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Drivers License to Ride a Bike on Road?

Old 11-29-15, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Chief
so much fail in one sentence!
So much of failed in your sentence when you conveniently left out where I said it's my opinion. And besides Chief, why shouldn't you carry an ID? Go ahead and put that mouth to use and tell us your opinion why people shouldn't have to carry ID. And make it your ideas not some BS you read off the internet, if you're going tell then own it.
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Old 11-29-15, 01:49 PM
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
So much of failed in your sentence when you conveniently left out where I said it's my opinion. And besides Chief, why shouldn't you carry an ID? Go ahead and put that mouth to use and tell us your opinion why people shouldn't have to carry ID. And make it your ideas not some BS you read off the internet, if you're going tell then own it.
The opinion of the United States Supreme Court
https://supreme.justia.com/cases/fed.../352/case.html
HIIBEL v. SIXTH JUDICIAL DIST. COURT OF NEV.,HUMBOLDT CTY. [03-5554] | FindLaw
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"When I hear another express an opinion, which is not mine, I say to myself, He has a right to his opinion, as I to mine; why should I question it. His error does me no injury, and shall I become a Don Quixot to bring all men by force of argument, to one opinion? If a fact be misstated, it is probable he is gratified by a belief of it, and I have no right to deprive him of the gratification."

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Old 11-29-15, 03:11 PM
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My opinion sort of matches the Supreme Court's in this case ... citizens are considered to be A.) sovereign and B.)m innocent unless facts indicate otherwise, and thus have no reason to need to identify themselves on demand with a government-issued photo ID.

It all depends on whether you start from a point of the basic individual being free and voluntarily conjoining with others to form a community, or consider the community to be more important than the rights of the individual.

Considering that the nation of The United States of America was founded upon and was about the first major nation to encode the Rights of the Individual in its formative document, I'd say individual freedom is the hallmark feature of the nation, and alternate views are pretty basically un-American.

The police officer is a Public Servant and as such has no power over any citizen except when that citizen surrenders his right to legal protection by breaking the law. The idea that we should all bow down or bend over for LEOs ... well, certain posters here sound very much like the offspring or in some way relatives of LEOs, which is all good. Whatever.

As I have said repeatedly, I respect LEOs in general, and accept that in the specific they are just human beings with all the attendant faults and flaws, strengths and weaknesses, and they are often placed in high-stress situations, and also, that they tend to be doing a job I really do want done (that is, protecting me, my stuff, and all my loved ones and the social structure which allows all of us to live such free lives.)

On the other other hand, there is that apocryphal Ben Franklin quote about those who surrender liberty for safety get neither.

Rather a cogent sig, bhchdh.
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Old 11-29-15, 05:33 PM
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I see, you couldn't come up with your own reasons. Like I said before my discussion was purely my own opinion and I didn't care what the law said, and I still don't according to my opinion which I'm am entitled to and this subject matter was based on people sharing their opinions and that's my opinion, right or wrong it's still my opinion and I will gladly own it. You on the other hand can't own it because you have no thoughts just some laws, but laws can become antiquated, and in today's world I think the ID law is antiquated.

At one time automotive drivers could drive for many years without a license, eventually that law became antiquated, but I know there were a bunch of people upset about it just as you are about the idea of having to carry an ID while riding or walking on public areas. And I feel that not having to carry an ID while riding or whatever in a public area is as antiquated as during the old law of no drivers license id was required time period.

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Old 11-29-15, 05:59 PM
  #105  
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
I don't understand this cop bashing crap. Cops have the toughest job in the world, they have to deal with the worst of us and do so day in and day out, year after year and then have to deal with the politics of the community and the department, then have to watch know criminals get off on light sentences. Cops suffer from more on the job stress (known as PTSD) than any other occupation, divorce is the highest of any occupation. Read this for more insight on this occupation: https://www.soc.umn.edu/~samaha/cases/police_stress.htm https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0926105029.htm

And while some of you are bashing cops you expect them to save your life and those of your family should a gun man threaten you or them and put their lives in front of yours, which they do day in and day out yet we don't hear the news of all the times a cop puts his life on the line, just when a cop finally blows a fuse from stress and does something wrong that they regret and will have to live with that stress of knowing that for the rest of their lives and then the news sensationalizes it. A cop is a human being not a superhuman factory made robots as Dave Cutter said, and as a human being most have a finite breaking point due to the stress, this is usually taken out on the women that they love, but when it gets really bad they take it out on a citizen, usually a citizen that is trouble maker. Cops that are employed by large cities are the ones especially susceptible to on the job stress, small little 20,000 population towns not so much, most of these types suffer from boredom, and on top of the stress of being a cop in a large city, just living not even as a cop in a large city is more stressful than living in a small town, so the cop gets stressed from two different angles.

