
Posts: 4,552
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by RazorWind View Post
When I was in cub scounts, the track they used was just like jsharr's. I won first place in my pack, my first year as a webelo. :cool:

Edit: Is it weird that I want to do pinewood derby again, now?
I am Dremel-ing my second son's car today. It's really quite funny around here - the first time dads really get in to it. One of the Pack Mothers had a great comment - "This is great, we should have one for the boys too." She said this with good humor. By the time my older son was a webelo he was doing the whole car himself. And that's the year he won first place.
__________________
“Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm." (Churchill)

"I am a courageous cyclist." (SpongeDad)
SpongeDad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 02:03 PM   #17
rsyb
Senior Member
 
rsyb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Athens, IL
Bikes: Vision VR40 LWB
Posts: 155
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
My son's first year we put very little work into the car. We didn't really know what we were doing either. Despite dropping his car, breaking a wheel off, and many of the weights, he finished first among his age group.

Put more work into the cars after that (with my second son also). Never did as well again!
rsyb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 02:15 PM   #18
jsharr
You Know!? For Kids!
 
jsharr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Just NW of Richardson Bike Mart
Bikes: '05 Trek 1200 / '90 Trek 8000 / '? Falcon Europa
Posts: 6,157
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Polish your axles. Polish your wheel hubs inside. Put your wheels and axles in zip lock baggie and add graphite and shake them a few minutes a day. Drill your axle holes. Get weight to 5 oz. Space your wheels close to car to minimize wobble.
__________________
Are you a registered member? Why not? Click here to register. It's free and only takes 27 seconds! Help out the forums, abide by our community guidelines.
Quote:
Originally Posted by colorider View Post
Phobias are for irrational fears. Fear of junk ripping badgers is perfectly rational. Those things are nasty.
jsharr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 03:56 PM   #19
gmrv4
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Kansas City MO
Bikes:
Posts: 50
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
With regard to polishing axles. Apply graphite to the axles and burnish them with an electric drill. The heated graphite becomes even more slick after cooling. This only needs to been done once to the axles. NEVER touch or apply graphite again to the axles. My buddies kid took 1st place out of 1500 kids. When they saw competitors applying fresh graphite to the axles they knew they had won that race.

Last edited by gmrv4; 02-28-09 at 03:57 PM. Reason: spelling
gmrv4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 05:35 PM   #20
Little Darwin
The Improbable Bulk
 
Little Darwin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Wilkes-Barre, PA
Bikes: Many
Posts: 8,401
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpongeDad View Post
I am Dremel-ing my second son's car today. It's really quite funny around here - the first time dads really get in to it. One of the Pack Mothers had a great comment - "This is great, we should have one for the boys too." She said this with good humor. By the time my older son was a webelo he was doing the whole car himself. And that's the year he won first place.
I have never done this, but I had heard that especially for some specific groups is is more of a competition for the dads than the kids... It seems like it would be great father/son fun!
Little Darwin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 05:41 PM   #21
RazorWind
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 1,225
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Little Darwin View Post
I have never done this, but I had heard that especially for some specific groups is is more of a competition for the dads than the kids... It seems like it would be great father/son fun!
It is in the later years. In the first few years of cub scouts, the kids aren't quite old enough appreciate all the tedious work that goes into it (sanding the thing seemed like torture to me when I was that age). By the first year of Webelos (9 or 10 years old, maybe?), I was better able to get excited about it.
RazorWind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 05:41 PM   #22
jsharr
You Know!? For Kids!
 
jsharr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Just NW of Richardson Bike Mart
Bikes: '05 Trek 1200 / '90 Trek 8000 / '? Falcon Europa
Posts: 6,157
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Pinewood can be a bit challenging for the tiger and bear cubs (1st and 2nd graders). They need some help cutting out the body.

But they can be set loose on the paint. It is pretty funny to see some of their designs.

The older scouts 3rd-5th grades, really take ownership of their cars.

It is easy to discern the kid built cars from the dad built cars.

The nice part is that aesthetics have no effect on speed. My first grader polished his axles and we hammered them into the holes we drilled and made sure his car weighed 5 ounces and he took first place.

I helped even less this year, and he still took third place.
__________________
Are you a registered member? Why not? Click here to register. It's free and only takes 27 seconds! Help out the forums, abide by our community guidelines.
Quote:
Originally Posted by colorider View Post
Phobias are for irrational fears. Fear of junk ripping badgers is perfectly rational. Those things are nasty.
jsharr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 05:46 PM   #23
RazorWind
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 1,225
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsharr View Post
The nice part is that aesthetics have no effect on speed. My first grader polished his axles and we hammered them into the holes we drilled and made sure his car weighed 5 ounces and he took first place.
It wouldn't surprise me if the shape of the car made a difference, even if the quality of the paint doesn't. If I had it to do again, I'd do a low airfoil-ish design.
RazorWind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 06:00 PM   #24
jsharr
You Know!? For Kids!
 
jsharr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Just NW of Richardson Bike Mart
Bikes: '05 Trek 1200 / '90 Trek 8000 / '? Falcon Europa
Posts: 6,157
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Aerodymanics does not matter at this level. I have read studies on this and seen it first hand. One of our fastest cars this year was called "the block". It was the uncut, untouched stock block and the father and son spent their time in my garage polishing axles and truing wheels.

Wheel alignment is critical. The car needs to run straight.

Getting the weight to max is also crucial. Potential energy. If the rules say 5 oz. max, then make sure the car is as close to 5 oz as possible.

Weight placement is also key. You need to get the weight low and in the back of the car
__________________
Are you a registered member? Why not? Click here to register. It's free and only takes 27 seconds! Help out the forums, abide by our community guidelines.
Quote:
Originally Posted by colorider View Post
Phobias are for irrational fears. Fear of junk ripping badgers is perfectly rational. Those things are nasty.
jsharr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-09, 07:07 PM   #25
FlyingAnchor
Senior Member
 
FlyingAnchor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Humboldt County Ca
Bikes: All Recumbent, Strada and TT Tour
Posts: 301
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I won first place as a commander for show, never won anything for a race. I made a boat and dyed it blue then did all the finish stuff. It raced like a boat on land.
FlyingAnchor is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:18 AM.