DeathTongue

Hello all, I was looking for some info on bicycle tubes, and since I couldn't find anything I thought why not join another forum? Anyhoo, here I am and I hope some of you kind folks can give me some tips. My youngest son is 10 years old and weighs about 130 (which is a lot, his 11 year old brother only weighs 65 and is an inch taller). He is really hard on big box store bicycle tires, and instead of buying an expensive bike that would probably have the same issue, I was hoping a solution would be to get better tubes for the tires. Is that an option with tubes? Or are they all about the same? Right now he has a 20 inch Schwinn that's about 3 years old, and in perfect shape except for the tires, and I just bought him a Razor Serpent last year - same story, the bike is great except for the life span of about 2 weeks on the tires and tubes. If there are better tubes out there, which ones are the best? Or, would solid inner tire supports be better, and would it be about the same as riding a bike with regular tubes? thanks in advance for any suggestions!

fietsbob

(I didn't read the mass of single-Spaced run-on text)

HD Tubes, they're roughly $15 at bike shops*
.. AKA Thorn Resistant tubes .
* Don't Have One? No shops around? the Below will sell online/Mail Order
[Seems like you commit to buying it (add to Cart) then, they price It]

I use them in my Bike Trailer wheels ..

Its still the tire casing doing much of the work ..
but if they're thrashing tires I wouldn't blow $60 each .

Inner Tube has no structure all strength of its own.. any more than a Balloon does.

JonathanGennick 

Is he pinch-flatting? Do you tend to see pairs of holes when you look at the tubes?

More air pressure can help. You might also try an extra thick tube like the following:

Dans Heavy Duty Tube at Dan's Comp

Buy a patch kit too, and teach him how to patch his own tubes. Throw some responsibility back onto him by making him help w/the patch work. Patching is a good skill for him to have anyway.

And some kids are just very hard on bikes.

OldsCOOL

I also say more psi. Reference the max psi on the sidewall and cram it in there.

SkyDog75

It's hard to say whether a different tube would help without knowing exactly how your son's tubes are getting punctured.

Is he getting pinhole-type punctures along the contact patch of the tire, as if he ran something sharp over? If so, there are some extra-thick "thorn resistant" tubes out there that add some extra puncture resistance, but only because something like a thorn or tack would have to be long enough to reach through the extra thickness of the rubber. They're not really any tougher; just thicker. There are also tubes pre-filled with sealant like "Slime" that can help self-seal some punctures, but again, if that's not the type of flat you're seeing, these tubes won't do you any good.

Or is he getting "snake bite" punctures? These show up on the side of the tube as a pair of holes and are the result of "pinch flats" due to underinflation. If a tire isn't inflated sufficiently to support the weight of the rider, the sidewall of the tire and tube can get pinched between the rim and the road, especially when doing things like jumping curbs or hitting the edge of a pothole. The solution in this case isn't a different tube, but rather to put more pressure in the tire to keep from pinching the tire/tube sidewall.

eastbay71

Full grown adults ride bikes (folding bikes, BMX) with 20" tires all the time. This has nothing to do with the weight of the rider. Other posters have already mentioned possible pinch flats which would result from under inflation of the tire. Keep in mind that tires lose air all the time and require frequently. If your son is not chcking his tire pressure at least weekly this could be your mainissue.

If you're getting repeated flats with the same tire try running your finger around the inside of the tire casing to find out if there is something sharp inside the tire. It works best if you can use a pair of thin cotton gloves to find the snag. I've found a number of surprising things inside my tire's carcasses including staples and thorns that can cause repeated flats if not removed.

BlazingPedals

A 130 pound rider's weight isn't what's destroying the tubes and tires. I weigh more than that and my tires last for thousands of miles.

JanMM

Agree that 130 pounds is not heavy considering that I am at 185 and ride two bikes with 20" front wheels, one of which is a tandem. Are the tires wearing out immediately or are the tubes the problem? Thorn-resistant tubes mentioned earlier would have the added benefit of being somewhat less porous and losing air more slowly than thinner, normal tubes.

FBinNY 

The tube doesn't make any difference at all. It's just a shaped rubber balloon that fills the available space within the tire and keeps the air from escaping.

In any case, while your son may be heavy for his afe or height, he's not at all heavy for 20" tires which have been used for adult folding bikes for ages, and can easily handle riders weighing well over 200#s.

