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Framebuilders Thinking about a custom frame? Lugged vs Fillet Brazed. Different Frame materials? Newvex or Pacenti Lugs? why get a custom Road, Mountain, or Track Frame? Got a question about framebuilding? Lets discuss framebuilding at it's finest.

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Old 04-16-12, 02:31 AM   #1
ftwelder
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A frame I made.

Made from an old school Easton road kit with some additional tube shaping. There were five forming operations done to the seat stays before the first cut. The frame weighs 1250gm. I smoothed the welds for something different.

The head tube was made from an unusual piece of tube and is reduced in diameter to give the front a cleaner look. It's quite stiff regardless of the smaller tubes. Ill add a few more pics when the final spec is installed.


my new frame! by frankthewelder, on Flickr


29 687 by frankthewelder, on Flickr


29 685 by frankthewelder, on Flickr


29 678 by frankthewelder, on Flickr


29 673 by frankthewelder, on Flickr
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Old 04-16-12, 03:19 AM   #2
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Clean build!
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Old 04-16-12, 09:57 AM   #3
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Really nice! Also, nice Dodge Power-Wagon in the background.

Brian
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Old 04-16-12, 12:02 PM   #4
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Really nice. 1250 g, even nicer!
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Old 04-16-12, 06:11 PM   #5
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Frank- I like how the tubes flow into each other. Andy.
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Old 04-17-12, 01:52 AM   #6
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Thanks, it was a fun frame to build. I have 125 miles since Friday and like it quite a bit. This is the first aluminum bike I have ridden in a really long time. I am getting more accustomed to the unusual vibrations.
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Old 04-18-12, 09:35 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ftwelder View Post
Thanks, it was a fun frame to build. I have 125 miles since Friday and like it quite a bit. This is the first aluminum bike I have ridden in a really long time. I am getting more accustomed to the unusual vibrations.
Very cool frame, Frank! Like others have said, the way those tubes flow together post-treatment is very nice. And very nice components, too. May I ask you why you chose to add spacers to the fork instead of making the HT longer? Frame stiffness? Weight? tube set limit? Adjustment options? Just curious
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Old 04-18-12, 09:46 AM   #8
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so cool. I'm so envious. Can't imagine riding my own hand-built frame.
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Old 04-23-12, 03:19 AM   #9
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Very cool frame, Frank! Like others have said, the way those tubes flow together post-treatment is very nice. And very nice components, too. May I ask you why you chose to add spacers to the fork instead of making the HT longer? Frame stiffness? Weight? tube set limit? Adjustment options? Just curious
Thanks!

I wasn't sure what fit specifications I would finally end up with. The shaped spacer was the inspiration for the head tube design so it will stay also.

It's nice being able to build your own frames. While I love having a nicer bike than I would likely buy for myself, the best part is being able to have bikes of many types for whatever purpose. I have two DH bikes, a trials bike, two BMX bikes, tons of road bikes a tandem and my next project is an all aluminum, fully rigid 2-speed 650B XC bike. the gears will be through a hammerschmidt crank set and a 1930's style road/path "all brazed up".
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Old 04-26-12, 01:16 AM   #10
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Sorry for the extremely basic question, but what is used to weld Aluminum frames? TIG?
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Old 04-26-12, 09:41 PM   #11
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Yes it's GTAW. No body welds GMAW that I know of for bicycles.

Franks, do you have to heat treat your frames onsite or outsource that? Very cool bike though.
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Old 04-27-12, 08:41 PM   #12
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In other words it is TIG welded. GTAW, or as one tends to see it TIG (GTAW), is one of those acronyms that hasn't caught on among those who want to communicate with others.


Lots of frames are MIG (GMAW) welded, but none that I know of by custom builders. If you look at all those aluminum frames, or steel, that are at places like Walmart, they often have runs of perfect "dimes" very nice looking really, and that is probably MIG machine welding.

Here is the Marchetti machine for MIG welding, though who knows, that may be Italian for TIG.

http://www.marchettispa.it/telai/det...?DocumentID=16
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Old 04-29-12, 09:20 AM   #13
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Thanks!

I wasn't sure what fit specifications I would finally end up with. The shaped spacer was the inspiration for the head tube design so it will stay also.

