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Old 05-23-11, 03:51 PM   #1
nelson4568
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who still makes lugged steel frames

i wanted to know which brands hand made or not USA Italian either hand made or mass produced who still makes lugged bike frames I know of Torelli, cinelli, and the masi gran criterium, but which other brands still make that vintage style
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Old 05-23-11, 05:19 PM   #2
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Almost any custom frame builder makes them, like Mercian and Waterford. There are a lot of smaller shops out there too, just not that well known. I can't remember most of them off memory.

Production frames are a bit trickier since most are partially welded, with some lugged parts. Rivendell is the most infamous, SOMA makes a couple I think (from Taiwan). I don't really know too much about 100% lugged and brazed steel frames that are stocked and available on short notice.
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Old 05-23-11, 06:50 PM   #3
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Take a look at Sanner Cycles,
from personal experience Tim makes a nice lugged frame at a reasonable price.
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Old 05-23-11, 07:47 PM   #4
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Bob Jackson, Mercian are two that come to mind.

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Old 05-23-11, 08:11 PM   #5
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Bruce Gordon makes beautiful frames that are steel and lugged.
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Old 05-23-11, 09:16 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by nelson4568 View Post
i wanted to know which brands hand made or not USA Italian either hand made or mass produced who still makes lugged bike frames I know of Torelli, cinelli, and the masi gran criterium, but which other brands still make that vintage style
ALL of the cycles that Worksman makes are handmade lugged steel frames and have been made this way for over 100 years.

www.worksman.com
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Originally Posted by krazygluon
Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
Aluminum: barely a hundred, which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?
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Old 05-23-11, 10:03 PM   #7
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I know I'm committing an internet sin by asking this, and I'm very, very sorry about that; however, my question is this: given two bikes at equal price points with equal geometries, tubing, braze-ons, and anything else I haven't thought of, why would you prefer lugged joints over tig-welded, beyond asthetics?
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Old 05-23-11, 10:35 PM   #8
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You can replace tubes in lugged frames ,TIG frame you just get another one..
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Old 05-24-11, 04:26 AM   #9
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I know I'm committing an internet sin by asking this, and I'm very, very sorry about that; however, my question is this: given two bikes at equal price points with equal geometries, tubing, braze-ons, and anything else I haven't thought of, why would you prefer lugged joints over tig-welded, beyond asthetics?
Equal price point? Welded is usually less expensive for similar quality. Putting aesthetics aside, there's little logical reason to go lugged.

Personally aesthetics matter a lot to me, and I'm much more fond and proud to own a quality lugged steel frame, which gets me more pleasure out of the investment. Welds, especially the big wide ones on aluminum frames bother me. I think it's worthwhile, for how little that may matter to someone else.
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Old 05-24-11, 06:09 AM   #10
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The lug-maker, Henry James has a list of USA builders, most of them one-man shops, who use lugged construction.
Most of them would show at the North American handmade Bike Show NAHBS
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Old 05-24-11, 06:39 AM   #11
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You can replace tubes in lugged frames ,TIG frame you just get another one..
I've heard this argument for years, and while true, is it cost effective ?. Strip frame of parts, ship back to manufacturer (there sure ain't no frame builders in my neck of the woods), have tube replaced AND re-painted, ship back, re-build. Total cost for re-build and paint maybe $500 +.

Or buy new frame ?.

Anybody ever done the math ?.

SB
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Old 05-24-11, 08:40 AM   #12
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I've heard this argument for years, and while true, is it cost effective ?. Strip frame of parts, ship back to manufacturer (there sure ain't no frame builders in my neck of the woods), have tube replaced AND re-painted, ship back, re-build. Total cost for re-build and paint maybe $500 +.

Or buy new frame ?.

Anybody ever done the math ?.

SB
You'd have to strip and rebuild regardless (if you wanted to reuse the parts), which means that cost should not be included.

Replacing a tube would only make sense for an expensive custom.

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Equal price point? Welded is usually less expensive for similar quality. Putting aesthetics aside, there's little logical reason to go lugged.
And with welding, you aren't constrained to just the angles available in lugs.

Last edited by njkayaker; 05-24-11 at 08:50 AM.
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Old 05-24-11, 09:59 AM   #13
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I've heard this argument for years, and while true, is it cost effective ?. Strip frame of parts, ship back to manufacturer (there sure ain't no frame builders in my neck of the woods), have tube replaced AND re-painted, ship back, re-build. Total cost for re-build and paint maybe $500 +.
I would bet it's even more expensive than $500...but more to the point: While in theory a tube can be replaced on a lugged frame, has anyone ever successfully had this sort of repair done?