If you don't have specific issues, don't fret. If you do have issues, they're more likely due to under inflation than anything else.

Otherwise, feel free to post your specific issue and somebody will offer sound advice.

indyfabz

Don' feed the....

10 Wheels

Hey OP,

Get a Good Floor Pump and make sure The Kid pumps the tires up to max PSI before every ride.

The problem is Not the tubes.

CliffordK

Is the kid ready for 24" or 26"?

Teach the kid not to skid. The next tires come from his allowance.

hoodat

One valuable habit he should learn is to watch the road ahead for possible hazards like nails, screws, broken bottles etc. It's surprising how much trash ends up in bicycle lanes. It is less time and trouble to stop and clear the hazard than it is to patch a flat.
I agree that he should fix his own flats. That will stop a lot of it. At 10 he may not be able to dismount the tire but he can do the rest.

hoodat

One other thought. Check out how he is using the bike. If he is trying to use a street bike off road get him a bike that is appropriate for that use.

VegasTriker

Order him a pair of these: Tioga PowerBlock S-Spec Tire - 20" x 1.4", Wire Bead, Black $14.07 each from Niagara Cycle Tioga PowerBlock S-Spec Tire - 20" x 1.4", Wire Bead, Black or in a larger width Tioga Power Block 20x1.60 Steel They are intended for BMX bikes but achieved an incredible 6,000 miles on my recumbent trike before the cord began to show. His weight is not a factor. Lots of kids weigh 130 pounds and ride 20" wheel BMX bikes. I absolutely hate those horrible "puncture proof tubes" because they weigh a ton. If I get a used bike with them in the tires, it's the first thing that goes into the trash.

DeathTongue

UPDATE: I finally got around to installing the Hutchinson heavy duty tubes I bought a while back, and the back tire was flat within 10 minutes of riding. I'm starting to think the problem may be with the tires, which look a little weather worn even though the bike is only a year old. I inflated the tires to the max on the sidewall - 40 psi - and they held air great until he tried to ride the bike, then it's no go pretty quick. I'm thinking about buying some Maxxis Hookworm BMX tires for about $21 each, which can go to 110 psi and trying those - do you think that would do it, or could the problem be the wheel itself? By the way, this is a pretty cheap Razor bicycle ($120), but it seems pretty solidly built, not sure about the wheels though. Any help=thanks mucho!!

Homebrew01

Chronic flats can be caused by:
- Glass, wire, sharp stone stuck in the tire, flatting each tube.
- Poor technique installing the tire, causing small hole
- Rim strip on wheel slipped out of place, exposing spoke hole which cuts the tube.

You can use a cotton ball around the inside of the tire to see if it catches on anything.

You can also line up the label on the tire, with the valve. Then when removing the tire and tube, find the hole and match up with the tire to look for a cause.

BlazingPedals

If you want to fix this situation, you need to determine exactly what is causing the flats. It's not the kid's weight, and it's not the way he's riding unless he's jumping off cliffs or slamming into curbs at speed. Check where the holes in the tube are happening. If it's on the tread side of the tube, look for something stuck in the tire and poking through to the tube. You can check by running a rag around the inside of the tire. Use the rag because if you use your fingers, you can find the sharp whatever-it-is by following the trail of blood backwards. If the hole is on the rim side of the tube, then it's caused by a bad rim strip or a burr in the rim. Look for any sharp edge - all the spoke holes should be protected by rim tape; if not, the spoke will poke a hole or the edge will cut the tube.

If you really can't find the source of the flats, then replace the tire on the theory that there's some wire or glass embedded where you can't see it but where it can poke holes in the tube when the tire gets inflated.

DeathTongue

hmmm, I'm getting that there are not really any easy fixes here that are mainly composed of me ordering something. Well, I'm up to a challenge, if I can work on my car, I guess I should be able to figure out this bike. Although, when I was a kid, if my bike got a flat I wanted a new bike, so I've never really even taken a rear wheel off before I did this one - and that back brake is not on my good list. I guess I'll just take that wheel off and see if I can see where the problem is, then give the wheel a good inspection with the tire off. Once the wheel is checked out, I'm going to go with the Maxxis tires and some new tubes. I could even swap some wheels from a huffy without a freewheel if I need to, so maybe with all the parts around here I can get a bike going that he can ride. thanks for all the tips!!

