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  1. #1
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    which seat post?

    Ritchey Pro Carbon seat post

    $64
    light weight at 235g
    vibration dampening (really excited about this)
    obvious upgrade from Kalloy aluminum seat post
    would match my Ritchey headset
    but a little sleeker looking than I'd like for my plain ol' Surly.

    or

    Salsa Shaft seat post

    -$34, very affordable
    -favorable mention on peterwhitecycles.com
    -"Two-time winner of the Bicycling Magazine Editor's Choice Award"
    -more lightweight than my current Kalloy at 260g
    -Aluminum
    -would match my Salsa Liplock seat post collar
    -fore/aft saddle position and tilt independent of each other, very easy


    What would you pick? Why? Any other suggestions for a an affordable, under $75, seat post, aluminum or carbon? Is carbon really that much better than aluminum? Thanks.
    Last edited by SurlyLaika; 11-30-11 at 09:28 AM.

  2. #2
    Humvee of bikes =Worksman Nightshade's Avatar
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    Not to rain on you parade........ just pick one of the two you have chosen and move on............

    A seat post is a seat post is a seat post.
    My preferred bicycle brand is.......WORKSMAN CYCLES
    I dislike clipless pedals on any city bike since I feel they are unsafe.

    Originally Posted by krazygluon
    Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
    Aluminum: barely a hundred, which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?

  3. #3
    Goodbye Leeroy Jenkins tagaproject6's Avatar
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    Get the one you which is more wallet friendly.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by SurlyLaika View Post
    Ritchey Pro Carbon seat post

    $64
    light weight at 235g
    vibration dampening (really excited about this)
    obvious upgrade from Kalloy aluminum seat post
    would match my Ritchey headset
    but a little sleeker looking than I'd like for my plain ol' Surly.

    or

    Salsa Shaft seat post

    -$34, very affordable
    -favorable mention on peterwhitecycles.com
    -"Two-time winner of the Bicycling Magazine Editor's Choice Award"
    -more lightweight than my current Kalloy at 260g
    -Aluminum
    -would match my Salsa Liplock seat post collar
    -fore/aft saddle position and tilt independent of each other, very easy


    What would you pick? Why? Any other suggestions for a an affordable, under $75, seat post, aluminum or carbon? Is carbon really that much better than aluminum? Thanks.
    You mentioned that yhou are 'really excited' about the vibration damping of the carbon post. Now, I have only ridden with a few carbon posts, but I find the 'vibration damping' claim to be highly overstated. What type of bike are you using? If your tires are any wider than 25mm then the damping from the tires is an order of magnitude greater than that from the seapost.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Nermal's Avatar
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    Peter White's description of the Salsa sounds like the same Salsa I own. If it is, it is simply the most easily adjusted seat post built, and if you can get it for $34 it would be hard to pass up. I think I paid around $80 for mine. Granted, once it's adjusted, you may never want to adjust it again, but it's a great post.

    Before you order, you may want to consider its affect on fit. The Salsa and most others seem to have about 25mm setback. A Thomson Elite can be had with almost zero setback. This is a very significant difference, and this is an opportunity to either improve fit, or totally destroy it.
    Some people are like a Slinky ... not really good for anything, but you still can't help but smile when you shove them down the stairs.

  6. #6
    coprolite fietsbob's Avatar
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    If its your priority, Better vibration damping: Cane Creek Thudbuster ST.
    by virtue of weight of rider specific Elastomers.

    But it's not under $70, nor a weight weenie light.
    rider should be light, with either of your options
    Gram Counting Carbon and Clyde , dont seem a great match.
    Last edited by fietsbob; 11-30-11 at 03:00 PM.

  7. #7
    Mad bike riding scientist cyccommute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nermal View Post
    If it is, it is simply the most easily adjusted seat post built, and if you can get it for $34 it would be hard to pass up. I think I paid around $80 for mine. Granted, once it's adjusted, you may never want to adjust it again, but it's a great post.
    It's the second most easily adjusted seat post built. Race Face seatposts are the most easily adjusted posts. I have both. The Salsa is a little futzier than the RaceFace. You can get the RaceFace in carbon too. Amazon has a 26.8 for $55.
    Stuart Black
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  8. #8
    Humvee of bikes =Worksman Nightshade's Avatar
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    It's really a shame no one offers a quality robust lay back seat post anymore.

    Often times a lay back post will solve many fitting problems............
    My preferred bicycle brand is.......WORKSMAN CYCLES
    I dislike clipless pedals on any city bike since I feel they are unsafe.

    Originally Posted by krazygluon
    Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
    Aluminum: barely a hundred, which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?

  9. #9
    Mad bike riding scientist cyccommute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade View Post
    It's really a shame no one offers a quality robust lay back seat post anymore.