So the next time you get pulled over be extremely nice to the cop, ask them how there day is going, keep your hands on the steering wheel the whole time from when the cop exits his car and don't move them until the cop ask for you ID and registration, then before you move your hands tell the cop your id is in your wallet in your purse or back pocket and ask permission to retrieve it slowly, then hands back on the steering wheel after you gave them the ID and ask permission again to retrieve your car and insurance papers out of the glove box and retrieve it slowly then hands back on the steering wheel and remain there until you get your papers back and have to sign the ticket. Then thank the cop for doing such a great job for the community even though you may be hating the idea of receiving a ticket, but they're just doing their job to enforce the law that you failed to do your job at keeping, and offer to shake their hand by extending yours. You would be surprise if you do those steps I outlined here how many cops will let you go without a ticket.
It is nice to know you haven't really dealt with cops in any bad situation and probably live in some fantasy world lit up by the television or you live in Mayberry! However we are in the real world and cops don't have a very tough job most days. They have an easy job, they sit around getting free or reduced price food, they can run red lights whenever they want or speed if they so choose. When they have nothing to do, they play on their laptops or just stand around wasting taxpayer money. They can make up any law they want, whenever they want and pretty much do or say whatever they please. Most of the cops I have met (and I have met quite a few) seem to be lower IQ types who have an interest in controlling others.

You want a really rough job, try a barista in a big city, you work for little money, you are sometimes forced to close and then open waking up extremely early and dealing with rude and nasty customers one after the other making ridiculous orders and a huge mess you have to clean up. You are constantly running and you have no power to do anything and if you are rude or do something back at the customer you get yelled at by managers and fired. Drugs tend to be rampant through some of these places (I have had many friends who worked at Starbucks and they all say the same things luckily one of my friends has been sober for 11 years after working there)

Or you could be a slaughterhouse worker which has high rates of spousal abuse, substance abuse and PTSD. Not to mention the huge dangerous machinery and the fact if you expose what they are doing inside you could face jail or worse they might just kill you (which is why they use a lot of undocumented labor with little English skills). The pay is also quite horrible as is the stench of death and toxins in the air which will make you sick.

Maybe if you took off your rose colored glasses you would see the police for who they really are! They aren't good people, they are cowards with way to much power and no regulation who have a pretty cush job. The few times I have needed a cop, in each situation they were pretty useless, so I just protect myself now and try and avoid police. After seeing what police have done over the years and looking at history, I cannot trust the police and it is sad you still do. My guess though is though you won't respond to the points I made either just as you have done with skye because you have no good response because you cannot really defend them.
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Old 11-29-15, 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
I don't understand this cop bashing crap. Cops have the toughest job in the world, they have to deal with the worst of us and do so day in and day out, year after year and then have to deal with the politics of the community and the department, then have to watch know criminals get off on light sentences. Cops suffer from more on the job stress (known as PTSD) than any other occupation, divorce is the highest of any occupation. Read this for more insight on this occupation: https://www.soc.umn.edu/~samaha/cases/police_stress.htm https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0926105029.htm

And while some of you are bashing cops you expect them to save your life and those of your family should a gun man threaten you or them and put their lives in front of yours, which they do day in and day out yet we don't hear the news of all the times a cop puts his life on the line, just when a cop finally blows a fuse from stress and does something wrong that they regret and will have to live with that stress of knowing that for the rest of their lives and then the news sensationalizes it. A cop is a human being not a superhuman factory made robots as Dave Cutter said, and as a human being most have a finite breaking point due to the stress, this is usually taken out on the women that they love, but when it gets really bad they take it out on a citizen, usually a citizen that is trouble maker. Cops that are employed by large cities are the ones especially susceptible to on the job stress, small little 20,000 population towns not so much, most of these types suffer from boredom, and on top of the stress of being a cop in a large city, just living not even as a cop in a large city is more stressful than living in a small town, so the cop gets stressed from two different angles.

