iowa already has licencing, or at least did at one point. it was simply a sticker stuck to the bike in the shape of the state, about the size of a nickel. it was more or less a way to track your bike if it was stolen... like a licence plate number. keep in mind i dont know if they still do it here.
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Two different things between licensing bikes and licensing riders. The town I used to live in used to license bikes for theft recovery/ID. AFAIK it never really paid off and the data base is no longer in existence. IIRC you paid $1 at any fire department or precinct and they would register your bike for you. I had several stolen that had the stickers on them and none of them were ever recovered.
Aaron :) |
But as someone else pointed out, what would we be paying for? Bicycles don't need anything. They can ride across any terrain and don't require any sort of infrastructure at all. They cause no pollution, and are human powered. What next, licences for skateboards? Rollerblades? Shoes?
The only reason people think we need bicycle lanes are because of cars and the lack of driver education. Bicycle lanes are useless IMO, and I rarely use them as they are usually full of drain covers and road debris. As it is due to motorists that we need an infrastructure / education to protect us then motorists should pay for it. I honestly wouldn't care if there were no roads at all, I'd just buy a bike with suspension / fat tyres and continue riding. It would be the motorists who will complain first. |
I'd be fine with being licensed and taxed for bicycle use. We use the roads, we should pay something for it too.
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A money grab? More like a money loser. More employees, with bennies and pensions, records, blah, blah blah. No way license fees will pay for all that. bk
OOPS! Starting to sound like a Republican. |
Originally Posted by Zeppast
(Post 10921473)
but there's a certain freedom that comes with riding a bike a care free feeling, now don't get me wrong I'm not talking about being reckless or irresponsible on the road I just think all the rules a regulations would take some of that freedom away.
Imagine the death and chaos that would result today if motorists didn't have the threat of losing their driving privileges. I wish all of us cyclists could be a little more responsible without that threat hanging over us, but thanks to the abusers, it may pass. And once it passes in one metropolis, other metropolises will probably follow suit. |
Originally Posted by calamarichris
(Post 10926450)
There was probably a time when motorists enjoyed the certain care free feeling of driving around everywhere too; but enough of them abused it, and now licensing is mandatory, (and most state DMVs & law-enforcement personnel are quick to point out that driving in their state is a privilege, not a right.)
Imagine the death and chaos that would result today if motorists didn't have the threat of losing their driving privileges. I wish all of us cyclists could be a little more responsible without that threat hanging over us, but thanks to the abusers, it may pass. And once it passes in one metropolis, other metropolises will probably follow suit.
Originally Posted by nahh
(Post 10926227)
I'd be fine with being licensed and taxed for bicycle use. We use the roads, we should pay something for it too.
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Originally Posted by calamarichris
(Post 10926450)
There was probably a time when motorists enjoyed the certain care free feeling of driving around everywhere too; but enough of them abused it, and now licensing is mandatory, (and most state DMVs & law-enforcement personnel are quick to point out that driving in their state is a privilege, not a right.)
Imagine the death and chaos that would result today if motorists didn't have the threat of losing their driving privileges. I wish all of us cyclists could be a little more responsible without that threat hanging over us, but thanks to the abusers, it may pass. And once it passes in one metropolis, other metropolises will probably follow suit. |
YES!!!
Even as I write this post a bill is moving through the legislature in Arizona. Failure to have a license on a bike will specificially be a reason that police may investigate the immigration status of the rider. |
Originally Posted by nahh
(Post 10926227)
I'd be fine with being licensed and taxed for bicycle use. We use the roads, we should pay something for it too.
Aaron :) |
Originally Posted by wahoonc
(Post 10926931)
I already pay for the roads via property taxes, income taxes and sales taxes. I can't find the study at the moment but it indicates that cyclists pay more for the amount of road they use than motorists. The same study indicates that most cars and trucks DON'T pay for the full amount of road they use.
Aaron :) With cutbacks due to current economic conditions police have told me they basically do not have the time or manpower to enforce rules of the road for bicyclists. If they did then more bicyclists would not be scofflaws. They do it because they can get away with it 99% of the time without penalty. Is this going to change by licensing bikes or riders? It does not seem to stop many auto drivers who routinely ignore traffic laws. |
If I have to license my bicycle will the police put as much effort into recovering it as they would if it was a car or motorcycle, should it be stolen? Will my insurance company cover it for damages?
Probably not, so I say this measure is just cyclist harassment. |
Originally Posted by Keith99
(Post 10926707)
YES!!!
Even as I write this post a bill is moving through the legislature in Arizona. Failure to have a license on a bike will specificially be a reason that police may investigate the immigration status of the rider. |
The bonus double post "feature" of BF strikes again!
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Licensing bicycles is nothing new. Back in the 50s in the Wisconsin town where we lived, all bicycles were required to be licensed. They issued little metal license plates that were supposed to displayed on the back of the seat. The cool thing to do was to take the license plate and stick it into your spokes -- like the way that some young kids now put cards or photographs in their spokes. I guess that's the new cool. If you were caught riding an unlicensed bike you had to go to bicycle court. I'm not making this up. I had to go to bicycle court once when I was about 10 for riding two abreast. I got probation. So, will laws be passed requiring that bicycles be license? Sure, you bet. Will laws be passed requiring that bicycle riders be licensed? Maybe in Austin and Madison, but other places, no.
edit: somewhere in the forums today somebody was riffing on Alice's Restaurant. Just made me think, "kid, have you ever been arrested?" |
Originally Posted by daven1986
(Post 10926617)
We don't damage the roads though. If only cyclists used the roads, they'd never need to be resurfaced - we'd just buy fatter tyres! Cars and other heavy vehicles place a lot of wear and tear on the roads - hence why they have to pay road tax. They also take up huge amounts of space, require lots of infrastructure as they have the potential to be so dangerous and they pollute.