I ask because a friend of mine broke a toptube on one of his vintage lugged steel bikes (can't remember the brand...a Merckx I think?) and he contacted seventeen different framebuilders about doing exactly that sort of repair.

None of them would take on the work.

Mostly due to scheduling...but still, if you can't find someone to do the repair, it's kinda moot that in theory the repair is possible, no?
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Old 05-24-11, 11:54 AM   #14
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I know I'm committing an internet sin by asking this, and I'm very, very sorry about that; however, my question is this: given two bikes at equal price points with equal geometries, tubing, braze-ons, and anything else I haven't thought of, why would you prefer lugged joints over tig-welded, beyond asthetics?
Why hi-jack this thread when your question deserves it's own thread?

Not nice. Not nice at all.
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I dislike clipless pedals on any city bike since I feel they are unsafe.

Originally Posted by krazygluon
Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
Aluminum: barely a hundred, which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?
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Old 05-24-11, 11:58 AM   #15
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Waterford probably has made as many lugged frames over the years as anyone.
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Old 05-24-11, 03:17 PM   #16
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I thought that apologizing ahead of time would make it okay.
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Old 05-24-11, 03:36 PM   #17
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You can replace tubes in lugged frames ,TIG frame you just get another one..
Can YOU? Who replaces tubes in a lugged frame, ever? Why?
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Old 05-24-11, 05:14 PM   #18
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Can YOU? Who replaces tubes in a lugged frame, ever? Why?
I did on a Colnalgo race bike that I used to own, I had access to a local frame builder. IIRC it was less than 25% the price of a new frame to have the damaged tube replaced, as a bonus he did a full frame check and tweaking and the bike rode better than it did when new. A new semi custom frame can cost upwards of $1500, replacing a tube and partial repaint less than a third of that.
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RIDE, YOU FOOL, RIDE!"
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"Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
Aluminum: barely a hundred
Which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?"
_krazygluon
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Old 05-24-11, 07:33 PM   #19
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I thought that apologizing ahead of time would make it okay.
Nope, didn't work for me. It's like telling someone your going to hurt them in advance......it's still and never will be....nice or polite.

You've got a good idea now make a good thread out of the idea......on your own.

Have a good day.........
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My preferred bicycle brand is.......WORKSMAN CYCLES
I dislike clipless pedals on any city bike since I feel they are unsafe.

Originally Posted by krazygluon
Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
Aluminum: barely a hundred, which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?
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Old 05-24-11, 07:41 PM   #20
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http://www.rivbike.com/article/bicyc...g/a_lug_primer
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My preferred bicycle brand is.......WORKSMAN CYCLES
I dislike clipless pedals on any city bike since I feel they are unsafe.

Originally Posted by krazygluon
Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
Aluminum: barely a hundred, which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?
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Old 05-24-11, 08:29 PM   #21
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ALL of the cycles that Worksman makes are handmade lugged steel frames and have been made this way for over 100 years.

www.worksman.com
They are lugged frames, but are not the decorative lugs nor the classic road-bike style of frames that most people have in mind when they say "lugged frame". (and, for what it's worth, I think the middle bar on my cruiser frame is welded rather than lugged.)
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Old 05-26-11, 12:49 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Bob Ross View Post
I would bet it's even more expensive than $500...but more to the point: While in theory a tube can be replaced on a lugged frame, has anyone ever successfully had this sort of repair done?

I ask because a friend of mine broke a toptube on one of his vintage lugged steel bikes (can't remember the brand...a Merckx I think?) and he contacted seventeen different framebuilders about doing exactly that sort of repair.

None of them would take on the work.

Mostly due to scheduling...but still, if you can't find someone to do the repair, it's kinda moot that in theory the repair is possible, no?
Biseagal in Toronto does it. Actually he has one of my frames right now, a small realignment and dent repair job.
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Old 05-27-11, 11:18 PM   #23
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http://www.somafab.com/stanyan.html
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Old 05-28-11, 07:46 AM   #24
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I like Trevor Jarvis. Great frames at a reasonable price. He makes the "Flying Gate" frames also.
http://www.tjcycles.co.uk/trevarna.htm
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Old 05-29-11, 06:39 AM   #25
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Can YOU? Who replaces tubes in a lugged frame, ever? Why?
You are a dip.

It has been done and would might make sense for a custom-frame. It doesn't even seem like a big deal but, it isn't going to be cheap.

http://www.yellowjersey.org/zito.html
http://www.bicycleframework.com/
http://www.assenmachers.com/Paint.htm
http://www.rodcycle.com/articles/frame_repair.html
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