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Old 09-30-06, 11:43 AM   #1
lengds
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theft prevention devices

I am about to spend thousands of dollars for a bike. Theft is my number one worry. The best deterrent I can find is a GPS system by covert manufactures that will show where the bike is. My idea as a viable alternative would be a drop in tube that would replace the bike seat and tube when I go in to shop. This would be a conspicuous device that would lock in with a key or a remote wireless code with key. Once activated the tube would be flush with the top of the seat post. Who ever steals the bike would soon find out they could not install a new post and seat without serious expensive and time consuming work. In a short time, word would get out to not bother stealing bikes with this new device since it renders the bicycle worthless for resell. My other idea is the manufacturers design the bike with a part of the bike like the bottom bracket that is removable and can be taken with the person when they have locked up the bike. The part would only be available to the rightful owner of the bike if the bike is stolen and recovered. The thief would be able to build the part at an high cost. The origonal owner would be able to buy at a nominal fee once proof is shown. Japan National bicycle is going to put in a GPS system on their new scooters and ebikes in the $1500 range to recover stolen ones. Who ever sells a seat tube plug as I described or builds a bke that a major part like the lower bracket can be quickly removed is going to make a lot of money and major cities where bike theft is rampant will again find people more interested in buying a bike. A super engineer out there to build and sell one of these? Thanks. lengds
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Old 09-30-06, 11:56 AM   #2
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Buy a cheaper bike? Or just take the seat with you perhaps. If you're looking to deter convenience thieves not having a seat and clipless pedals may be the two easiest things aside from a good lock.
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Old 09-30-06, 12:04 PM   #3
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They're called beaters and locks. Buy them. Paragraphs are your friend.
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Old 09-30-06, 09:56 PM   #4
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MKS quick release pedals.
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Old 10-01-06, 01:01 AM   #5
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1: Most importantly, buy a beater bike for your bike you commute with and leave locked up places. I have had great luck with a new low-end Kona hardtail. Make sure your good bike should be either being ridden by you, in your sight, or in your place of residence.

2: Buy Pitlocks from www.urbanbiketech.com. This will make sure that your fork, front wheel, rear wheel, seatpost, and brake posts stay where they should be, on your bike. Make sure to carry a key and some hex wrench that fits in the hole in the key for leverage when you have a flat. Nothing is 100% secure, but if a thief is determined enough to try to ruin parts to get something locked with these off, they almost deserve the part... or what remains of it.

3: Buy a either a GOOD U-lock or a GOOD security chain with a GOOD padlock (no masterlock unless its their ProSeries at the minimum) (the chain should come pre-cut, not one cut in a hardware store to length.) Good as in getting soldsecure's gold rating. Make sure it does NOT use a round key lock, but a flat Abloy/Abus double-sided key clone. There are U-locks sold out there that can be picked with a pen cap in seconds, or the usual Bic pen. Yours should not be one of them.

4: Two main locking techniques... Sheldon Brown, and mechBgon... forum post here how do you lock your bike?

Use your judgement which to use.

5: There are other articles about bike locking techniques... I'm tempted to write a FAQ about them if there is interest, making sure people like SB and MechBgon are properly credited.

Some other articles about bike locks:

Weak point of locking methods?
I am scared to leave my bike while I am in class....
Comparison of Onguard Locks

Some websites about locks:

http://www.soldsecure.com/Leisure.htm
http://urbanbiketech.com
http://www.kryptonite.com
http://www.onguardlock.com
http://www.squirelocks.co.uk/html/urban.htm

Hope this helps... there is a lot of information on these forums about keeping your expensive ride yours.

