Phamilton

Howdy.

I bought this bike last year at a yard sale for $8 and put a wheel, tires, and chain from a donor bike on it - but it is too big for me and my hands, arms, and back hurt after riding more than 15-20 minutes or so. It measures 61cm TT, 58cm ST. I usually fit a 56-57cm TT. I've thought about putting swept-back handlebars on it to try and bring the reach closer to what would be comfortable. It is a '95 Schwinn Clear Creek. It seems nice enough, fairly light chromoly frame, two sets of braze-ons, fender and rack mounts, cantis, etc. Hate to get rid of it. Anyone successfully put upright-style bars on an MTB before? Appreciate any advice!

ltxi

Donate it to someone in need....

RushFan2112

exactly what I was going to say. Spread the love and make the world a little better in the process.

Who Dey3334

What he said

blakcloud

I think your idea of putting a swept back bar is a good one. You need to find a bar something like the Wald Cruiser bar 896. Just make sure the clamp diameter matches up with your stem and your good to go. It is around $15 new but go to a co-op or used bike store and see what they can dig up.

Phamilton

Thanks for the replies. I am giving it away - posted it first on my facebook this afternoon. It is #4 for me, and I need to thin the herd to 2 for an upcoming move.

Johnny Mullet

I gave a bike away to someone I thought would at least ride it. I was not out any money or anything, but I had a lot of love in that bike only to find it destroyed. Here's the thread....
https://www.bikeforums.net/mountain-b...eater-mtb.html

So if you have no attachment at all, go for it. If you do, then be careful who you donate it to. I am still upset to this day.

Retro Grouch 

Smart move! The bike is simply too big for you. Anything that you do in an attempt to make it better is probably only going to make it worse.

ltxi

AlmostTrick

That has happened to me too. I've given several bikes away over the years. One guy was a recovering druggie from my parents church, who needed a bike to get to work. I gave him a nice Trek mountain bike with new street tires... my cost over $100. Found out several months later he sold it in pieces to buy dope. Likely no longer has a job either. D'oh!

Thankfully, most give away bike stories are happy. I gave an even nicer Specialized MTB to a guy at my workplace who was riding a Wally bike to work. He still rides it and takes good care of it.

I sell bikes at low cost more often than I give them away for free. I figure the owners will be more likely to care for them.

Stucky

People tend not to appreciate things which they get at no cost. I've learned when trying to find a home for stray animals, always charge a fee; never just give them away [And I've actually seen this in practice- my sister went through about 10 cats and one dog, all of which she got for free- and it wasn't until she paid $40 for her current cat, that she ended up actually keeping it, long-term]

Same with bikes or just about anything else- and usually the people who want/are willing to take/in need of free stuff, are the ones who are irresponsible and make very bad choices- which is why they are in a position to need charity. If they are able-bodied enough, and mentally competent enough to ride a bike....there's no reason that they shouldn't be able to pay their own way.

It's noble to want to help people- but in today's Western world, it is more often the case that one is just enabling a drug addict or alcoholic when "helping the poor".

Cyclosaurus

I used to work with the homeless shelter organization in my area for a number of years. A lot of homeless people use bikes and it makes a big difference for them. Perhaps contact a local organization and see if there is someone who needs a bike and is the right height (I'd guess around 6' or taller).

Phamilton

I, too, have had experiences where I gave something away that ended up not being utilized in The manner I imagined or hoped, but I wonder sometimes if charity is still charity when we place stipulations on the gift. Right now I'm of the mindset that I can't be responsible for what someone does with my charity. If I give a homeless person $5 and they spend it on booze, that's not my fault or my problem. They were going to make that decision whether I gave them the money or they got it from someone else. My responsibility (self-imposed by the way - no religion here) is to give. My experience has been that sometimes the act of giving benefits the giver as much or more than the receiver.

I ended up giving the bike to my brother so that he could have a bike to ride with his sons. He has financial problems due to bad decisions. Hell, he has 4 kids under 10 at 27 years old due to bad decisions. I know and understand the value of bike time with kids so whether or not he actually uses the bike is not important to me. That I am giving is important. That I am helping create an environment of wellness in his family's life is important. Up to him to utilize it.

Want to speak about Western world problems? Thinking that charity is about playing a part in someone's success story, or treating it like an investment.

Stucky

True- but the way I see it, I'd rather thry and help those who truly deserve it and would appreciate it, rather than wasting it on someone who is a druggie or who is in his situation because of his own actions, and who has no plans of changing those actions. Not my fault if they deceive me....but I like to try and use a little diligence so that charity will indeed be charity- as opposed to being wasted.

Phamilton

I used to feel the same way. It wasn't any one thing that helped me change my mind. I imagine you would wish to give freely without the stress of determining who is worthy, and I hope you figure out how someday. Wanting to help people is not noble. I can want to feed the hungry all day long but it does not fill one stomach. I can want to give money to help someone keep their lights on but the utility company does not accept my intentions as currency.

