Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Framebuilders Thinking about a custom frame? Lugged vs Fillet Brazed. Different Frame materials? Newvex or Pacenti Lugs? why get a custom Road, Mountain, or Track Frame? Got a question about framebuilding? Lets discuss framebuilding at it's finest.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-18-08, 07:02 PM   #1
CrimsonKarter21
Mitcholo
Thread Starter
 
CrimsonKarter21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Oost Vlaanderen in mind, Cleveland in body
Bikes: 2010 Mitcholo w/ Sram Force/Red
Posts: 8,850
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Bonding steel/aluminum

Okay, so I know a guy on my team who's willing to give me a pro deal on a custom frameset. I want a nice track bike, oversized tubing, PAUL track-ends, severely sloping top-tube while still maintaining two 700c wheels, and an "integrated" seatpost.
I remember seeing on Isaac carbon fiber bikes that their top-of-the-line model, the Newton (I think) was all carbon fiber, but had aluminum seatstays because they're a lot stiffer and not too much of a weight penalty.

Can I have bonded aluminum stays on a steel frame, or should I just go safe and have it all steel?
CrimsonKarter21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-08, 08:18 PM   #2
Hocam
Ho-Jahm
 
Hocam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Manchester, NH
Bikes:
Posts: 4,228
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The problem with bonding two dissimilar metals to each other is that their coefficients of thermal elasticity are generally very different, as is the case with aluminum and steel. What this means is that at temperatures different from the original bonding temperature, the bond will be under stress simply from the two materials expanding or contracting away or towards each other.

So yes, you could probably do it with some kind of epoxy but who knows how long it will last? Besides, there are plenty of oversized steel chainstays available.
Hocam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-08, 05:18 PM   #3
maddog17
Worker Ant
 
maddog17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Peabody, Mass. U.S.A.
Bikes: Ted Wojcik road and Iron Horse Hollowpoint mtb
Posts: 140
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
sounds like an interesting idea, but why would you want to bond alu to steel anyway? i would think you would want the frame stiff so how would you match a thicker alu end to a slimmer steel end? that would mean the lug would have to be 2 different sizes at each end and i'd assume you would have to either make it yourself or buy a big lug and trim it down for the steel side. so to make things easier, go all steel.
maddog17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-08, 06:07 PM   #4
flatlander_48
Cathedral City, CA
 
flatlander_48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Cathedral City, CA
Bikes: 2016 RITCHEY BreakAway (full Chorus 11), 2005 Ritchey BreakAway (full Chorus 11, STOLEN), 2001 Gary Fisher Tassajara mountain bike (sold), 2004 Giant TRC 2 road bike (sold)
Posts: 1,479
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hocam View Post
The problem with bonding two dissimilar metals to each other is that their coefficients of thermal elasticity are generally very different, as is the case with aluminum and steel. What this means is that at temperatures different from the original bonding temperature, the bond will be under stress simply from the two materials expanding or contracting away or towards each other.

So yes, you could probably do it with some kind of epoxy but who knows how long it will last? Besides, there are plenty of oversized steel chainstays available.
Expansion...
flatlander_48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-08, 06:22 PM   #5
Hocam
Ho-Jahm
 
Hocam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Manchester, NH
Bikes:
Posts: 4,228
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Thanks
Hocam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-08, 09:14 PM   #6
CrimsonKarter21
Mitcholo
Thread Starter
 
CrimsonKarter21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Oost Vlaanderen in mind, Cleveland in body
Bikes: 2010 Mitcholo w/ Sram Force/Red
Posts: 8,850
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Okay, thanks for the information. I guess I need to learn a little more about metal!
CrimsonKarter21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-08, 09:21 PM   #7
Arab T.R. Wrist
I can fight, crow, & fly.
 
Arab T.R. Wrist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Bangkok, that's in Thailand. No, I said "Thailand" not "Taiwan".
Bikes: PUCH-Pacifica, Felt-TK2, Raleigh-Tandem, Kestrel-200, And several other projects (New and old)
Posts: 64
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Electrolysis would be an issue here also, non?
Arab T.R. Wrist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-08, 04:12 PM   #8
Fred Smedley
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 1,706
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Miyata did it for years and mine's still holding tight.
Fred Smedley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-08, 05:16 PM   #9
jeffz
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Raleigh did it as well. I think they called it "Technium".
jeffz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-08, 09:37 PM   #10
NoReg
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 5,117
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
If I had to do it in my garage, I would just weld on short steel tubes that would sleeve over the aluminum, and then epoxy those suckers in there. Give myself at least about 3-6 diameters of penetration and I might get out alive. Postcure the epoxy and use microballons.
NoReg is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:32 PM.