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Framebuilders Thinking about a custom frame? Lugged vs Fillet Brazed. Different Frame materials? Newvex or Pacenti Lugs? why get a custom Road, Mountain, or Track Frame? Got a question about framebuilding? Lets discuss framebuilding at it's finest.

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Old 05-17-14, 12:26 AM   #1
yugyug
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braze-ons for caliper and disc brakes?

I'm thinking about getting a steel randonneur style frame made for me sometime later this year and I've been considering my options. I currently ride caliper brakes but I'm intrigued about disk brakes. Does it make sense to get braze-ons for both so I could switch in the future?

I really want a future flexible bike.

Also thinking about getting braze-ons for light fixtures cos I'm interested in doing audax rides, but I don't currently.

In general is it reasonable to have a lot of braze-ons on a bike or am I better off thinking more clearly about what I need now rather than what I might want in the future?

thanks in advance
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Old 05-17-14, 11:11 PM   #2
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hmm...108 views, no replies. Is the question too difficult or too dumb??
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Old 05-18-14, 04:52 AM   #3
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If you think you want disc brakes, get cable guides instead of stops and run full length cable housing to your rear brake until you switch. As far as other braze ons, get everything you think you may need. It's better to have an unused braze on than to have to repaint the bike after adding one later. Most braze ons are very inexpensive to add at the time of the build, but can be very expensive if it includes disassembling the bike and re-painting it.
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Old 05-18-14, 08:23 AM   #4
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Generally, you would want a disk-specific fork (heavier blades and special dropouts) if you wanty to use disk brakes. So you would need to decide beforehand. Otherwise it's not a bad idea to get some specific braze-ons preemptively. It's certainly something you can discuss with the builder.
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Old 05-18-14, 09:38 AM   #5
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Just buy a bike with the components You want , got enough cash the Frame builder will add all the fittings you request ..

Schmidt Has a very clever Right dropout which adds an insulated contact imbedded in the inner face of the dropout, and a special hub to go with it
so no patch cords to unplug when you mend a puncture ..

and the wiring runs up inside the fork blade.

German, Tout Terrain thought thru the disc Brake forces.. by oversizing the left fork blade ..
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Old 05-19-14, 06:42 AM   #6
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I wouldn't get braze ons for caliper brakes on a disc compatible frame. You can get long reach calipers that bolt on that work really well. And if you are using tires bigger than 40mm or so, you probably want to go with disc

The braze ons for disc and caliper are so different that it will be a mess. I would go for disc in that situation. Disc is much different than caliper. You need rear disc clearance and a heavy fork. Having said that, I don't really see the need for disc on a randonneur.
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Old 05-19-14, 07:02 PM   #7
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oh ok cool. thanks all. Yeah I didn't really consider that fork needing to be different for disc brakes, but that makes sense.
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Old 05-19-14, 07:07 PM   #8
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I am going thru a similar thought process as my current ride has cantilevers and we are getting a divorce. I miss the stopping power and better modulation of good caliper brakes. The enhanced modulation of disc brakes over calipers is intriguing to me for randonneuring where one might prefer to descent quickly on roads that they do not know and one encounters a decreasing radius off camber road turn on a descent where better modulation could matter. Nonetheless, my cantis have to go. My problem with disc brakes is the added weight to the frame, fork, and let's not forget the weight of the bits and parts not to mention dirty aerodynamics.
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Old 05-19-14, 07:15 PM   #9
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If I were having a bespoke steel frame crafted, I'd maybe have wires run inside from a front generator to a brazed on mount for the front light. I would use a clip on rear LED light, they are too good and run a long time to steal power from the dynamo and deal with wires. I would have a third set of water bottle mounts under the down tube. I would absolutely have the holes for fender mounts.....few bikes have them anymore and strap-ons aren't for me. I only ride fenders when it is going to rain but having the option is nice
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Old 05-19-14, 07:16 PM   #10
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I am really happy with the stopping power of long reach Tectro dual-pivot brakes. The only thing that discs have over them is the rim wear issue. I put cantilevers on my rando bike and wish I hadn't.

To the OP: if you want lugged construction, I would go with rim brakes. Brazed on center pull brakes make the traditional rando racks fit more easily, but you can use dual pivot brakes too.
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Old 05-20-14, 01:02 PM   #11
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I own 2 bikes that each have Both types .. Disc and Rim/V/Cantilever..

One I use the rim [Magura Hydraulic)brakes , the other I use it, also, as it came, with Disc brakes ..
Bike Friday Pocket Llama.

& an older DIY frame with Mafac Cantilevers ..

For the cantilevers, I adjusted the brakes first by what I chose for the location of the Posts.


Newer cantilevers require a wider post spacing on forks than older ones..