Cyclosaurus

I suspect you have not really worked with poor, homeless, addicts, prisoners, mentally and terminally ill. I have had close personal contact with all of those people, trying to help them. What I learned is that if you only try to help people who "deserve" it, you'll soon turn that into a hurdle almost no one can jump. It's a rationalization used to soothe one's conscience for turning a blind eye to those in need. It's funny, people can lavish gifts, food, etc. on their friends who are as affluent as they are, but turn their nose up at giving someone $1 because they might do something irresponsible with it.

You can tell yourself you just have high standards, but really you don't want the messy reality of helping people who have troubles. I have let homeless people live at my house, tried to help them get sober, keep jobs down. I have visited prisoners' families on Christmas to bring them gifts so that their kids can have a gift from their dad. I think what Phamilton is getting at is that you give because of what is inside you, not the level of virtue that someone else must meet before being "worthy" of your charity. I have known so many selfish, uncharitable people who pretend they are good hearted because they manage to judge everyone they see as unworthy of "wasting" their own surplus of resources on. Many many of the people I gave to, they didn't use it to better themselves. But some did, and you don't know who those people are until you actually give them help. You go in knowing a % of what you do will be wasted, but another % will really do some good. And you accept that cost as worth it. And in most cases, whether or not they went on drinking or drugging or whatever, they had someone treat them like a human being. If you never suffered depression, if you've never been poor yourself, if you've never been treated like dirt, then you probably don't realize how important that is. And why the ***k do you think that poor people can't actually appreciate a gift? Only people with good jobs and stable incomes can do that? Because I am betting you never thought twice about giving gifts to people at the same social status as yourself. But you'll be damned if some poor person is going to use your gift in some way you haven't pre-approved!

The other part of this is that you learned the wrong lesson from your experiences. You say your sister didn't appreciate an animal until she had to pay for one. That's your sister. You discovered a key truth, that if you want to help, I mean really help someone and not just write a check and be able to get back to your life with a clear conscience, you have to get to know them, learn about them, invest in them. Then you find out what they need and do that for them. Some people don't appreciate things until they pay for it. But not all. You took your experience with your sister and made it a universal truth, as if all people behave the exact same way given the same circumstances. I've done a lot of animal rescue and yes, by default you make sure people are willing to pay. But I've paid adoption fees and bought food, cat/dog toys, etc for people I got to know, lonely, elderly, sick, unloved people whose lives were practically transformed by an animal who could love them back. And it was worth every penny to give that to them.

Personally I would say that if your sister can't appreciate a free animal then she doesn't know how to love them anyway. Paying for one just makes them a possession that they can throw away when they're inconvenient. That's what I've learned about us ***hole Americans who think everything is for sale and something is only worth what it's price is in dollars. And the more money you have, the more you look at everything that way. I've found the poorest people are the most generous. Science has actually proved it so, that the wealthier you are, the less charitable you are. I live in a fairly affluent area and there are some incredibly wealthy towns nearby, and there are very poor communities just as close. I've spent lots of time with both kinds of people. The poor people are way more fun, are much more decent people, then most of the rich pr***s.

chasm54

^^What he said. Personally I don't know enough to be able to decide who is and is not "deserving". I do know that most of my own success, such as it is, is down to dumb luck, not merit. Nobody gets to choose their parents, how naturally gifted they are, how they are treated as a child etc. I have no religion, but "there but for the grace of God..." seems to sum it up pretty well.

Stucky

I do not understand that mentality at all. So what you guys are saying, is that you don't care WHY someone is in need- just that someone is in "need" for any reason, is good enough for you? You don't care if they broke their leg committing an armed robbery; or if they're able-bodied and just want to party all night; or if they just want to play the victim, because they know that charity and entitlements are available which will allow them to coast through life?

Personally, I think such "charity" is worse than nio charity at all, as it is just helping the immoral to perpetuate their dysfunctional lifestyles.

Having been raised by a single mother on welfare, I can tell you that I grew-up among such people- and saw from an early age that their problems exist because of their own actions and choices; and not because of what others do or do not do. You can give such people a million dollars, and they'll be back on the soup line in a few months, because their problems are not economic- but rather, their economic conditions are a result of their own actions or lack thereof.

I would rather help the guy who was living responsibly and doing the best he could, who then got nailed by a drunk driver with no insurance; or the family who are doing right, and whose kid gets some kind of major disease. I will not help drug addicts; alcoholics; the lazy; those who procreate like alley-cats or anyone else whose "need" exists because they refuse to practice a reasonable lifestyle. I mean, we live in a welfare state, and STILL it is not enough for such people.

If you guys don't think that this is a moral/philosophical/spiritual issue, then you are to be pitied. If you think that the person who mugged an old lady is just as deserving of your help as the guy who was born with one leg.....and that you are somehow absolved of any responsibility in at least trying to distinguish between the two, then i would say that your motives for charity are not philanthropic, but rather just to be able to participate for your own benefit/appeasement.

If it weren't for such irresponsible charity, most of these people would get their acts together to one degree or another.