So the next time you get pulled over be extremely nice to the cop, ask them how there day is going, keep your hands on the steering wheel the whole time from when the cop exits his car and don't move them until the cop ask for you ID and registration, then before you move your hands tell the cop your id is in your wallet in your purse or back pocket and ask permission to retrieve it slowly, then hands back on the steering wheel after you gave them the ID and ask permission again to retrieve your car and insurance papers out of the glove box and retrieve it slowly then hands back on the steering wheel and remain there until you get your papers back and have to sign the ticket. Then thank the cop for doing such a great job for the community even though you may be hating the idea of receiving a ticket, but they're just doing their job to enforce the law that you failed to do your job at keeping, and offer to shake their hand by extending yours. You would be surprise if you do those steps I outlined here how many cops will let you go without a ticket.
+1 on your post.

Police bashing dont belong on this forum.
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Old 11-29-15, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by rydabent
+1 on your post. Police bashing dont belong on this forum.
I wholly agree and I am really glad I haven't seen any.
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Old 11-29-15, 06:57 PM
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Originally Posted by rydabent
+1 on your post.

Police bashing dont belong on this forum.
Thank you! I use to live in Los Angeles California, and I knew cops there, they rode bikes with us, one was on our race team and through him I met a lot of cops and sheriff deputies, I didn't meet one bad cop. I've said this before, I know there are bad cops in the field, just as their bad employees in any field of occupation, why would anyone expect that all cops wear angel wings? But even most bad cops will protect the innocent with their lives if called on to do so.

Free or reduced food...SO WHAT! I've paid for cops meals before, does that make me a member of the mafia looking for favors? LOL!!! My God get real. Wasting taxpayers money? Fine, for those that believe that then do the rest of us a favor, the next time you need their services don't call 911 and waste our taxpayers money, especially since the attitude of those that hate cops around here will give them every bit of lip service they can, so save the cops the grief and don't bother calling for their help. Rose color glasses my arse, you cop haters are looking through solid black lenses!
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Old 11-29-15, 07:23 PM
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Are Cyclists Required to Carry Identification? | Arizona Bike Law
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Old 11-30-15, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
So much of failed in your sentence when you conveniently left out where I said it's my opinion. And besides Chief, why shouldn't you carry an ID? Go ahead and put that mouth to use and tell us your opinion why people shouldn't have to carry ID. And make it your ideas not some BS you read off the internet, if you're going tell then own it.
Remember there is no state that requires you to carry a drivers license. So-------------do as I do wear a road ID or have a dog tag on your bike as I do, with name phone number and blood type on it. It is all you need period.
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Old 11-30-15, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by veganbikes
It is nice to know you haven't really dealt with cops in any bad situation and probably live in some fantasy world lit up by the television or you live in Mayberry! However we are in the real world and cops don't have a very tough job most days. They have an easy job, they sit around getting free or reduced price food, they can run red lights whenever they want or speed if they so choose. When they have nothing to do, they play on their laptops or just stand around wasting taxpayer money. They can make up any law they want, whenever they want and pretty much do or say whatever they please. Most of the cops I have met (and I have met quite a few) seem to be lower IQ types who have an interest in controlling others.

You want a really rough job, try a barista in a big city, you work for little money, you are sometimes forced to close and then open waking up extremely early and dealing with rude and nasty customers one after the other making ridiculous orders and a huge mess you have to clean up. You are constantly running and you have no power to do anything and if you are rude or do something back at the customer you get yelled at by managers and fired. Drugs tend to be rampant through some of these places (I have had many friends who worked at Starbucks and they all say the same things luckily one of my friends has been sober for 11 years after working there)

Or you could be a slaughterhouse worker which has high rates of spousal abuse, substance abuse and PTSD. Not to mention the huge dangerous machinery and the fact if you expose what they are doing inside you could face jail or worse they might just kill you (which is why they use a lot of undocumented labor with little English skills). The pay is also quite horrible as is the stench of death and toxins in the air which will make you sick.

