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-   -   Bike Security - Kryptonite Chains vs U-lock (http://www.bikeforums.net/general-cycling-discussion/627521-bike-security-kryptonite-chains-vs-u-lock.html)

Beyond 03-10-10 03:45 PM

Bike Security - Kryptonite Chains vs U-lock
 
I'm new to biking, I just bought a Fuji Team Carbon Bike 105/Ultegra. I'm not sure if this bike would be would be a target for most thieves but I hear carbon bikes usually are. I was doing some research on bike security and it looks like most people like the Kryptonite New York Fahgettaboudit u-lock. I was going to team this up with a cable around the front tire and maybe a tiny cable just for the post & saddle but I'm wondering if this is enough? I'm assume there is going to be times where I would leave the bike unattended for about 3 hours in a very low traffic area with a lot of fan noise. Would you guys recommend the Fahgettaboudit chain lock over the U-lock? I thought about carrying both but it kind of defeats the purpose of buying such a light bike and having to carry around all this crap. What is your take?

BarracksSi 03-10-10 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beyond (Post 10507950)
I thought about carrying both but it kind of defeats the purpose of buying such a light bike and having to carry around all this crap.

All bikes weigh 50 lbs. The 50-lb gaspipe beasts don't get stolen, so they just need a thin cable. The 15-lb carbon racers attract thieves, so you'd need 35 lbs of locks.

Or so the saying goes. ;)

Get whatever makes you feel better. You could also get a second U-lock to secure the wheel to the frame and leave out the chain.

I usually use a chain, but that's partly because I don't know where I'll be able to lock up. No U-lock I know of is big enough to wrap around a light pole.

Carry the locks around for your daily riding so that when you ride on the weekend or with a group, leave the locks at home and you'll be 20 lbs lighter. ;)

tsl 03-10-10 09:00 PM

Where are you locking and for how long and how often? Those are the things needed for a recommendation.

Locking in the Bronx overnight, that's one thing. Locking in Podunk while you have lunch, that's something else. Where is your 3-hour stop under the fan?

I'm car-free. I live in the city and work in the city. Actually, I work in the 'hood. Every time I leave my house, I'm on my bike, and I have to lock it at my destination.

I own a Fahgettaboudit U-lock. I don't care for it because the shackle is too small. It doesn't fit around an object and through the rear wheel. It's great to lock the frame, but not much else. So it stays home to lock the bike that didn't get to come out and play today.

My daily lock is the New York Lock 3000. It has a reasonably-sized shackle that I can lock to many sizes of posts, and through the rear wheel.

I don't want to carry multiple locks, or fuss with cables, so I replaced my QR skewers, seatpost bolt and headset cap with Pitlocks. The extra minute it will take to change a flat is unimportant to me. Finding my wheels, saddle and fork still attached to the bike when I return, is very important to me.

Retro Grouch 03-10-10 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beyond (Post 10507950)
I'm assume there is going to be times where I would leave the bike unattended for about 3 hours in a very low traffic area with a lot of fan noise. Would you guys recommend the Fahgettaboudit chain lock over the U-lock? I thought about carrying both but it kind of defeats the purpose of buying such a light bike and having to carry around all this crap.

If this is a place where you'll be locking your bike regularly how about storing the locking stuff at your destination?

electrik 03-10-10 09:43 PM

My take is don't leave your fancy carbon bike locked up outdoors in North America. I lock a bicycle about 1/4 worth that bike with such a lock and won't be surprised if it gets stolen/messed with.

If bicycle crime in NYC is any worse than it is in Toronto then you must be a real optimist.

DeathBat 03-10-10 11:29 PM

I'm wondering too, because I go to school in Harlem, and I'm wondering what kind of locks to get.
I was thinking about a U-lock and a cable.
Any specific kinds?

electrik 03-10-10 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathBat (Post 10509777)
I'm wondering too, because I go to school in Harlem, and I'm wondering what kind of locks to get.
I was thinking about a U-lock and a cable.
Any specific kinds?

Hardened Ulocks are the strongest option. Get the best and smallest size you can fit around your reartire and seat or chainstay. Use the chainlock to secure the front wheel to the u-lock. Your cockpit, seat, cranks, brakes and even the fork will still be subject to theft.. you can purchase pitlocks for those but it gets very expensive for the locks. So maybe you see why it is better to just ride a cheap bicycle if you have to park outside.

ludwig 03-11-10 03:43 PM

I use 2 locks if I'm not making quick stops. One chain lock from bikeregistry.com and the other one is the Kryptonite mini evolution. Chain around the front tire and frame, kryp u lock around the rear.