Last edited by mlts22; 10-01-06 at 01:08 AM.
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Old 10-01-06, 07:38 AM   #6
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Why a chain and not a cable?? I have a nice 13mm cable that I believe is stronger than a chain. Am I wrong?
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Old 10-01-06, 07:50 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miked528
Why a chain and not a cable?? I have a nice 13mm cable that I believe is stronger than a chain. Am I wrong?
Yes, you are wrong. Cables can be cut very easily, reguardless of thickness.
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Old 10-01-06, 10:47 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miked528
Why a chain and not a cable?? I have a nice 13mm cable that I believe is stronger than a chain. Am I wrong?
Cables are the worst locking device you can use on your bike. When we say chain, we don't mean the chains you find at home depot. We mean this:

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Old 10-01-06, 11:31 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lengds
A super engineer out there to build and sell one of these? Thanks. lengds
Yes.
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Old 10-01-06, 01:13 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miked528
Why a chain and not a cable?? I have a nice 13mm cable that I believe is stronger than a chain. Am I wrong?
Cables are to deter the average Joe Sixpack from hopping on your bike and riding off into the sunset. Any thief who is experienced can defeat even a fairly thick one.

Don't trust your bike to a steel cable lock (exceptions are the cable locks which are steel cables surrounded by hardened steel rings that motorcyclists use, and are heavy.)

Chains are different. Avoid the trap of buying a thick-looking chain at a hardware store, getting it cut to length. If the machine at the hardware store can cut it, then some thief can cut with a portable pair of cutters. What you want is a SECURITY chain, not a chain that is intended to be used to hang a tire off a tree.

Chains like these are what you want:

http://www.kryptonitelock.com/inetis...s_item&pgrp=20
http://www.kryptonitelock.com/inetis...s_item&pgrp=20
http://www.lockitt.com/chain.htm

Operator has the picture of the chain you should use, if you don't get a good U-lock.

With the chain, buy a GOOD padlock, or make sure it comes with one that is up to snuff.

Examples of GOOD padlocks:

http://www.abus.de/us/main.asp?Scree...=4003318201158
http://www.abus.de/us/main.asp?Scree...=4003318200724
http://www.medeco.com/products/produ...ategory_ID=27&

With a padlock, make sure it has a "bump key" resistant cylinder. Medeco is definitely secure against this, they advertise this on their website. Any Abloy/Abus double-sided detainer disc cylinder is immune to this.

Whatever you do, don't buy an el cheapo lock which can be shimmed open with two guitar picks.

A good security chain will help security immensely, and just its presence will deter all but the top eschelon of thieves, crackheads who don't care what they damage, and component thieves who will take a hex wrench and yank your fork out.

Caveat about a security chain... heavy. You have to sling it around your neck pretty much.

A U lock can be mounted somewhere on your bike, but again, buy a U-lock worth the name.

Again, Kryptonite or Onguard. They arn't perfect, but they will serve you well against all but the most determined thieves.

Lastly, its been said before, but if you are worried about component theft, Pitlocks or (if you have to) Pinhead OEM-ed skewer locks. The Pinhead locks are sold in shops, and not mail order, are of lower quality than the Pitlocks, and only come with one key. But if you have to slap something to keep your wheels secure, its better than nothing. Also, if you use the Pinhead OEM locks, oil them occassionally -- they will rust, while the Pitlocks won't.

Last edited by mlts22; 10-01-06 at 01:20 PM.
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Old 10-03-06, 04:52 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by operator
Cables are the worst locking device you can use on your bike. When we say chain, we don't mean the chains you find at home depot. We mean this:

Well, when I say cable, I don't mean the ones with a combination lock. I have a cable and use a padlock to secure. I just want to make that clear. So you guys are saying that chain that you have pictured is more difficult to cut than a 13mm cable? If that's the case, I guess I'll be getting myself a chain then. What about my padlock? I have standard padlock, but a thicker than standard one, however. I don't use those U-lock padlocks.
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Old 10-03-06, 04:56 AM   #12
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I can't get over my theft paranoia of having lived in high theft areas of the US. Many locals look at us as we are being redicilious. I put three chains about my three sets of bikes and lock them to a post in the garage. Crime is not much of a problem here, at least. Cables are easily cut?What about the locks themselves. I like locks with combinations used to open the lock and cuts down on the number of keys, I have to carry. Are they secure.
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Old 10-03-06, 05:13 AM   #13
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What's the point in buying an expensive bike if you are not going to ride it? Just buy the beater.