How about this: A friend of mine used to employ a skilled auto-body man- and I mean skilled! In the 90's, he was making $250 a day. The guy was (is) a crack-head. He'd spend virtually all of his pay on crack and booze- with a few dollars saved for fast food. He'd sleep in the back room of my friend's shop. He had a girlfriend, with whom he had a kid. The girlfriend would be on the soup line every day; got all sorts of entitlements; subsidized rent; etc. She also dabbled in drugs. Of course, you guys would be perfectly happy to "help" such a prson though.....

Your attitude does not make sense. You absolve people of any responsibility over their own lives, because you somehow seem to think that how one chooses to live their life, should not matter; and that if their choices are not sustainable, that others should fill in the gap- because, I guess, you feel that there is no such thing as morality, and that people should just be able to do as they please, and that if doing as they please results in them not being able to sustain themselves, then others should be burdened to provide for them? It just doesn't make sense.

Personally, I'd rather help animals- they're the innocent victims. If people in an advanced welfare state can not manage to sustain the bare minimums of life, then it is because they simply refuse to.

Phamilton

Yes. I am saying precisely that I don't care WHY someone is in need, being in need is good enough for me to give. This is my choice. Agree with it or not. If you wish to understand the mentality, a couple things I'd advise:

1) contact me privately to continue this discussion off line. This is a bike forum and this has strayed off course of my original post enough and the bike is no longer part of the discussion

2) if you have not done so, spend some time with the poor, disadvantaged, addicts, bad decision makers, etc

3) refrain from making rash statements like "you absolve people of any responsibility over their own lives.." to people (real people, by the way) of whom all you know is a collection of statements they've typed out on a discussion board about bicycles. This sort of statement is inflammatory and not conducive to open, honest communication.

4) consider that money and success may not be the true measure of a human being's worth, i.e. the sum of their financial decisions.

Note that in my case, I am not providing financial assistance, I'm giving the bike to my brother so that he can spend quality time with his kids in a healthy activity. If he can't afford a bike because of other bad decisions, do I then withhold? Do I deny his kids the opportunity to have this quality time with him?

Discussions like this can be fun and relationship forming, but they can also be polarizing and depressing. Your choice how to approach it.

Last post on my own thread.

AlmostTrick

A friend and I were exiting the liquor store with a bag of goodies for a big party. Nearby there was a man with a cardboard "Need money for food" sign. I stopped and reached into my pocket to pull out some money for the panhandler. My friend objects: "Don't do that, he'll just spend it on booze!"

This caused me to pause and rethink our transaction. I then reached into the bag and handed the man a bottle. "There, now he can use his money for food!"

Stucky

Just one more thing...I'm going to go out and buy an UBER-expensive new bike; and some of the fanciest carbon wheels known to man; and a powermeter, and all those other gadgets which seem to be so necessary for bike-riding these days; and I'm going to pay cash for it all. That'll really put a damper on my cash flow, as I don't make much money, and get paid sporadically- so will you send me money so that I will be able to continue to eat? (I'm working on my pand-handling sign right now! It's gonna say "Will track-stand for power-bars")

Discussions like this can be polarizing AND fun.......I always like to see how others think- even if I don't agree with them.

Now, to rtesume our regularly-scheduled thread......

ltxi

Your story has touched me! I would be most happy to contribute. Simply email reply me with the quantity of USD required and your paypal account id and password and funds will be immediately forthcoming and deposited.

Kuery Raauisi
Minister of Nicaraguan Financial Affairs

FRANK CANNON

Lol at 5,000 word posts about this bike.

Put it in the trash junk guys will recycle it.

jeichelberg87

You have absolutely ZERO proof of this statement, as it relies on humanity for proof. When it comes to humanity, there is only one thing that remains consistent. Inconsistency. Nothing is measured in terms of absolutes. The words "always," and "never," cease to exist, for nothing is 100 percent.

Stucky

As I've mentioned, I grew-up among the bottom rung- believe me, I've fully witnessed their behavior- and if there is one common aspect to it, it is consistency! When finally faced with the prospect of starving, or of not being able to pay the cell-phone bill; or of not being able to buy booze or drugs.....people seem to all of a sudden acquire the ability to take care of themselves- but as long as there are entitlements and charities and endless freebies, most of these people are just content to scrape along and do whatever is necessary to avail themselves of such things. Much like a relative of mine, who in his middle-age, works at a minimum-wage fast food job. He was offered a job which paid 50% more, and wasn't interested in it, because to take it would mean losing a lot of the free entitltements which he receives for himself and his fambly.

You people would think a lot differently if you actually KNEW some of the people on whom you bestow charity. Believe me, I've seen it all- from the former slums of Brooklyn to "dark side" relatives.... The stories I could tell you (Maybe we should start a thread in an appropriate place?). It's easy to romanitcize the situation if you only see it in passing- but reality is quite different.

You see: Some poor woman with 6 kids.
The reality: A woman who has a baby every 2 years by whomever(the sperm donor doesn't matter) because she knows that doing so will ensure that she can get more in "benefits' than what you earn, and that she can abide the next 25 years without being 'pestered" to get a job, until she is too old for them to bother her about such things anymore, or her "disability"[probably for a worn-out vaj] or lawsuit comes through [You know, from that time she was "discriminated against" for bringing her 10 kids into the liquor store....].

Ignorance is bliss.