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  1. #1
    Decrepit Member Scooper's Avatar
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    Who's going to be the first with Reynolds 953?

    Which of the high end framebuilders is going to be first to come out with a frameset using the new Reynolds 953 stainless steel tube set?

    http://www.reynoldscycles.co.uk/hotnews.html
    - Stan

  2. #2
    Industry Maven Thylacine's Avatar
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    Well, I'll be ording tubes in Jan if that's any indication. If anyone wants one, all you have to do is place an order with anyone who currently either builds with steel or knows how to purchase from Reynolds. 953 is not a huge stretch.

    The tubes are available Feb according to the good folks at Reynolds, so expect every man and his dog to have offerings soon thereafter.

    I'm curious to see what the retail pricing is going to be like more than anything. Could potentially be more than Titanium, when you factor in the tubing cost and heat treatment costs.
    Have you earned your stripes? <<click here / Questions about custom frames? Chat me! - warwickg71 (AIM/iChat) ThylacineCycles (Skype)

  3. #3
    Decrepit Member Scooper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walkercycles
    Last i heard, Independent Fabrication were the first ones to try them out.

    DW
    I'm right up the road from San Jose, so I put the March 3 - 5 show on my calendar and signed up for the e-mails.
    - Stan

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walkercycles
    Last i heard, Independent Fabrication were the first ones to try them out.

    DW
    Also a shop somewhere downunder (austrailia).

    Funny both IF and the other folks (forgot who they are), have not reported on the ride quality of the frame.

    Carpenter Tech is (or was) a speciality steel maker in PA, does anyone know where the tubes are actually being made.
    I guess I could post this over to framebuilders@phred... but after the initial announcement, there has not been a whole lot of interest in the stuff, guessing by the lack of posts on phred.

    Here's a good link http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech/2005...s/australia051
    anybody know what 4,000 au is in us dollars?

  5. #5
    Industry Maven Thylacine's Avatar
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    USD2,960

    There's a reason nobody knows about the ride quality - the aim was to make sample frames as light as possible so they could say "Look, we have a 1000g (unridable) steel frame".

    From what Reynolds told me, they only literally made 3-4 tubesets for show bikes, and more tubing won't be available until the first production run in Jan. Carpenter makes the blank sheet, and Reynolds turns it into a tube.

    The big bonuses about 953 is it's stainless qualities and it's Yield Strength, which are frankly off the charts. It won't be any stiffer than a regular steel frame, and weight-wise from the spec sheet it won't be hugely lighter either, despite what the show bikes suggest.
    Have you earned your stripes? <<click here / Questions about custom frames? Chat me! - warwickg71 (AIM/iChat) ThylacineCycles (Skype)

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thylacine
    ...The big bonuses about 953 is it's stainless qualities and it's Yield Strength, which are frankly off the charts. It won't be any stiffer than a regular steel frame, and weight-wise from the spec sheet it won't be hugely lighter either, despite what the show bikes suggest.
    then what will the rider notice?

  7. #7
    如果你能讀了這個你講中文 genericbikedude's Avatar
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    whoa, 953. after that they'll have to go into quadruple digits...

  8. #8
    barnfullagts
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    My guess is that Mike Appel will be one of the first independent builders to use it. He was playing around with stainless back in the late eighties and early ninties.

  9. #9
    Industry Maven Thylacine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by e-RICHIE
    then what will the rider notice?
    Do you mean appart from the fact that they now have another option and that your frames now have a stainless driveside chainstay like in the good old days?

    Appart from that, not a lot.

    Maybe it will open up a market for rich baby-boomers that want a stainless bike for their ocean going yacht holiday around the South Pacific?
    Have you earned your stripes? <<click here / Questions about custom frames? Chat me! - warwickg71 (AIM/iChat) ThylacineCycles (Skype)

  10. #10
    Senior Member Brian's Avatar
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    I need to point out that converting AU$ to US$ and back is a useless exercise. The markets are so different that unless you were travelling to one country or the other to buy your bike, the numbers mean nothing. Something that costs US$1k is likely to be AU$2k or more down under. Hope that makes sense. US prices will nearly always be much less than simply doing the conversion.

    Just throwing in my 2 cents (rounded up to 5 cents for Johnny Howard)

  11. #11
    Industry Maven Thylacine's Avatar
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    That's pretty much how it goes, yeah. Double it and then add a bit.

    Which is why I can't actually remember the last time I actually paid retail for something that wasn't food or beer.