If you ride a beater every day you will start upgrading it as that is the bike you will be pedaling and constantly maintaining. In other words after a few years your beater will start becoming a $1000 bike. My $450 Montague has about $400 of upgrades.

GPS thing might be easy to deactivate (take out the batteries?), but it will work for many less capable criminals.

The real issue is can you afford the $1000+ bike? Are you going you use it? It the alternative a $1000 gym membership you will not use and cannot sell? A yearly overhaul is about $200. At the end of 1 year I would say the bike would be worth $700 - $200 overhaul or $500.
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Old 10-03-06, 05:35 PM   #14
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Buy some Pitlocks to keep your parts on your bike and a quality bike lock to keep your bike where you parked it. Take your bike inside when you can, and don't leave it out, overnight in dodgy areas. Most importantly make sure your homeowners/renters insurance has your bike covered.
Other than that ride and enjoy.

--A
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Old 10-03-06, 05:41 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mlts22
Cables are to deter the average Joe Sixpack from hopping on your bike and riding off into the sunset. Any thief who is experienced can defeat even a fairly thick one.
Cables are to deter "honest" people from taking your bike. Anybody who wants to cut a cable can do it, no experience required. I cut the padlock locking a cable on my bike; it took one second with a pair of bolt cutters.
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Old 10-03-06, 05:51 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cyclezealot
Cables are easily cut?What about the locks themselves. I like locks with combinations used to open the lock and cuts down on the number of keys, I have to carry. Are they secure.
Padlocks are VERY easy to cut. You should use EITHER a good u-lock or mini u-lock, or a heavy duty lock with a heavy duty chain.

Or maybe even a u-lock and a chain, if you really want to slow them down...
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Old 10-03-06, 05:56 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miked528
Well, when I say cable, I don't mean the ones with a combination lock. I have a cable and use a padlock to secure. I just want to make that clear. So you guys are saying that chain that you have pictured is more difficult to cut than a 13mm cable? If that's the case, I guess I'll be getting myself a chain then. What about my padlock? I have standard padlock, but a thicker than standard one, however. I don't use those U-lock padlocks.
If I can cut your padlock in less than 5 seconds, will you give me your bike?

If you don't have a u-lock, your bike isn't locked. Or if you're going with a heavy duty chain (as pictured previously), you get the lock that goes with the chain. If you're using a u-lock, be sure to use a proper locking technique:

Sheldon Brown's Lock Strategy

MechBgon's Lock Strategy
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Old 10-03-06, 10:06 PM   #18
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Kryptonite new york standard U lock paired with a Onguard Bull dog mini U lock => front wheel to frame and object and back wheel to frame. Probably about 30 mins of hard work before they're riding off on your bike => probably not worth the effort or risk of getting caught.
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Old 10-04-06, 05:33 AM   #19
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If you park in a major city or on a college campus, and you leave a $2,000 bike in public view for hours at a time, day after day, it will be stolen sooner or later, no matter which locks and security devices you use.

The only bikes that I would leave in public view, hours at a time, are either worth less than $500, or have been repainted and modified to LOOK as if they are worth less than $500. If those bikes are going to be out of my sight for more than five minutes, they have a "gold" rated lock around the rear wheel, and a "silver" rated lock around the front wheel.

For maximum security, I park my "cheapo" bike next to a $2,000 bike that is secured only with a cable lock, or a $20 u-lock from junk manufactureres such as the Master Lock company. The crooks will always take the easy, attractive target first. And, a bike locked with only a cable lock is a "gift" to the crook.

www.soldsecure.com/Leisure.htm
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