Maybe if you took off your rose colored glasses you would see the police for who they really are! They aren't good people, they are cowards with way to much power and no regulation who have a pretty cush job. The few times I have needed a cop, in each situation they were pretty useless, so I just protect myself now and try and avoid police. After seeing what police have done over the years and looking at history, I cannot trust the police and it is sad you still do. My guess though is though you won't respond to the points I made either just as you have done with skye because you have no good response because you cannot really defend them.
So---------------who are you going to call if someone breaks into your house, or does a hit and run job on you? I would be willing to bet you call the "not good people" police.
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Old 11-30-15, 10:51 AM
  #112  
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Originally Posted by rydabent
So---------------who are you going to call if someone breaks into your house, or does a hit and run job on you? I would be willing to bet you call the "not good people" police.
Ghostbusters "duh nuh nah nah nah nah..." On a serious note I wouldn't need to call anyone but my knives or my guns. Though I live in a pretty decent neighborhood that happens to be low in crime.

The times I have actually called police, they have been less than helpful so I don't rely on them and don't really need too. People seem to think "oh you hate police but when you need them, huh huh huh".

I am happy to take you up on the bet, because you will lose and I can always use more money for bike parts ; )
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Old 11-30-15, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
why would anyone expect that all cops wear angel wings?
I wouldn't expect that but I would expect them to not murder the citizens they're supposed to protect (over 1,000 killed this year), which happens far more often in the US than it happens in basically any western country, where it just doesn't happen at all.
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Old 11-30-15, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
Agreed 1000%

I think the next time Skye is in trouble and needs cop protection he should instead call the garbage man to come help him, he might find that more to his liking instead of some lousy psychological whacked drunken divorced maniac cop that just wants to kill him.
Having seen the police around here in action, it is difficult for me to picture a situation in which calling the cops for help would improve things. I'm more comfortable -- and safer -- relying on myself and my family.
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Old 11-30-15, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by veganbikes
Ghostbusters "duh nuh nah nah nah nah..." On a serious note I wouldn't need to call anyone but my knives or my guns. Though I live in a pretty decent neighborhood that happens to be low in crime.

The times I have actually called police, they have been less than helpful so I don't rely on them and don't really need too. People seem to think "oh you hate police but when you need them, huh huh huh".

I am happy to take you up on the bet, because you will lose and I can always use more money for bike parts ; )
Now all this arguing makes sense to me, you're a tough guy. Wait, except one small problem, let's say the you shoot an intruder, guess what tough guy, the cops will be coming to your house, so are you going to play your tough guy attitude on them if that happens? I have a feeling YOU are going to lose that one. Of course you could always bury the intruder in your backyard and whistle "Yankee Doodle Dandy" while you're doing it so the neighbors won't think anything is going on and never call the cops. Yeah, I could see you doing that.
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Old 11-30-15, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by PepeM
I wouldn't expect that but I would expect them to not murder the citizens they're supposed to protect (over 1,000 killed this year), which happens far more often in the US than it happens in basically any western country, where it just doesn't happen at all.
Let me get this straight, over 1,000 innocent citizens were shot to death by cops, innocent citizens just out for a stroll pushing their baby buggies, please show me proof that the cops have shot over 1,000 innocent citizens for no reason whatsoever except maybe for target practice.
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Old 11-30-15, 11:47 AM
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Never said anything like that, did I? Innocent or not, they are citizens and in most cases their crimes are not death penalty worthy and even if they were, they deserve a fair trial. That is, of course, ignoring the ones that have actually not done anything and been shot regardless.

I'm not a 'cop hater' but there are many issues with how the judicial system works in the US, and law enforcement is a big part of it.
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Old 11-30-15, 11:51 AM
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Because I'm white, I stand out when I go places where everyone else is Black. Because I'm a white guy hanging out in a place that scares deputies, they honored me by giving me the "Black" treatment, i.e. pulled over for no reason, just so they can run a warrant check.

This was a violation of the 4th Amendment (Supreme Court, Terry v. Ohio, 1968). I filed a formal complaint, denied. I asked the officer who denied the complaint, was he telling me the Supreme Court is WRONG ABOUT THE 4TH AMENDMENT? He said, yes, they were. He was in effect overruling the SCOTUS.

