Putting a motor on a bicycle
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Putting a motor on a bicycle
thinking about putting a lawn mower motor or something on this bike? anyone know the laws for this? FL and NY? how big of a motor can i put on it before i need a motorcycle LIC? https://img686.imageshack.us/img686/5470/1002312.jpg do they sell kits ? how would i keep the pedals?
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A bicycle with a gas engine attached is illegal in NY:
https://www.nydmv.state.ny.us/DMVfaqs.htm#MOPEDS
Motorized Scooters, Mini-Bikes, Dirt Bikes, Go-Karts, Motor Assisted Bicycles
You cannot register any of the motorized devices from the list below in NYS. You cannot operate these devices on sidewalks, public streets or highways in NYS. These devices are motor vehicles, but they do not have the correct equipment or design for operation on roadways.
And you can't post on bike forums any more
A.
https://www.nydmv.state.ny.us/DMVfaqs.htm#MOPEDS
Motorized Scooters, Mini-Bikes, Dirt Bikes, Go-Karts, Motor Assisted Bicycles
You cannot register any of the motorized devices from the list below in NYS. You cannot operate these devices on sidewalks, public streets or highways in NYS. These devices are motor vehicles, but they do not have the correct equipment or design for operation on roadways.
- Motorized Scooter - a device with a motor attached and a handlebar for a standing rider. An example of a motorized scooter is the device called the Go-pedŽ.
- Mini-bike - a small, motorized device with two wheels and created for off-road use. A mini-bike does not qualify as a moped, a motorcycle or an ATV.
- Dirt Bike - a motorized device like a motorcycle, but created for and used for off-road use. Some "dirt bikes" qualify as an ATV. These vehicles can register and operate off-road as an ATV.
- Go-Kart - a small, motorized device with four wheels, created for off-road use. You cannot register a go-kart as a motor vehicle or ATV because a go-kart does not have the same equipment.
- Motor-assisted Bicycle - a bicycle to which a small motor is attached. A motor-assisted bicycle does not qualify for a registration as a motorcycle, moped or ATV and does not have the same equipment.
And you can't post on bike forums any more
A.
Last edited by AdamDZ; 01-06-10 at 07:16 PM.
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Things which should not be spoken of.
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Adam: Do you know how bicycles with electric assist are evaluated under that law?
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E-bikes also cannot be operated legally on public roads in NY (it's the only state with an outright ban on riding e-bikes on public roads). There is legislation pending in the NY Legislature that would repeal the ban (at least in part, the Senate version of the repeal would continue to ban e-bikes with motors over 750W and/or that can travel over 20 MPH). The Assembly has passed it's version of the legislation; the Senate bill is stalled.
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A new law is being passed (already passed?) to allow "electric assisted bicycles" as a motor vehicle.
https://open.nysenate.gov/openleg/api/html/bill/S4014
It must be manufactured to certain safety standards (DYI ebikes are still not allowed), have functional pedals, two or three wheels (4 wheels is a no) no more than 1000W of power and be limited to 20mph, helmet required and be operated by 16yo or older. I'm not sure if it's in effect though. I see a lot of delivery people using electric bikes though and no one get hassled by the cops.
It won't require registration but like a class C motorcycle/moped (20mph) it may require a drivers license, I'm not sure here, the above bill doesn't mention that.
Also, electric bikes are not frowned upon by cyclists.
I don't know about FL.
Adam
https://open.nysenate.gov/openleg/api/html/bill/S4014
It must be manufactured to certain safety standards (DYI ebikes are still not allowed), have functional pedals, two or three wheels (4 wheels is a no) no more than 1000W of power and be limited to 20mph, helmet required and be operated by 16yo or older. I'm not sure if it's in effect though. I see a lot of delivery people using electric bikes though and no one get hassled by the cops.
It won't require registration but like a class C motorcycle/moped (20mph) it may require a drivers license, I'm not sure here, the above bill doesn't mention that.
Also, electric bikes are not frowned upon by cyclists.
I don't know about FL.
Adam
Last edited by AdamDZ; 01-06-10 at 08:40 PM.
