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Old 09-13-04, 10:36 AM   #26
spectreman
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i have the kyptonite mini (3" X 5").....

i still can't believe this.
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Old 09-13-04, 10:40 AM   #27
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2000 Evolution, or regular?
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Old 09-13-04, 10:45 AM   #28
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Wow! Thanks for the info. I'm gonna go out right now and try this on all the bikes in the bike rack And when you say BIC pen, you mean those little clear plastic ones that are good for spit balls?
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Old 09-13-04, 10:52 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by progre-ss
Wow! Thanks for the info. I'm gonna go out right now and try this on all the bikes in the bike rack And when you say BIC pen, you mean those little clear plastic ones that are good for spit balls?


And I trust that you will use this information for good, not evil! At first this was my biggest concern - but after thinking about it, theives WILL share this information and it will become a problem, so it's better that everyone knows before it's too late. It's obvious ignoring this problem won't make it go away.
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Old 09-13-04, 11:02 AM   #30
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I tried two of those pens and kept trying this morning. I do so, because I want to know if this is possible on all locks or if there are a few fault ones, or whatever. Still no dice. Firstly, I can't even get that nib in the spaces, that nib is too fat - at least the medium is, are you using fine or extra fine or something?

I tried a dried up 0.3 technical drawing pen and a 0.5 after that - both don't work. Got one of the smaller extensions on my Gerber multi-tool out that fit inside and that didn't work either.

Oh, and all mini u-locks are the Evolution 2000. They don't make another kind, at least not in the past few years and as far as I know...
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Old 09-13-04, 11:07 AM   #31
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what about the NY 3000?


it doesnt look as "mini" but it doesnt use the round key.
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Old 09-13-04, 11:09 AM   #32
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Okay, pen body count is increasing rapidly. Lock is laughing at me louder every minute. For those of you that were successfull. Let me know what pen model you are using, so I can stop sacrificing civilians.
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Old 09-13-04, 11:16 AM   #33
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Ok - I'm not sure some of you actually get what I'm saying - you use the outer plastic part of the pen, not the insides. You will notice (if you get the right size pen) that it fits into the lock just as your key would, but nice and snug, which allows you to turn it.

As long as the pen you are using fits snugly over that center piece, you should be able to do it.

And no - any non barrel type of key such as the one you posted above would not be vunerable to this kind of attack... not that it can't be picked, just not with a pen as far as I know.
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Old 09-13-04, 11:18 AM   #34
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i cant get mine open, maybe i have a good key shape....its the standard U lock, not mini or anything like that. if you're all nervous about you locks now, i know that krypto makes a combo lock also.

i was examining the pattern of my key, i have some very tall and very short notches. this probably makes using a bic pen to pick it difficult. for those of you who got your lock open with a pen, examine your key, i expect that all the notches are at roughly the same level.
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Old 09-13-04, 11:27 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by absntr
Oh, and all mini u-locks are the Evolution 2000. They don't make another kind, at least not in the past few years and as far as I know...
kryptonite also makes the "plus" series U-locks. same design as the mini and the mini LS, but less expensive and seemingly thicker metal.

there's a staff meeting at my shop today, and i'll try this out during it. if i can get it, i'll be sure to let everyone know.

thanks for thie info.
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Old 09-13-04, 11:36 AM   #36
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legalize it:

Yes, I suspected the same thing, and there are about 4 or so pins with very similar heights on my key - but there are three notches with alternating heights of what look to be the extreme reaches of the pins. That said, the overall 'reach' on the pins for the Evolution 2k locks seems to be extremely short.. probably 1/8th of an inch, which I presume has a lot to do with the problem.

Try rapidly shaking it as you turn it if it's not working for you - there are devices locksmiths use which just have a pin that violently vibrates as you apply torsional force. This method eventually shakes the pins into a configuration similar to the key and it pops open - the shorter the reach on the pins, the better this method works.

I would also advise against combo locks - the internals in these makes lock picking a lot easier because they essentially have a the lock and the key already to work with.
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Old 09-13-04, 11:37 AM   #37
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Ok, so at first I was skeptical. I had a late night last night and came across this post, I thought it might be a hoax, tried a few pens, then went to bed.

This morning, seeing more replies, I was determined to get on top of this. First of all, the brand of pen is the most defining factor. It must be a Bic pen, as they have the correct internal diameter to fit the key cylinder of the Kryptonite lock.

Second, it doesn't take much at all. It would in fact look very much like you were unlocking the bike as if it were yours. Not that people really do anything if they see someone stealing your bike anyway.

Third, I am pissed. The Kryptonite locks were the only thing that gave me a sense of security for my bikes. Now all of the technology that went into the "unbreakable" portions has been made pointless by the simple ball point pen.

