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Framebuilders Thinking about a custom frame? Lugged vs Fillet Brazed. Different Frame materials? Newvex or Pacenti Lugs? why get a custom Road, Mountain, or Track Frame? Got a question about framebuilding? Lets discuss framebuilding at it's finest.

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Old 04-19-10, 01:58 PM   #1
Airburst
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Various Raleigh issues

I'm not 100% sure how this happened, but both the seatstays have actually sheared off my Raleigh Trent Sports. They appear to have failed at the brazed joint, but without cleaning off the paint I can't be sure. Assuming the brazing is the failure point, how easy will it be to repair? I'm currently learning to braze, I'm not exactly an expert, but it doesn't appear to be too difficult to do. My only worry is overheating the other joints in the lug, would that be an issue? Here's a pic

PICT0301..jpg

What might cause a failure like that? Old Raleighs were usually extremely well built. More importantly, is the frame safe to ride until I can fix it?


Also, the right-hand side of the seatstay bridge looks like it's been repaired. The joint looks different to the left-hand one, and the ones I've seen on other Raleighs of similar age. The paint and underlying black layer have also been removed around it, which is why I think it's a repair. Here's the picture.

PICT0306..jpg

Does it look like a repair to everyone else?
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Old 04-19-10, 06:40 PM   #2
unterhausen
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if both seat stays are sheared off, the bike is not safe to ride. The seat stay connection is not really all that easy, as might be inferred from the fact that it broke on your bike. I used to make spending money in college doing repairs on brake bridges that broke off, I always figured that they had the really drunk guys putting those on in the European factories. Hard to know if that's a repair, it looks like it might be but that joint has seen some weathering so it's difficult to know.
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Old 04-19-10, 11:02 PM   #3
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Well, the repair might be as easy as thoroughly cleaning the joint, fluxing it, and heating it until the brass flows. That also might not work at all, in which case the repair entails removing the stays entirely (or at least removing the brake bridge), removing all of the old brass, and then rebrazing with new brass or silver. This probably won't affect the existing joinery (esp. if you use silver) but that depends upon your brazing skills, to some extent.

What caused it in the first place? Improper cleaning, inadequate heating, abuse...

I bet the second pic shows a repair. I'm no expert on Raleighs, but I'd have a hard time believing anything like that would make it out of a major shop like Raleigh once was.
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Old 04-20-10, 12:10 AM   #4
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you haven't looked at many Raleighs You're probably right about the second picture, but it's hard to tell because of all the rust. It almost looks like there is some JB Weld there.

I'm sure the seat lug and seat stays were originally put on with brass. I'd fix it with brass. I suspect you would cook the lug so bad that nothing would stick to it before you messed up the lug brazing.

Contrary to what the European and U.K. builders did during the '70s bike boom, it's fairly common now to use silver to braze the lug and bronze to braze on the seat stays. There is no good reason for the silver to re-flow, or rather no good reason for it to move if it becomes molten.
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Old 04-20-10, 11:18 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Six jours View Post
I'm no expert on Raleighs, but I'd have a hard time believing anything like that would make it out of a major shop like Raleigh once was.
Why do you say that? Is it the missing paint and stuff?

@Unterhausen, what's JB Weld? I've a feeling it's an epoxy resin, but I'm not 100% sure.
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Old 04-20-10, 11:23 AM   #6
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yes, JB weld is epoxy with some additives. It's good stuff, sorta like the duct tape of glues. The missing paint does suggest a repair though.
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