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Thanks Adam. I was wondering since the prospect of converting my cargo bike to an e-bike had crossed my mind.
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Actually, the Senate bill has stalled. It's not clear whether the Senate will take it up without some pressure from constituents. I'd suggest you contact your state Senator. The Assembly passed it's version of the bill last year.
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I don't know that is so certain. I've seen a lot of bad remarks about either type around here.
I'd also question the logic of only allowing e-bikes: they are the most-expensive type, yet they have the least power and the least useful ranges. How is limiting the public to a "crippled" alternative form of transportation doing them a favor?
-------
I will admit however that if all are totally prohibited where you live, an e-bike is far stealthier than any gas-engine setup.
As to it being illegal, who cares?
It's a dumb law, and no cop is going to want to become famous for causing a fatality wreck while trying to catch a fleeing e-biker. Lay out the cost for a beastly setup ($1500+) and go have fun.
~
I'd also question the logic of only allowing e-bikes: they are the most-expensive type, yet they have the least power and the least useful ranges. How is limiting the public to a "crippled" alternative form of transportation doing them a favor?
-------
I will admit however that if all are totally prohibited where you live, an e-bike is far stealthier than any gas-engine setup.
As to it being illegal, who cares?
It's a dumb law, and no cop is going to want to become famous for causing a fatality wreck while trying to catch a fleeing e-biker. Lay out the cost for a beastly setup ($1500+) and go have fun.
~
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Yeah, like I said a lot delivery people ride those. But it's luck. All it takes is one overzealous cop trying to make his ticket quota at the end of the month. Like tinted windows on cars: it's illegal to have tinted driver and passenger side windows but many people do. A friend of mine just got a ticket for that after driving with tinted windows for many years.
Adam
Adam
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The legality of motorizing a bike in Florida, seems to be open to whoever wants to pull you over. Many here, including myself, have gotten away with it for years. Some riders, though, are pulled over & cited. Who knows, really ?? If you ride the motorized bike at high speeds, if it is super loud, expect problems.
Here is a site you may like.
https://www.motoredbikes.com/
Here is a site you may like.
https://www.motoredbikes.com/
Last edited by Esteban32696; 01-07-10 at 07:03 AM.
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That said, I'd playfully mock any acquaintance that rode an e-bike that wasn't a cargo bike. An electric commuter? That's cheating, and missing part of the point to boot!
I'd also question the logic of only allowing e-bikes: they are the most-expensive type, yet they have the least power and the least useful ranges. How is limiting the public to a "crippled" alternative form of transportation doing them a favor?
Edit: Or maybe it's a question of a power-assisted cycle vs. a fully motorized conversion? How difficult/feasible is it to use an internal combustion engine as just a power assist mechanism on a bike? If it's impractical, that would make a bicycle with a gas engine little more than a really poor do-it-yourself motorcycle or scooter. That would explain why they wouldn't want to allow gas-driven "bicycles".
I will admit however that if all are totally prohibited where you live, an e-bike is far stealthier than any gas-engine setup.
As to it being illegal, who cares?
It's a dumb law, and no cop is going to want to become famous for causing a fatality wreck while trying to catch a fleeing e-biker. Lay out the cost for a beastly setup ($1500+) and go have fun.
~
As to it being illegal, who cares?
It's a dumb law, and no cop is going to want to become famous for causing a fatality wreck while trying to catch a fleeing e-biker. Lay out the cost for a beastly setup ($1500+) and go have fun.
~
Last edited by Arcanum; 01-07-10 at 08:34 AM. Reason: Another idea about gas motors vs. electric.
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The legality of motorizing a bike in Florida, seems to be open to whoever wants to pull you over. Many here, including myself, have gotten away with it for years. Some riders, though, are pulled over & cited. Who knows, really ?? If you ride the motorized bike at high speeds, if it is super loud, expect problems.
Here is a site you may like.
https://www.motoredbikes.com/
Here is a site you may like.
https://www.motoredbikes.com/
Cruise around quietly on an electric powered bike = OK. Frighten an old lady in the process = ticket + "I better not even catch you riding that thing home."
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Second, you'd have to offset a lawnmower engine by quite a bit in order to get the crankshaft to align with the gears on the bike.
