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View Poll Results: Have You Lost A Bike Due To A High End Lock Being Defeated?

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  • No, I use a high end lock and still have my bike

    58 92.06%
  • Yes, I lost a bike due to my Kryptonite NY/Fahgettaboudit Chain being defeated

    1 1.59%
  • Yes, I lost a bike due to my Kryptonite NY/Fahgettaboudit U-lock being defeated

    2 3.17%
  • Yes, I lost a bike due to my Onguard Brute U-lock being defeated

    0 0%
  • Yes, I lost a bike due to my Onguard Beast Chain being defeated

    0 0%
  • Yes, I lost a bike due to my Abus Granit 58 U-lock being defeated

    0 0%
  • Yes, I lost a bike due to my Abus Granit chain being defeated

    0 0%
  • Yes, I lost a bike due a high end lock not listed being defeated- Please provide details

    2 3.17%
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  1. #1
    Senior Member Ziemas's Avatar
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    Have You Had A Bike Stolen While Using A High End Lock? Please Give Info.

    Have you had a bike stolen in the last two years while using a high end lock which was compromised? What lock was it, and do you know if the lock was Art Foundation Four Star or Sold Secure Gold rated?

    If your bicycle was stolen and you were using such a lock please provide details of the theft, such as what the bike was locked to and how you think the lock was defeated (bolt cutters, angle grinder, etc).

    The purpose of this poll is to settle claims made by the makers of ***** chains that ART Foundation and Sold Secure locks are being defeated in the real world with regularity by bicycle thieves. I think that claim is rubbish, and this poll sets out to prove it.

    Here is the thread that started the debate. http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=314001

    Here are the Sold Secure and ART Foundation Websites:

    http://www.soldsecure.com/Leisure.htm
    http://www.stichtingart.nl/sloten_resultaat.asp
    Last edited by Ziemas; 07-01-07 at 04:26 AM.

  2. #2
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    Many thanks for that Ziemas.

  3. #3
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    Post on craigslist NYC for tales of woa. The locks can be cut with a hack saw (titanium blade).
    2000 Montague CX, I do not recommend it, but still ride it.
    Strida 3, I recommend it for rides < 10mi wo steep hills.
    2006 Rowbike 720 Sport, I recommend it as an exercise bike.
    1996 Birdy, Recommend.
    Wieleder CARiBIKE (folding), decent frame.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Ziemas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo8rge
    Post on craigslist NYC for tales of woa. The locks can be cut with a hack saw (titanium blade).
    Any lock can be compromised, but I'd like to hear some first hand accounts by people on this forum to just how often it happens. Not very, taking into account the number of locks out there, I'd venture to say.

    What kind of lock do you use, geo8rge?
    Last edited by Ziemas; 07-01-07 at 09:22 AM.

  5. #5
    tired donnamb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziemas
    Have you had a bike stolen in the last two years while using a high end lock which was compromised? What lock was it, and do you know if the lock was Art Foundation Four Star or Sold Secure Gold rated?
    No. I use a Kryptonite New York U-lock. As far as I can tell, there's not even been an attempt to tamper with it. I believe this lock has a Sold Secure gold rating.
    "Real wars of words are harder to win. They require thought, insight, precision, articulation, knowledge, and experience. They require the humility to admit when you are wrong. They recognize that the dialectic is not about making us look at you, but about us all looking together for the truth."

  6. #6
    Two H's!!! TWO!!!!! chephy's Avatar
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    I use a NY Kryptonite and still have my bike, but I rely more on avoiding leaving the bike out of sight in high-crime areas for too long than on a lock.

  7. #7
    Retro-nerd georgiaboy's Avatar
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    Onguard Bulldog Mini.
    Would you like a dream with that?