DeathBat 03-11-10 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by electrik (Post 10509817)
Hardened Ulocks are the strongest option. Get the best and smallest size you can fit around your reartire and seat or chainstay. Use the chainlock to secure the front wheel to the u-lock. Your cockpit, seat, cranks, brakes and even the fork will still be subject to theft.. you can purchase pitlocks for those but it gets very expensive for the locks. So maybe you see why it is better to just ride a cheap bicycle if you have to park outside.

Thanks, all I have is the Motobecane Messenger, so I guess thats a cheap bicycle....
I was thinking about a Krypto evo, and an Onguard rottweiler combo, not sure if that is good enough.
But I see people lock up their Trek, Cannondale, and Bianchi with one u-lock. And I'm like WTF.....

v70cat 03-12-10 08:14 AM

I am thinking about buying a cheap bike to ride around NYC that I can lock-up.

Do you think crocks know the difference or will my $200 Diamondback Insight RS also be stolen?

v70cat 03-12-10 08:15 AM

I am thinking about buying a cheap bike to ride around NYC that I can lock-up.

Do you think crocks know the difference or will my $200 Diamondback Insight RS also be stolen?

Beyond 03-12-10 12:52 PM

Thanks guys. I didn't even think about pitlocks, it seems like a great idea. I'm only anal because the paint job on this Fuji Team is pretty flashy and it has that Carbon look all over it. I've been told by most bike shop guys to simply not park the bike, get another junk bike for the rides to the gym and use the carbon for a weekend bike.

From my research it looks like the best u-lock is obviously the Kryptonite New YorkFahgettaboudit U-Lock. Apparently it takes anywhere from 18-22 minutes to get through all 18MM of it. Although many people complain about it being too small to get through the frame and the back wheel. There is a M18 version for motorcycles which is a little bigger, 81mm x 302mm, although the warranty won't work for your bike (but the warranty is pretty annoying as is).

As far as chains go, The Kryptonite New YorkFahgettaboudi Chain also has one of the best reviews, it's 15MM thick, and weights a ton. If you don't mind wearing this around your waist I guess this might be a nice combo for the U-Lock mentioned above but the both of these together is going to be a huge weight. So I guess the 50lb theory you guys mentioned is true LOL.

And V70cat, I think it really depends on the rate of crime in the area. I just got my water stolen out of my cage after running in Costco to return something. Crack heads would probably steal anything with a quick release. Someone told me a story about a guy's bike whose frame was cut just to grab the bike to sell the parts. NYC is probably pretty bad, but for a $200 Insight a OnGuard Bull Dog Combo should do it. I'm just a little more worried because my bike's retail is 10X that and might attract the attention of professional thieves with their power saws.

BarracksSi 03-12-10 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by v70cat (Post 10515692)
I am thinking about buying a cheap bike to ride around NYC that I can lock-up.

Do you think crocks know the difference or will my $200 Diamondback Insight RS also be stolen?

They don't care. Even if it's a $50 Wal-Mart special, odds are it'll end up on a barge and getting paddled by 6-year-olds across the Atlantic anyway.

BarracksSi 03-12-10 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beyond (Post 10517169)
Thanks guys. I didn't even think about pitlocks, it seems like a great idea. I'm only anal because the paint job on this Fuji Team is pretty flashy and it has that Carbon look all over it. I've been told by most bike shop guys to simply not park the bike, get another junk bike for the rides to the gym and use the carbon for a weekend bike.

I'd agree with the shop guys.

Quote:

As far as chains go, The Kryptonite New YorkFahgettaboudi Chain also has one of the best reviews, it's 15MM thick, and weights a ton. If you don't mind wearing this around your waist I guess this might be a nice combo for the U-Lock mentioned above but the both of these together is going to be a huge weight. So I guess the 50lb theory you guys mentioned is true LOL.
If I bring my chain with my road bike or MTB, I wear it over one shoulder and across my body like a bandolier. The weight doesn't feel too bad that way. On my steel city bike with a rear rack, I wrap it around the seatpost and lock it to the rack; my thighs kinda bump it, but it's tolerable.

Quote:

Someone told me a story about a guy's bike whose frame was cut just to grab the bike to sell the parts.
Craigslist and eBay are probably the worst things to happen to the security of personal property.

Dahon.Steve 03-12-10 07:36 PM

Any power tools would break open the best U-lock or chain in seconds, not minutes. We've had quite a few people with broken New York 3000 locks and Kryptonie chains so the best have been compromised.

In addition, I've found this to be very true. If the crooks cannot break your lock, they will destroy your bike or just steal parts out of anger! I've had this happen to me so you better be ready.