Third, rotation. You'd probably be looking at a roto-tiller engine, made to run upright, rather than a lawnmower engine made to run lying down.
Finally the mount. Unless you're welding to an old gaspipe cruiser, welding a motor mount to a bike is going to be an iffy proposition.
That's not to say it can't be done--there's a guy around here running a chainsaw engine on an MTB. Stinks like hell and sounds like a chainsaw. Annoying thing.
Tuesday I came across a guy on a BMX with an e-assist on the front wheel, with the battery bouncing around in a paperboy basket on the front. Thing rattled like crazy over every bump.
He was a real engineer too. The bike had no brakes. You should have seen him trying to stop Flintstones-style on the ice and snow we had that day. And he was out in a snowstorm without lights or reflectors. I guess you don't need those things when you're young and have a few hundred watts on tap.
He decided the sidewalk might be a better idea, but didn't have studs, or even knobs, because he couldn't get the bike from the street to the sidewalk without spinning the wheel like crazy. Power without traction is useless.
He went by me climbing Cobbs Hill on Winton, wobbling and weaving in the slush. I said hi as he went by. Surprised him, I guess. He nearly fell off the thing turning to say hi back. But dammit, he was faster than some old guy on a cross bike with studs!
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Tuesday I came across a guy on a BMX with an e-assist on the front wheel, with the battery bouncing around in a paperboy basket on the front. Thing rattled like crazy over every bump.
He was a real engineer too. The bike had no brakes. You should have seen him trying to stop Flintstones-style on the ice and snow we had that day. And he was out in a snowstorm without lights or reflectors. I guess you don't need those things when you're young and have a few hundred watts on tap.
He decided the sidewalk might be a better idea, but didn't have studs, or even knobs, because he couldn't get the bike from the street to the sidewalk without spinning the wheel like crazy. Power without traction is useless.
He went by me climbing Cobbs Hill on Winton, wobbling and weaving in the slush. I said hi as he went by. Surprised him, I guess. He nearly fell off the thing turning to say hi back. But dammit, he was faster than some old guy on a cross bike with studs!
He was a real engineer too. The bike had no brakes. You should have seen him trying to stop Flintstones-style on the ice and snow we had that day. And he was out in a snowstorm without lights or reflectors. I guess you don't need those things when you're young and have a few hundred watts on tap.
He decided the sidewalk might be a better idea, but didn't have studs, or even knobs, because he couldn't get the bike from the street to the sidewalk without spinning the wheel like crazy. Power without traction is useless.
He went by me climbing Cobbs Hill on Winton, wobbling and weaving in the slush. I said hi as he went by. Surprised him, I guess. He nearly fell off the thing turning to say hi back. But dammit, he was faster than some old guy on a cross bike with studs!
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There's the tires issue (I run 35mm Nokian W106s) and the brakes and lights matter too, but I was thinking about how cold it would be on the thing considering he's just sitting there in the breeze doing nothing. For me, climbing that hill the other day was a welcome opportunity to make some serious BTUs. It finally knocked the chill off me and I was warm all the rest of the way.
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There's the tires issue (I run 35mm Nokian W106s) and the brakes and lights matter too, but I was thinking about how cold it would be on the thing considering he's just sitting there in the breeze doing nothing. For me, climbing that hill the other day was a welcome opportunity to make some serious BTUs. It finally knocked the chill off me and I was warm all the rest of the way.
#19
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Actually you can purchase engine kits designed to bolt on to a bicycle. I believe that they are available in three different sizes.
I had one that I had intended to install on my Xtracycle, turned out it wouldn't fit in my frame. Ironically, I wound up selling it to a bike shop.
I had one that I had intended to install on my Xtracycle, turned out it wouldn't fit in my frame. Ironically, I wound up selling it to a bike shop.
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Go to the Motorized Bike Forum:
https://www.motoredbikes.com/index.php?
And all your questions will be answered. There are discussions of legalities in each state, sections for gas and electric motors, kits, etc.
Many states allow under 50cc engines to be classified as "mopeds" and may be used with little or no restriction. (other than highway operation)
There are a variety of companies selling kits, entire bikes, and so forth.