  8. #8
    Master of the Obvious
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    Quote Originally Posted by donnamb
    No. I use a Kryptonite New York U-lock. As far as I can tell, there's not even been an attempt to tamper with it. I believe this lock has a Sold Secure gold rating.

    http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=314001

  9. #9
    Mister Goody Two Shoes KnhoJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donnamb
    No. I use a Kryptonite New York U-lock. As far as I can tell, there's not even been an attempt to tamper with it. I believe this lock has a Sold Secure gold rating.
    Me too! Although mine's seen a little more action... In the form of a claw hammer. Last week I found one claw freshly broken off on the ground, and a matching dent in the plastic cover of the lock. And last year I did find a muddy tweaker bashing away at my $12 chain lock with a digital slr camera. That didn't work, either. I don't think Vancouver's any better for bike theft than Portland, just dumber.

    I'm happy with my big heavy yellow lock. The only thing a stronger lock would protect is the lock itself; plenty of thieves would happily cut my frame and make off with the full load of components. Best case scenario; if you built a 20 pound, $1000 inconel u-lock, crammed two chain stays, the chain, a crank arm, and the rear wheel inside, locked to a solid steel rack anchored two feet into the ground, any teenager with a $5 hacksaw could leave the rear wheel locked to the rack next to a broken chain in under 60 seconds. Such is life.

  10. #10
    tired donnamb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnhoJ
    Last week I found one claw freshly broken off on the ground, and a matching dent in the plastic cover of the lock. And last year I did find a muddy tweaker bashing away at my $12 chain lock with a digital slr camera. That didn't work, either. I don't think Vancouver's any better for bike theft than Portland, just dumber.
    So where was your bike parked?
    "Real wars of words are harder to win. They require thought, insight, precision, articulation, knowledge, and experience. They require the humility to admit when you are wrong. They recognize that the dialectic is not about making us look at you, but about us all looking together for the truth."

  11. #11
    tired donnamb's Avatar
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    I'm sorry, I don't understand the message you're trying to communicate to me by posting the link to that thread.
    "Real wars of words are harder to win. They require thought, insight, precision, articulation, knowledge, and experience. They require the humility to admit when you are wrong. They recognize that the dialectic is not about making us look at you, but about us all looking together for the truth."

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo8rge
    Post on craigslist NYC for tales of woa. The locks can be cut with a hack saw (titanium blade).
    Where do you get titanium hacksaw blades? I have never seen or heard of such a thing, and can't find any on Google.

    Bi-metal, tool steel, high-speed and carbide is all I've seen..... Carbide will cut most metals but it's dreadfully slow in a handsaw. I've heard of diamond-coated blades also but they're even slower than carbide.
    ~

  13. #13
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    I've heard that small thermonuclear weapons can also break a high end lock. Is that what bike thieves are using these days?

  14. #14
    tired donnamb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Order
    I've heard that small thermonuclear weapons can also break a high end lock. Is that what bike thieves are using these days?
    Well, you know what happens when the Reedies get glazed and break into the Reed College reactor, Blue Order... Goodness knows where that stuff goes after they make off with it.
    "Real wars of words are harder to win. They require thought, insight, precision, articulation, knowledge, and experience. They require the humility to admit when you are wrong. They recognize that the dialectic is not about making us look at you, but about us all looking together for the truth."

  15. #15
    cab horn
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziemas
    The purpose of this poll is to settle claims made by the makers of ***** chains that ART Foundation and Sold Secure locks are being defeated in the real world with regularity by bicycle thieves. I think that claim is rubbish, and this poll sets out to prove it.
    Take a introductory class on statisitics, then come back and tell the class why this thread is as useless as your poll.
    Mes compaingnons cui j'amoie et cui j'aim,... Me di, chanson.

  16. #16
    Senior Member Ziemas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by operator
    Take a introductory class on statisitics, then come back and tell the class why this thread is as useless as your poll.
    It's an informal poll. I'm not under the guise that it is scientific.

  17. #17
    Mister Goody Two Shoes KnhoJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donnamb
    So where was your bike parked?
    In front of the Sportsman's Warehouse in Orchards, Washington, home of stoned salespeople. Long story short, I'll be buying a tent somewhere else; and when you get a funny feeling about those two kids across the parking lot checking out your bike as you lock up, don't hang out inside and try to help the baked dude comprehend the idea of riding somewhere on a bicycle and spending the night there in a tent.
    On the bright side, if I hadn't made this trip, I wouldn't have stopped to eat a sandwich in Orchards Park in just the right spot to sit and watch an active communal bushtit nest only ten feet away.