    One of the joys of living in a country that's larger than Europe but has the population of New York City.
    Have you earned your stripes? <<click here / Questions about custom frames? Chat me! - warwickg71 (AIM/iChat) ThylacineCycles (Skype)

  12. #12
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    Has anyone done a regular lugged steel bike with a stainless driveside chainstay? It seems like you could get a piece of SS tubing in the right diameters to fit. I've always loved the look of the chromed stays, it seems stainless would be better,
    -Sean

  13. #13
    works for truffles pigmode's Avatar
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    At this point I don't see anything concrete being brought to the table, other than just another consumer option. I wonder where the increased yield strength is coming from? Is it from the heat-treatment or the stainless alloys? The latter should tend to introduce a higher degree of brittleness, and the fact that this steel can't be drawn into tubing is a flashing light the results of which remains to be seen.

  14. #14
    Nut Job jedi_rider's Avatar
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    Still wondering how this is a huge advantage over titanium. But I'll leave that to the marketing gurus and see...

    I was ready to drop some money on a Ti frame I saw (a 2005 Teramo for $995 USD --- is that a good price???), but I read about the 953 tubing...
    Any time I'm going up a hill, I know I'm headed in the right direction.

  15. #15
    Retro-nerd georgiaboy's Avatar
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    Hopefully the 953 will catch on soon. I will enjoy the price decrease on 853.
    Would you like a dream with that?

  16. #16
    works for truffles pigmode's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jedi_rider
    Still wondering how this is a huge advantage over titanium. But I'll leave that to the marketing gurus and see...

    I was ready to drop some money on a Ti frame I saw (a 2005 Teramo for $995 USD --- is that a good price???), but I read about the 953 tubing...
    Ti is a known quantity. Are you going to wait or be part of the testing process?

  17. #17
    Decrepit Member Scooper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jedi_rider
    Still wondering how this is a huge advantage over titanium.
    I think the biggest advantage is in yield strength. With a yield strength of 1500-1900 MPa, 953 is about twice that of cold-worked, Stress relieved 3-2.5 titanium.

    Quote Originally Posted by pigmode
    ...and the fact that this steel can't be drawn into tubing is a flashing light the results of which remains to be seen.
    Reynolds says that it can be drawn into tubing, but that it wouldn't be economically feasible at this time. They claim a seamless version of the 953 tube set is a future option, but that drilling into the weld seam area does not cause any seam cracking, and that there is no visible seam line on the finished tube after polishing.

    Attached is the 953 FAQs from Reynolds.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    - Stan

  18. #18
    works for truffles pigmode's Avatar
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    I think a lot will depend on a couple of factors, the most important being the diversity of the tube spec. that will be offered, fabrication process, and long term durability.

  19. #19
    works for truffles pigmode's Avatar
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    More economical or more expensive?

  20. #20
    Senior Member classic1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oknups
    Also a shop somewhere downunder (austrailia).

    Funny both IF and the other folks (forgot who they are), have not reported on the ride quality of the frame.

    anybody know what 4,000 au is in us dollars?
    Baum (jbcycles). I've heard on good authority that they won't sell the prototypes, they are not quite satisfied with them yet. This appears to relate to Thylos point above in point 6.

    $4k Aus = $3K US
    Last edited by classic1; 12-21-05 at 06:39 AM.

  21. #21
    Senior Member bellweatherman's Avatar
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    Trust me when I tell you this. Anybody that knows anything in this industry knows that Baum was THE first to receive and build with the 953 pipes. Before even IF. No dumb guessing and professing like a know-it-all.

  22. #22
    Nut Job jedi_rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pigmode
    Ti is a known quantity. Are you going to wait or be part of the testing process?
    Good point. I just had my car serviced at the 150k mark, so I had to spend some money. I'll wait next year for the next Ti frame fire sales .
    Any time I'm going up a hill, I know I'm headed in the right direction.

  23. #23
    Industry Maven Thylacine's Avatar
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    Being first means absolutely nothing, except in this case creating unridable vapourware just to get the punters excited.

    The bottom line is, if the Reynolds boys do their job and get a quality tubeset to market sometime early next year, than anyone with the ability and quality to do high end TIG and a credit card will be able to make a ridable, sellable 953 bike.

    It's not a rocket, it's not some magical material that only three people in the world will be able to work with, it's just a new and improved steel.
    Have you earned your stripes? <<click here / Questions about custom frames? Chat me! - warwickg71 (AIM/iChat) ThylacineCycles (Skype)

  24. #24
    Senior Member bellweatherman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thylacine
    Being first means absolutely nothing, except in this case creating unridable vapourware just to get the punters excited.

    The bottom line is, if the Reynolds boys do their job and get a quality tubeset to market sometime early next year, than anyone with the ability and quality to do high end TIG and a credit card will be able to make a ridable, sellable 953 bike.

    It's not a rocket, it's not some magical material that only three people in the world will be able to work with, it's just a new and improved steel.


    Exactly. Well said mate.

  25. #25
    Senior Member Brian's Avatar
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    Because we need a new, untried, and expensive frame material. Tiger, are you going to be using it?

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