The deputies retaliated against me for filing a complaint. I was easy to spot, driving a commercial vehicle with my name in three-foot letters. The pulled me over again on a bogus seat-belt violation, frisked my Black passengers and were going to frisk me, but I beat them to it. I dropped my jeans to the ground, flashed the deputy on the road side, while my two Black friends laughed their a$$es off. First time I made a cop so mad he cried! He searched the vehicle even though I told him I did not grant permission, didn't find anything criminal. Later I beat the seat-belt charge in court, and the judge admonished the officer who pulled me over for lying in court.

I know when an officer is entitled to ID and when he isn't. Justice Byron "Whizzer" White clarified that in his concurring opinion in Terry v. Ohio:

"There is nothing in the Constitution which prevents a policeman from addressing questions to anyone on the streets. Absent special circumstances, the person approached may not be detained or frisked but may refuse to cooperate and go on his way. However, given the proper circumstances, such as those in this case, it seems to me the person may be briefly detained against his will while pertinent questions are directed to him. Of course, the person stopped is not obliged to answer, answers may not be compelled, and refusal to answer furnishes no basis for an arrest, although it may alert the officer to the need for continued observation.
I have on a number of occasions refused to identify myself to a police officer who is not entitled at that time to that information. If a cop asks you for identification, just ask if you will be arrested if you don't provide it. If he says no, don't tell him who you are. Police have no business monitoring lawful activities by having law abiding citizens identify themselves.

I will be 70 y.o. in two weeks, US Army veteran (E-5, Honorable Discharge), and I have never been arrested.
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Old 11-30-15, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by PepeM
Never said anything like that, did I? Innocent or not, they are citizens and in most cases their crimes are not death penalty worthy and even if they were, they deserve a fair trial. That is, of course, ignoring the ones that have actually not done anything and been shot regardless.

I'm not a 'cop hater' but there are many issues with how the judicial system works in the US, and law enforcement is a big part of it.
So what you're saying is that those 1000 plus people were not innocent at all, starting to get a clearer image here of why you would bring this up, that in fact they were criminals in the act of doing a criminal activity, therefore cops should allow themselves to be shot first before they should shoot the criminal? Would that be fair for you?
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Old 11-30-15, 01:31 PM
  #120  
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
... that in fact they were criminals in the act of doing a criminal activity, therefore cops should allow themselves to be shot first before they should shoot the criminal? Would that be fair for you?
Dude, when you say stupid stuff like this you only hurt yourself.

Sorry, but there have been numerous security-cam videotapes and cellphone videos of cops shooting innocent people which have turned up in the past few years. Anyone who occasionally glances at the news has seen them. So yes ... Cops in America Do on occasion shoot innocent people for no good reason, and with no prior threat. Not often, but it is very real and in fact, a fair number have been convicted, which pretty much kills your BS argument.

I am pro-cop, but much more pro-Truth. And so should be every cop and every citizen, right?
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Old 11-30-15, 02:43 PM
  #121  
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
So what you're saying is that those 1000 plus people were not innocent at all
That is not what I said.

Originally Posted by rekmeyata
in fact they were criminals in the act of doing a criminal activity, therefore cops should allow themselves to be shot first before they should shoot the criminal? Would that be fair for you?
'Therefore' in there suggests that the second sentence is a consequence of the first, which does not make any sense. Learn to reason properly and then we can discuss.
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Old 11-30-15, 03:09 PM
  #122  
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
Let me get this straight, over 1,000 innocent citizens were shot to death by cops, innocent citizens just out for a stroll pushing their baby buggies, please show me proof that the cops have shot over 1,000 innocent citizens for no reason whatsoever except maybe for target practice.
Originally Posted by rekmeyata
Now all this arguing makes sense to me, you're a tough guy. Wait, except one small problem, let's say the you shoot an intruder, guess what tough guy, the cops will be coming to your house, so are you going to play your tough guy attitude on them if that happens? I have a feeling YOU are going to lose that one. Of course you could always bury the intruder in your backyard and whistle "Yankee Doodle Dandy" while you're doing it so the neighbors won't think anything is going on and never call the cops. Yeah, I could see you doing that.
Originally Posted by rekmeyata
Thank you! I use to live in Los Angeles California, and I knew cops there, they rode bikes with us, one was on our race team and through him I met a lot of cops and sheriff deputies, I didn't meet one bad cop. I've said this before, I know there are bad cops in the field, just as their bad employees in any field of occupation, why would anyone expect that all cops wear angel wings? But even most bad cops will protect the innocent with their lives if called on to do so.