  18. #18
    Feral Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    They went into my apartment building and ripped the railing out from the stairwell to get to my bike. What do you do, eh?

    Bloody french.

    Those ***** clowns can spew whatever garbage they like, I'll always love my Abus.
    Quote Originally Posted by KrisPistofferson View Post
    Did you just say "minarchist?" I'm going to start a 10-page vaginathon because only Libertarians can define Libertarianism. Also, you're mean.

  19. #19
    Senior Member Ziemas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus
    They went into my apartment building and ripped the railing out from the stairwell to get to my bike. What do you do, eh?

    Bloody french.

    Those ***** clowns can spew whatever garbage they like, I'll always love my Abus.
    But it sounds like the lock held......

  20. #20
    Feral Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    he he, I just read the other thread Ziemas ***** and CapnCool - what a pair of tools!!
    Quote Originally Posted by KrisPistofferson View Post
    Did you just say "minarchist?" I'm going to start a 10-page vaginathon because only Libertarians can define Libertarianism. Also, you're mean.

  21. #21
    Feral Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziemas
    But it sounds like the lock held......
    Supposedly. The lock disappeared with the bike, of course. All that was left was iron railings hanging out from their previously anchored-to stairwell.
    Quote Originally Posted by KrisPistofferson View Post
    Did you just say "minarchist?" I'm going to start a 10-page vaginathon because only Libertarians can define Libertarianism. Also, you're mean.

  22. #22
    Senior Member Ziemas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus
    Supposedly. The lock disappeared with the bike, of course. All that was left was iron railings hanging out from their previously anchored-to stairwell.
    I'm sure it held. If they could have broken the lock easier than the railing they would have.....seems the lock was stronger.....probably cut it off with power tools elsewhere....

  23. #23
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    1) If you want tales of whoa, look over the postings on NYC craigslist, and contact the posters I used to do that until it got redundant. Not only that but they are current in terms of theft techniques. As to expensive locks the largest category of failure was the lock was not used correctly. Bike locked to itself, bike not locked to anything, the thing the bike was locked to was not secure, key left in lock (only the chain was stolen in that case).

    2) The blade I use may be carbide, back when I bought it I think it said titanium on it. It takes about 15-20 min to cut through a hardened shackle.

    My blade looks like this: http://www.golfsmith.com/ppage.php?s...&tcode=fr_home
    I like it because it is thin.
    Last edited by geo8rge; 07-02-07 at 03:00 AM.
    2000 Montague CX, I do not recommend it, but still ride it.
    Strida 3, I recommend it for rides < 10mi wo steep hills.
    2006 Rowbike 720 Sport, I recommend it as an exercise bike.
    1996 Birdy, Recommend.
    Wieleder CARiBIKE (folding), decent frame.

  24. #24
    Senior Member Ziemas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo8rge
    1) If you want tales of whoa, look over the postings on NYC craigslist, and contact the posters I used to do that until it got redundant. Not only that but they are current in terms of theft techniques. As to expensive locks the largest category of failure was the lock was not used correctly. Bike locked to itself, bike not locked to anything, the thing the bike was locked to was not secure, key left in lock (only the chain was stolen in that case).

    2) The blade I use may be carbide, back when I bought it I think it said titanium on it. It takes about 15-20 min to cut through a hardened shackle.
    It seems that user error is the cause of the vast majority of cases you are referring too. Thanks for clearing that up.

  25. #25
    Feral Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziemas
    I'm sure it held. If they could have broken the lock easier than the railing they would have.....seems the lock was stronger.....probably cut it off with power tools elsewhere....
    Funny thing is, it was only a mid-level Abus chain lock as well. So even that bizarre theft can't skew the "No" statistics you've garnered so far...
    Quote Originally Posted by KrisPistofferson View Post
    Did you just say "minarchist?" I'm going to start a 10-page vaginathon because only Libertarians can define Libertarianism. Also, you're mean.

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