I have included some pictures, showing how the cylinder is left in a half-locked position as a previous poster described.

I spose we could all start making some money on the kryptonite $3000 coverage by committing a little friendly insurance fraud
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Old 09-13-04, 11:38 AM   #38
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unaesthetic, did you call Krytonite?

Curious to what they say.
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Old 09-13-04, 11:43 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SSenorPedro
Ok, so at first I was skeptical. I had a late night last night and came across this post, I thought it might be a hoax, tried a few pens, then went to bed.

This morning, seeing more replies, I was determined to get on top of this. First of all, the brand of pen is the most defining factor. It must be a Bic pen, as they have the correct internal diameter to fit the key cylinder of the Kryptonite lock.

Second, it doesn't take much at all. It would in fact look very much like you were unlocking the bike as if it were yours. Not that people really do anything if they see someone stealing your bike anyway.

Third, I am pissed. The Kryptonite locks were the only thing that gave me a sense of security for my bikes. Now all of the technology that went into the "unbreakable" portions has been made pointless by the simple ball point pen.

I have included some pictures, showing how the cylinder is left in a half-locked position as a previous poster described.

I spose we could all start making some money on the kryptonite $3000 coverage by committing a little friendly insurance fraud
Thank you! See - I am to be taken seriously

And yes, I felt that same feeling when I opened mine. The krypto is one of only two locks I recommend people buying - the other is the krypto nyc chain. I spend a lot of money on locks because I feel it's a worthwhile investment. You know the rest.

Also, I filed the outer flange off of one of my keys which allows you to insert the key in the 'open' position your lock is now probably stuck in (as I see in the picture) - this will allow you to close it. Uh.. not that you'd want to use it for anything more than a paperweight...
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Old 09-13-04, 11:43 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by dirtydan
unaesthetic, did you call Krytonite?

Curious to what they say.
No, but I wrote them a hell of an email right before I went public with this information.

I'm giving them until noon to reply and then I'm calling them.

Anyone else called them yet?
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Old 09-13-04, 11:55 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SSenorPedro
I spose we could all start making some money on the kryptonite $3000 coverage by committing a little friendly insurance fraud
Believe me - I had a pretty good mind to keep my mouth shut about this for that exact reason.. haha

Then the angel on my other shoulder chimed in and reminded me to be good.

Scary thing is though I bet the insurance would not cover this - there's absolutly no proof anything was broken since this method works just like a key. I think they require you to send them the broken lock as proof.
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Old 09-13-04, 11:55 AM   #42
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2000 Evolution, or regular?
regular
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Old 09-13-04, 12:02 PM   #43
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Alright, so I just got off the phone with Kryptonite. 1-800-729-5625, then press 3 for customer service. They say they heard about this method last week, but have been unable to get it to work in the office.

I stressed that it was imperative to use a Bic pen and that I was rather disconcerted with the whole issue.

The name of the person I spoke with was Lee, she was rather helpful and suggested that I send my lock along with the pen that I used to open it to their offices. The proposed solution is to have them re-key the lock with a smaller diameter key cylinder.

I suggest that everyone here call them up and discuss the problem with them. This needs to be remedied, and before any more unsuspecting persons get hit.

Let 'em know how you feel, and lets also look at some good alternatives guys.

Sure glad I didn't buy that NY chain last week. This Sucks!
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Old 09-13-04, 12:11 PM   #44
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Is it just the minis? I have an Evo2000 regular size and the bic doesn't seem to fit in the keyhole
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Old 09-13-04, 12:11 PM   #45
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I, too, just called Kryptonite, and I too spoke to Lee. She's meeting with her supervisor this afternoon to find a solution, and will be in contact with me tomorrow at the latest... I'll post an update as soon as I hear back.
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Old 09-13-04, 12:18 PM   #46
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Anybody know how to post a movie the board? I just shot myself unlocking mine in about 12 seconds with the pen. I think it may be cheaper than sending them my lock
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Old 09-13-04, 12:20 PM   #47
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OK I got the pen in but it's not defeating the lock.
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Old 09-13-04, 12:24 PM   #48
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Still can't open my evolution 2000 mini lock. Using the right pen too. Wondering if this affects all locks of this kind.
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Old 09-13-04, 12:27 PM   #49
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SSenorPedro - email me the video and I can upload it to a server with a lot of bandwidth. I was going to do this myself tonight but I'm at work all day.
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Old 09-13-04, 12:27 PM   #50
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I haven't defeated my Evo 2000 Mini LS yet, but I see how it works, and I think I WILL be able to with a little effort and maybe a little lube in the cylinder...

SSenorPedro - how large a file is that movie? Perhaps hosting it someplace else and linking to it from here would be simpler than trying to post it here directly...
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