I think what's more important than choosing the lock is where you park your bike. If you intend to lock your bike at a train station of college campus, expect your new cycle to take a beating! I've found mall bike racks to be almost as bad especially if it's used by teens parking 99 dollar beat up department store bikes.

cia dog 03-12-10 07:43 PM

[QUOTE=Dahon.Steve;10518937]Any power tools would break open the best U-lock or chain in seconds, not minutes. We've had quite a few people with broken New York 3000 locks and Kryptonie chains so the best have been compromised.

/QUOTE]

I mentioned this before and got a bunch of flak from someone who claimed he lived in NY city and no one runs around with power tools to get bikes...I disagreed but since I don't live in NY I didn't have much of an argument.

But my main belief for keeping your bike safe while at work or school is to buy a used bike or a Wallyworld special and leave that one at mall or school racks and leave your good one at home. I'm lucky in that I can take my bike into my office.

tadawdy 03-12-10 10:21 PM

Locking your nicest bike outside is not a good way to go. Much better to have one you would be able to replace if/when it gets stolen.

Not only that, but bike racks are a good place to get a carbon bike damaged

Beyond 03-12-10 10:48 PM

[QUOTE]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dahon.Steve (Post 10518937)
Any power tools would break open the best U-lock or chain in seconds, not minutes. We've had quite a few people with broken New York 3000 locks and Kryptonie chains so the best have been compromised.

Is it really THAT easy to break through a Kryptonite NY U-Lock and NY Chain combo? If it is then I won't even bother buying the locks, I'll just pay a bit more and get a beater to get to the gym.

Quote:

In addition, I've found this to be very true. If the crooks cannot break your lock, they will destroy your bike or just steal parts out of anger! I've had this happen to me so you better be ready.
I guess there is no point securing the frame if they are just going to destroy the frame to get to the parts. Maybe I should just get some sort of tarp to cover the bike :)

Quote:

I think what's more important than choosing the lock is where you park your bike. If you intend to lock your bike at a train station of college campus, expect your new cycle to take a beating! I've found mall bike racks to be almost as bad especially if it's used by teens parking 99 dollar beat up department store bikes.
I agree, parking it in a better spot is a better idea then buying all this crap and locking it in a place that would make the bike more accessible to thieves.

electrik 03-12-10 11:18 PM

How many ways can we say it, don't lock up nice bicycles in public. Even the crappy ones get stolen.

v70cat 03-13-10 09:52 AM

Sounds like a real thief will break any lock might as well get a cheap light lock, to keep away the causal thief.

I was think of just using a Kryptonite Kryptoflex 1018?

cia dog 03-13-10 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by v70cat (Post 10520580)
Sounds like a real thief will break any lock might as well get a cheap light lock, to keep away the causal thief.

I was think of just using a Kryptonite Kryptoflex 1018?

I wouldn't buy that lock because it's just basic protection to keep honest people from becoming dishonest...unless your locking a $25 bike and not worried about losing it.

v70cat 03-13-10 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cia dog (Post 10520806)
I wouldn't buy that lock because it's just basic protection to keep honest people from becoming dishonest...unless your locking a $25 bike and not worried about losing it.

But I thought it was clear that even the biggest and best lock don't stop a thief, so why carry around a heavy lock?

cia dog 03-13-10 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by v70cat (Post 10520833)
But I thought it was clear that even the biggest and best lock don't stop a thief, so why carry around a heavy lock?

The bigger locks will slow down a professional and stop a non-professional. That's why you should use two locking systems to make it more difficult for a professional. But depending on where you live you may not have much if any pro's, thus you want to stop the non-pro.

However the best way to deter a thief is to ride a junker when you have to lock it up outside while at work or school.

By the way, if your bike looks difficult to steal, and another bike is nearby that looks easier, the thief will go after the easy one. Thus park your bike near a bike that uses an inferior locking system if you can.

v70cat 03-13-10 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cia dog (Post 10520928)
The bigger locks will slow down a professional and stop a non-professional. That's why you should use two locking systems to make it more difficult for a professional. But depending on where you live you may not have much if any pro's, thus you want to stop the non-pro.

However the best way to deter a thief is to ride a junker when you have to lock it up outside while at work or school.

By the way, if your bike looks difficult to steal, and another bike is nearby that looks easier, the thief will go after the easy one. Thus park your bike near a bike that uses an inferior locking system if you can.

i am buying a $200 bike as a "junker"

electrik 03-13-10 02:07 PM

In my opinion, if you're spending money on a lock, just get a really good one... there is a very large gap on quality(type of steel, disc locks and etc) and deterrence(image of being a tough lock) between the expensive locks and the no-name. Why spend half the cost on something that only gives a quarter the protection..


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