Last edited by fietsbob; 07-03-14 at 10:49 AM.
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Old 05-20-14, 07:26 PM   #12
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If I were having a bespoke steel frame crafted, I'd maybe have wires run inside from a front generator to a brazed on mount for the front light. I would use a clip on rear LED light, they are too good and run a long time to steal power from the dynamo and deal with wires. I would have a third set of water bottle mounts under the down tube. I would absolutely have the holes for fender mounts.....few bikes have them anymore and strap-ons aren't for me. I only ride fenders when it is going to rain but having the option is nice
thanks yeah re: braze-on for the front light is what I was considering. In which case the place would be near the top of one side of the fork, is that right? Any advantage over mounting a light to a front rack, other than not needing the rack?

To answer the others about brakes I think I'm going to stop worrying about disc brakes and stick with long reach calipers. I've used the Tektro's and they are fine but I might go the Grand Cru's at Orange Velo or maybe (just maybe) the Paul Racers (which gives me another braze-on decision to consider).

But just to go back to talking about discs for a second - does it mean that if one wanted to go from calipers to disc brakes on the front, it would be as simple as changing the front fork and wheel completely? Nothing else is required on the frame? And same levers and cables, housing etc?
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Old 05-21-14, 06:25 AM   #13
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I am not sure what you would do to have a brazed on light on a fork, maybe a low-mount braze on for a handlebar stub fitting? If you really are going to do randonneuring with the bike, you should consider the front rack with integrated light mount. Also, make sure it comes with accommodations for fenders

A front disc does only require fork changes. Braze ons for the cable, mounts, heavier blades
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Old 05-21-14, 10:17 AM   #14
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I am really happy with the stopping power of long reach Tectro dual-pivot brakes. The only thing that discs have over them is the rim wear issue. I put cantilevers on my rando bike and wish I hadn't.
Do you mean you prefer the dual pivots over the cantis for stopping power? thanks, Brian
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Old 05-21-14, 12:07 PM   #15
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Do you mean you prefer the dual pivots over the cantis for stopping power? thanks, Brian
yes, the Tektro 559's are much better than the cantis I had for stopping power. I put the bosses a little too low for Paul cantis though, I have used the low end Tektros and Avid shorties. The Tektros are better in all other ways except clearance and how wide they will go when you are taking off the wheel. Of course, that can be a problem, particularly with the shimano brakes. The tektros are reportedly not as good as the similar shimano brakes, but I have no first hand experience. And if the Shimanos are that much better, they must be really good. I have been using the Tektros on my gravel bike, which requires good braking around here -- lots of mountains and good brakes are a requirement
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Old 05-21-14, 12:14 PM   #16
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I, personally, prefer mini-v's over cantilevers, but for tires less than 35mm wide, I'll take dual-pivot brakes over either one.
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Old 05-21-14, 03:51 PM   #17
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since my road bike has pivots installed, its next iteration will feature mini-v's.
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Old 07-03-14, 12:46 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by yugyug View Post
I'm thinking about getting a steel randonneur style frame made for me sometime later this year and I've been considering my options. I currently ride caliper brakes but I'm intrigued about disk brakes. Does it make sense to get braze-ons for both so I could switch in the future? I really want a future flexible bike. Also thinking about getting braze-ons for light fixtures cos I'm interested in doing audax rides, but I don't currently. In general is it reasonable to have a lot of braze-ons on a bike or am I better off thinking more clearly about what I need now rather than what I might want in the future? thanks in advance
Y; If you are having a frame built, adding fittings are that time is fairly easy for the builder to do. If you are after flexibility, then recommend having the frame built like this:

1) Disk brake mount fittings on front and rear (assumes that rear stays and the fork parts are disk brake grade)
2) Cable housing stops for the disks on front and rear
3) Cantilever fittings on front and rear (spec the ones with removable pegs (ask for two sets in case you later lose some))
4) Cable stop bridge on rear seat stays for the rear cantilever (with threaded adjuster and slotted for cable quick release)
5) Discuss with builder things like number of bottle bosses, lighting mounts, kickstand plate, disk diameter, rack attachment points, shifter attachment points, pump pegs, spare spoke holder, use of a dyno hub, how wide a tire you will be able to use, etc., etc.

Hope that helps. Post your thoughts/questions

/K
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Old 07-03-14, 10:55 AM   #19
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Quote:
Also thinking about getting braze-ons for light fixtures cos I'm interested in doing audax rides,
BTW YugYug, look into the new Schmidt SL Dynohubs.. SON SL


there you have the connection to the hub within the inner surface of the dropout.

wiring runs cleanly inside the fork blade..

The axle itself provides the electrical contact,
but then you need to plan ahead and use the right dropout.

http://www.nabendynamo.de/produkte/p...ducts_2014.pdf

Last edited by fietsbob; 07-03-14 at 11:06 AM.
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Old 07-06-14, 08:31 AM   #20
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hey guys I shelved my rando bike project for now - with the builder and components I wanted to use it was just going to be too expensive for my current situation.

Going to return to this page next year when hopefully I can get it back on track. Thanks for all the great info.
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