(also, plenty of stuff on YouTube)
https://www.motoredbikes.com/index.php?
And all your questions will be answered. There are discussions of legalities in each state, sections for gas and electric motors, kits, etc.
Many states allow under 50cc engines to be classified as "mopeds" and may be used with little or no restriction. (other than highway operation)
There are a variety of companies selling kits, entire bikes, and so forth.
(also, plenty of stuff on YouTube)
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In 2001, the US Congress enacted legislation that allowed consumer bicycle safety standards promulgated by the Consumer Product Safety Administration to apply to "low speed," ready-made electric bikes (defined as having a motor under 750W and speeds under 20 MPH) sold in the US rather than require these bikes to meet more rigorous standards set by the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration. (Public Law 107-319) However, Congress left the responsibility for promulgating safety regulations for more powerful ready-made e-bikes (defined as electric motors over 750W and speeds over 20 MPH) with the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration. Those bikes must meet moped/motorcycle safety standards, meaning beefier components and more safety features, including better brakes and lighting systems (headlights, tail lights, turn signals and brake lights).
At present, conversion kits aren't covered by these safety standards. As more and more powerful hub motor kits from China keep entering the market, I expect to see that change. As an e-bike enthusiast, I think we early adopters may do harm if we're not careful about safety when converting our own bikes. Attention to the adequacy of all components, from the frame to the brakes, needs to be considered when a conversion build is being planned. Careful operation on the roads as well as adherence to rules of the road are probably more important to e-bike riders since the addition of hub motor, and the attendant increase in the cyclist's speed, isn't something the average motorist may recognize and adjust driving behaviors to accommodate. Personally, I don't want to go faster than 17 MPH. Some of the descents down the mountains here are steep enough that my speeds go well over 30 MPH. My speed hits 36 MPH on of the hills close to my house. I can tell you that I'm pulsing my brakes on those descents and wishing the hills weren't as steep.
At present, conversion kits aren't covered by these safety standards. As more and more powerful hub motor kits from China keep entering the market, I expect to see that change. As an e-bike enthusiast, I think we early adopters may do harm if we're not careful about safety when converting our own bikes. Attention to the adequacy of all components, from the frame to the brakes, needs to be considered when a conversion build is being planned. Careful operation on the roads as well as adherence to rules of the road are probably more important to e-bike riders since the addition of hub motor, and the attendant increase in the cyclist's speed, isn't something the average motorist may recognize and adjust driving behaviors to accommodate. Personally, I don't want to go faster than 17 MPH. Some of the descents down the mountains here are steep enough that my speeds go well over 30 MPH. My speed hits 36 MPH on of the hills close to my house. I can tell you that I'm pulsing my brakes on those descents and wishing the hills weren't as steep.
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My cargo bike has a rated capacity of over 400 lbs. not counting the rider. If I were to load it anywhere near that, I'd want a little help up hills. And by "want a little help" I mean "probably wouldn't make it otherwise".
#24
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Can't say for NY, but in FL in order for a bicycle to have motor and still be classified as a bicycle the motor has to be electric and not capable of propelling the bike faster than 20 mph.
The electric motor requirement changed in the last few years. Used to be a gas motor was also acceptable.
The electric motor requirement changed in the last few years. Used to be a gas motor was also acceptable.
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As noted, laws vary wildly. Here in Missouri, it used to be that anything with a motor was a "motor vehicle" and subject to licensing. However, the gas crunch of 1976 gave some of the folks in the legislature the idea to loosen up and allow "mopeds" which were narrowly defined. Later, they expanded the definition, which was a big mistake as it made all those silly "pocket bikes" legal...
As to why....In addition to being a dedicated cyclist since the 70s, I also like mechanics and building things in general. There's a certain "cool" factor to some of these motorized bikes....Take a look at some of the pics on the site I mentioned and you'll see some remarkable machines.
As to why....In addition to being a dedicated cyclist since the 70s, I also like mechanics and building things in general. There's a certain "cool" factor to some of these motorized bikes....Take a look at some of the pics on the site I mentioned and you'll see some remarkable machines.