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Originally Posted by wahoonc
(Post 10926931)
I already pay for the roads via property taxes, income taxes and sales taxes. I can't find the study at the moment but it indicates that cyclists pay more for the amount of road they use than motorists. The same study indicates that most cars and trucks DON'T pay for the full amount of road they use.
Aaron :) |
Originally Posted by nahh
(Post 10927386)
That's such a bogus study, if it is real. Most cyclists in the US also drive cars, and pay taxes to use that infrastructure. Cyclists pay the same amount, because they use the roads the same. The only way this has any fact is say, truckers vs. your average daily driver, just because a trucker is on the roads so much more and a heavier, more obtrusive vehicle.
Also you can place around 12 cyclists in the same amount of road space that it takes for a medium sized car.And while we are at it vehicle traffic kills around 43,000 people annually and costs around $164.5 billion a year, show me anywhere, anyway, anyhow that cyclists are going to generate those kinds of costs. If they want to tax cyclists do it on a per pound basis, but tax other vehicles the same. Dollar a pound a year sounds fair to me... Aaron :) |
Originally Posted by electrik
(Post 10921858)
It would have to be very expensive license and a tiny program in order to run without debt... City of Toronto looked at it and the numbers just don't add up. It has been repeatedly tabled(by anti-bicycle advocates) and then taken off the table(by taxpayers).
Originally Posted by Tom Stormcrowe
(Post 10921874)
Ultimately, it would cost more than it would bring in. Several jurisdictions have tried it, and no success, because it cost more to administer the program than the revenue it generated.
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Originally Posted by nahh
(Post 10927386)
That's such a bogus study, if it is real. Most cyclists in the US also drive cars, and pay taxes to use that infrastructure..
I put about 2,000km on my car a year because I ride about 85% of the time. I pay pretty much the exact same amount of tax into general revenue as the guy next door who works at the same place. My tax rebate for the 10,000km that I don't drive. 0$. About 12 years ago I worked at a law firm where one of the partners commuted about 15km or so a day year round. Probably in the top 5% of income earners and lived in the second highest property tax region in the country. Rebate for light road use; $0 even though of the thousands of cars he passed everyday, he paid more for their road use than they did. As a bonus the road condition in his neighbourhood were probably the worst in the city. Another partner was a marathon runner, so he would run in 20km or bike in. Yeah, his rebate was $0 too. All we ask in return for our tax dollar is to not be run over or run off the road. Too much I guess. |
http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/6715/license1p.jpg
Bicycles are required to be licensed where I live for years now, the price was approx $2.50US but in 2008 the new government raised it by 5 times the amount. It doesn't bother me since there is no annual fee and the metal plate lasts forever (the numbers on mine's is starting to wear so I touched it up with white-out :thumb:). However it would be a problem if they started to charge cyclist each year. |
Originally Posted by Tom Stormcrowe
(Post 10921874)
Ultimately, it would cost more than it would bring in. Several jurisdictions have tried it, and no success, because it cost more to administer the program than the revenue it generated.
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Originally Posted by calamarichris
(Post 10926450)
There was probably a time when motorists enjoyed the certain care free feeling of driving around everywhere too; but enough of them abused it, and now licensing is mandatory, (and most state DMVs & law-enforcement personnel are quick to point out that driving in their state is a privilege, not a right.)
Imagine the death and chaos that would result today if motorists didn't have the threat of losing their driving privileges. I wish all of us cyclists could be a little more responsible without that threat hanging over us, but thanks to the abusers, it may pass. And once it passes in one metropolis, other metropolises will probably follow suit.
Originally Posted by Machka
(Post 10923400)
There ... I fixed that for you.
Saskatchewan had bicycle licensing back in the 1970s, complete with mini license plates ... for all cyclists from the child on his/her first two-wheeler to adults. It's been done. Here, have a look ... scroll all the way to the bottom and you'll see the 1976 license plates for bicycles. I lived there from 1976 to 1979, so I would have had a license just like that on my bicycle. http://www.plateshack.com/76/SK/saskatchewan.html
Originally Posted by illdoittomorrow
(Post 10927731)
Those are good arguments, but they may not work on the spittle-flecked editorial-page letter writer or the local pol who wants his vote. That not all the costs could be covered by fees won't matter to Joe the Motorist as much as the fact that cyclists would primarily be the ones getting hosed (and if licensing fees don't cover costs, well, just raise them until they do!). Your local pol won't care because none of it is his money, and he gets to make noises about responsibility, etc.
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Originally Posted by Chris L
(Post 10928824)
Oh, puh-leeeze! Does anyone seriously believe that a licencing system will have any impact on "scofflaw" cyclists?
I never said licensing would be effective, but that won't stop a frustrated electorate from making it a reality. Puh-lease try to remain focused on the issue at hand instead of engaging in emotional tirades. |
When they start regulating bicycles, I'm going to start an outlaw bicycle gang.:p
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