It's nice being able to build your own frames. While I love having a nicer bike than I would likely buy for myself, the best part is being able to have bikes of many types for whatever purpose. I have two DH bikes, a trials bike, two BMX bikes, tons of road bikes a tandem and my next project is an all aluminum, fully rigid 2-speed 650B XC bike. the gears will be through a hammerschmidt crank set and a 1930's style road/path "all brazed up".
Thanks for the reply, I really like the creative, out of the box ideas that go into those current projects. For me, the most fun part of having a creative job is the experimental stuff that happens in the after hours!
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Old 05-01-12, 04:31 PM   #14
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Yes it's GTAW. No body welds GMAW that I know of for bicycles.

Franks, do you have to heat treat your frames onsite or outsource that? Very cool bike though.
Thanks, my painter ages my 7005 frames and I take my 6061 frames to Industrial Heattreating in Quincy MA. I have an alignment fixture at the HT facility for the 6061 frames.

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In other words it is TIG welded. GTAW, or as one tends to see it TIG (GTAW), is one of those acronyms that hasn't caught on among those who want to communicate with others.


Lots of frames are MIG (GMAW) welded, but none that I know of by custom builders. If you look at all those aluminum frames, or steel, that are at places like Walmart, they often have runs of perfect "dimes" very nice looking really, and that is probably MIG machine welding.

Here is the Marchetti machine for MIG welding, though who knows, that may be Italian for TIG.

http://www.marchettispa.it/telai/det...?DocumentID=16
Most of the production bikes are TIG welded using a cold wire feed. It's basically a TIG torch in the right hand a small handle with a micro-switch for wire feed in the left. I can TIG weld a whole BMX frame from .035 4130 in about 5 min. feeding 3' pieces of .045 filler. I used to do that for a living.

People are cheaper than electricity where bikes are made. most things are made by people if they can be used in place of a machine.

Last edited by ftwelder; 05-01-12 at 04:39 PM.
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Old 05-01-12, 08:40 PM   #15
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Wow Frank, talk about building a base of skill.

Here is a robotic MIG bike welder with pulse.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6669_gyYh8
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Old 05-01-12, 10:27 PM   #16
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I think I see the wire feed thing around 2:00 here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMdrP...eature=related

Cool to know what one is looking at.
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Old 05-04-12, 02:49 AM   #17
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That is correct! Interesting on the robo welder. People weld faster.

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Old 05-04-12, 08:33 AM   #18
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"...... my painter ages my 7005 frames and I take my 6061 frames to Industrial Heattreating in Quincy MA. I have an alignment fixture at the HT facility for the 6061 frames."


​Frank, I have a few questions: What is meant by "ages"? Are the 6061 frames completely built and then heat treated in the alignment fixture? What is the configuration of the alignment fixture?

thanks,

Brian
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Old 05-04-12, 03:48 PM   #19
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Yeah, we need a shop tour, cause Frank has some stuff we only dream of.
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Old 05-04-12, 03:49 PM   #20
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That is correct! Interesting on the robo welder. People weld faster.
I wonder what happens when they turn him up to "11".
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Old 05-05-12, 04:33 AM   #21
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"...... my painter ages my 7005 frames and I take my 6061 frames to Industrial Heattreating in Quincy MA. I have an alignment fixture at the HT facility for the 6061 frames."


​Frank, I have a few questions: What is meant by "ages"? Are the 6061 frames completely built and then heat treated in the alignment fixture? What is the configuration of the alignment fixture?

thanks,

Brian

There are two phases to the hardening process for aluminum tubing. First, there is "solution" where the frame is heated to over 900 degrees then quickly cooled. At that point the material is very soft (W condition it's called) but it is slowly beginning to get harder. To achieve full hardness or desired mechanical properties you then need to age the frame at a lower temp (500 or so)

on 6061 both these phases must be done after welding, 7005 only the age is required after welding. I looked for some photos of the alignment table and only found this one. It's a simple tool and lighter than one for aligning hard frames. It is very fast, which is ideal for the situation where it is used. Also,

At this point the frame is barely able to support it's own weight and certainly not the weight of the arbor. That is a trials frame shown in the image also.


22 002 by frankthewelder, on Flickr


here are a few more pics


IMG_2856 by frankthewelder, on Flickr


IMG_2303 by frankthewelder, on Flickr


IMG_2176 by frankthewelder, on Flickr

my troy lee welding hood


weldhood by frankthewelder, on Flickr


29 232 by frankthewelder, on Flickr

Last edited by ftwelder; 05-05-12 at 04:44 AM.
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Old 05-05-12, 01:29 PM   #22
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Drools dripping down. Andy
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Old 05-06-12, 04:34 AM   #23
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Thanks, it's cool right up to clean-up time.
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