One other thing - do I need to get some tape for the inside of the wheel? I really have no idea what the normal supplies for bike maintenance should be.

CliffordK

If you have something like a shard of glass or piece of wire embedded in the tire, then it might not make a hole until the bike s ridden on, or perhaps the hole will expand quickly.

If you're truly at your wits end, then you might consider the Tannus solid tires.

Tannus no flat tubeless bicycle tire information
Purchase Tannus Aither 1.1 Solid Foam Bike Tires

1.0 tires are cheaper than 1.1 tires, and start at about $29 each.
Thoroki - 20x1.5
Nymph - 20-1.25

IMPORTANT:
See charts here for rim width (inside width, bead to bead).
Tannus Aither 1.1 Tire Size Chart Tire Selection
Tannus Tires - Solid Bicycle Tires

I've successfully installed a pair of 700c x 23 tires on my winter commuter. Still early in testing, but so far, so good.

I found they were a major hassle to install, but he video on the website made it look easy. Perhaps my rims were on the narrow side. For me the Tannus pliers were helpful.

JonathanGennick 

What sort of holes are you seeing in the tube? Are they two holes close together that would tend to suggest pinch flats? Is the hole on the inside of the tube facing into the rim? I'd inflate the tube slightly so that it takes shape and see where the leak is in relation to the rim, and see whether that leads to any insight into what is going wrong.

Also, if the tire is threadbare and worn to the point where the tube can protrude through the tire, then the tube will protrude and burst. It's pretty cool to see it when it happens.

chedarhead

There seems to be more to your problem than the tubes. I would make sure that there is not a spoke poking through the tube,or something in the tire. When you are inflating the tire for the first time are you doing it properly without pinching the tube. If you have a bad tire replace the tire. If the situation continues take the bike to a shop.

SkyDog75

If you're used to wrenching on cars, this ought to be a piece of cake. There's no OBDII diags or anything, but the troubleshooting logic really isn't too much different whether we're talking cars or bicycles: Identify the problem, diagnose the cause, then address that root cause. In this case, we still haven't gotten past step 1. The problem's apparent -- we know you're getting flats -- but we need to diagnose the cause in order to come up with an appropriate fix. The fix may be "mainly composed of you ordering something", as you put it, but the trick is to figure out what that something is.

There should already be a rim strip of some sort in place to prevent the tube from getting punctured by spokes, and/or spoke nipples. (Or spoke holes if you've got a double wall rim, which probably isn't the case on a kids' bike unless it's pretty high-end.) If your existing rim strip is in decent shape and covers everything it's supposed to, there's no need to replace it.



Higher pressure is only going to help you prevent flats if your flats were being caused by insufficient pressure in the first place. If underinflation isn't the cause of the problem, going to higher pressures isn't going to fix it.

The location of the hole(s) in your flat tubes will probably tell you what you need to know. Find the hole and proceed from there. If the hole is on the tread side of the tube, you may have a sharp object embedded in the tire that punctures the tube when your son's weight pushes it through the tire rubber. If the hole is on the rim side, you may have a problem with your rim strip and the tube could be getting punctured by a spoke or something. Or maybe a burr or rough weld. If you've got "snake bites", then let's talk about air pressure.

himespau 

My first thought with all these repeated flats is that your rim strip is torn, shifted off where it should be, or missing. That can cause a lot of problems. It looks like a layer of tape running along the rim with a hole in it for the valve stem.

VegasTriker

Next time you remove the tube that will not stay inflated, match up the location of the hole in the tube with both the tire and rim. Then you will know where to look on the rim and tire for something that might be causing the hole. Is there something in the tire? Is there a burr on the rim or a spoke exposed at that point. When I install a tire or change a tube I always line the Name embossed on the tire with the valve hole. That way I will know exactly where to look for a thorn, piece of wire, or glass in the tire by where the hole is in the tube. Worn tires don't usually contribute to a tube failing unless there is a hole in the sidewall and I would expect you could see that right off.

Are you using tire irons to remove and install the tube? The best way to put the tire back on is with your fingers if that will work instead of using a tool. I never poked a hole in a tube with my thumb but sure have done so with a screwdriver (as a kid).