Free or reduced food...SO WHAT! I've paid for cops meals before, does that make me a member of the mafia looking for favors? LOL!!! My God get real. Wasting taxpayers money? Fine, for those that believe that then do the rest of us a favor, the next time you need their services don't call 911 and waste our taxpayers money, especially since the attitude of those that hate cops around here will give them every bit of lip service they can, so save the cops the grief and don't bother calling for their help. Rose color glasses my arse, you cop haters are looking through solid black lenses!
Originally Posted by rekmeyata
I see, you couldn't come up with your own reasons. Like I said before my discussion was purely my own opinion and I didn't care what the law said, and I still don't according to my opinion which I'm am entitled to and this subject matter was based on people sharing their opinions and that's my opinion, right or wrong it's still my opinion and I will gladly own it. You on the other hand can't own it because you have no thoughts just some laws, but laws can become antiquated, and in today's world I think the ID law is antiquated.

At one time automotive drivers could drive for many years without a license, eventually that law became antiquated, but I know there were a bunch of people upset about it just as you are about the idea of having to carry an ID while riding or walking on public areas. And I feel that not having to carry an ID while riding or whatever in a public area is as antiquated as during the old law of no drivers license id was required time period.
Originally Posted by rekmeyata
So much of failed in your sentence when you conveniently left out where I said it's my opinion. And besides Chief, why shouldn't you carry an ID? Go ahead and put that mouth to use and tell us your opinion why people shouldn't have to carry ID. And make it your ideas not some BS you read off the internet, if you're going tell then own it.
Well, earlier, I was going to reply with a well-written explanation of my opinion based on life experience, knowledge of history, and an innate desire for freedom, but at this point, I'm afraid it will be wasted on you. Sorry.
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Old 11-30-15, 04:53 PM
  #123  
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
Now all this arguing makes sense to me, you're a tough guy. Wait, except one small problem, let's say the you shoot an intruder, guess what tough guy, the cops will be coming to your house, so are you going to play your tough guy attitude on them if that happens? I have a feeling YOU are going to lose that one. Of course you could always bury the intruder in your backyard and whistle "Yankee Doodle Dandy" while you're doing it so the neighbors won't think anything is going on and never call the cops. Yeah, I could see you doing that.
Actually I have the castle doctrine where I live and generally I wouldn't want to shoot someone unless I had to. My goal would be to scare the crap out of them and get them to leave. If I did shoot them then yes more than likely I would unfortunately have to talk to police but unlike you I wouldn't feel the need to kiss them and shower them with gifts because they are so damn perfect.

I wouldn't consider myself a tough person, just someone fed up with the police like much of the rest of the world.
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Old 11-30-15, 05:02 PM
  #124  
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata
Let me get this straight, over 1,000 innocent citizens were shot to death by cops, innocent citizens just out for a stroll pushing their baby buggies, please show me proof that the cops have shot over 1,000 innocent citizens for no reason whatsoever except maybe for target practice.
Regardless of what the 1000 people may or may not have been doing it is NOT the job of the police to be the judge, the jury and the executioner. Your perfect do no wrong police have shot people on the autism spectrum, children and homeless veterans for cripes sakes! Your job a cop is to keep the peace not to use your gun (or other weapons) as a court of law!
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Old 11-30-15, 06:15 PM
  #125  
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Originally Posted by fietsbob
Anyone looked up their state vehicle codes Yet to read what Laws apply?
I did. The V C requires it in my state only if you are driving. It is sketchy if you are on a bicycle because you don't need one to ride one but they can be ruled as a vehicle. None the less the police can ask for you legal name and they can then verify that name against the state data base and determine if you have a license.

I understand 27 states have a stop and identify statute and those officers might request you license as identification. People have to check to see if they are in one of those 27.
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