    Often times a lay back post will solve many fitting problems............
    How far back do you want to go? The RaceFace seatposts have healthy setbacks and are a very good quality post. I've owned a Titec Hellbent with a huge setback. It wasn't healthy for the frame.
    Stuart Black
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  10. #10
    Humvee of bikes =Worksman Nightshade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
    How far back do you want to go? The RaceFace seatposts have healthy setbacks and are a very good quality post. I've owned a Titec Hellbent with a huge setback. It wasn't healthy for the frame.
    Once again you make this personal. It it not.

    I had a custom made lay back post made for me to meet my needs. My comments are general in nature.
    My preferred bicycle brand is.......WORKSMAN CYCLES
    I dislike clipless pedals on any city bike since I feel they are unsafe.

    Originally Posted by krazygluon
    Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
    Aluminum: barely a hundred, which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DCB0 View Post
    You mentioned that yhou are 'really excited' about the vibration damping of the carbon post. Now, I have only ridden with a few carbon posts, but I find the 'vibration damping' claim to be highly overstated. What type of bike are you using? If your tires are any wider than 25mm then the damping from the tires is an order of magnitude greater than that from the seapost.
    My tires are 700x25 right now but ideally, they'd be at least 32's. It's a Cross Check. Some people swear by carbon for it's comfort, but the Salsa is almost half the price, only a little heavier, and at least more adjustable than the stock Kalloy I have now. I'm leaning towards Salsa.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nermal View Post
    Peter White's description of the Salsa sounds like the same Salsa I own. If it is, it is simply the most easily adjusted seat post built, and if you can get it for $34 it would be hard to pass up. I think I paid around $80 for mine. Granted, once it's adjusted, you may never want to adjust it again, but it's a great post.

    Before you order, you may want to consider its affect on fit. The Salsa and most others seem to have about 25mm setback. A Thomson Elite can be had with almost zero setback. This is a very significant difference, and this is an opportunity to either improve fit, or totally destroy it.
    I thought I mentioned the setback. Both seat posts have setback, I think 23 and 25mm, almost identical. The pictures look similar to mine as opposed to zero setback seat posts. So I figured I should just stick to what is similar to what I already have. I want to know, though, how setback or the lack of it affects the fit. Why would someone want a zero setback seat post?

    I know the CC's top tube tends to run a bit longer than the top tubes on other similar 'cross jack-of-all-trade bikes like the Bianchi Volpe and Salsa Casseroll. I would think a zero setback would place the saddle closer to the handlebars.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade View Post
    It's really a shame no one offers a quality robust lay back seat post anymore.

    Often times a lay back post will solve many fitting problems............
    Would a lay back seat post place me farther from the handlebars? That's already a problem for me with the longer than typical top tube on the CC. Is 25mm of setback more moderate or just the same thing as a lay back seat post? A zero setback would put me closer, right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SurlyLaika View Post
    Would a lay back seat post place me farther from the handlebars? That's already a problem for me with the longer than typical top tube on the CC. Is 25mm of setback more moderate or just the same thing as a lay back seat post? A zero setback would put me closer, right?
    It would. However, it is generally frowned upon to adjust your saddle to change bar-reach. If your bars are too far away from your saddle then the first option to consider is to get a shorter stem. Saddle adjustments are best used to fine-tune the relationship between your legs, your saddle and your pedals.

    Also, what problems are you having caused by too long of a reach?

  15. #15
    coprolite fietsbob's Avatar
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    Yes how far back? RivBike, Nitto Japan, nickel plated chromoly.
    is a larger setback. .. will set the wallet back too.

    Thompson as a type, gets the opposite , zero setback ,

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by LarDasse74 View Post
    It would. However, it is generally frowned upon to adjust your saddle to change bar-reach. If your bars are too far away from your saddle then the first option to consider is to get a shorter stem. Saddle adjustments are best used to fine-tune the relationship between your legs, your saddle and your pedals.

    Also, what problems are you having caused by too long of a reach?
    My fore/aft adjustment is set with my knee over the pedal spindle. It stays there. I only adjust the tilt which has been causing me taint pain recently, actually pretty badly. My fingers and feet tend to tingle when I ride for any distance. I don't know what's up with that because my Brooks Flyer was perfectly fine until about two weeks ago. I'm still hoping to strike the right angle. Otherwise, I'm getting a saddle with a cut-out. Anyways, the top tube is a little long on my 56cm, so I'm working on getting a 54cm CC which I've test ridden and it feels fantastic. The problem with the top tube is that I generally can't ride on the hoods for very long. Riding on the tops almost exclusively isn't very ergonomic and I'd like to make more use of the hoods. The frame's longer top tube just isn't comfortable. I've already shortened from a 100mm stem to a 80mm one. The next step would be a 70mm but I figure the problem is the frame. I've already figured this out. I'm just stating my fit problems. To sum it up, I need a 54cm frame and possibly a saddle with a cut-out. My stem can stay.

    If I replace my saddle, I don't know if I should get one with zero set back, 25mm set back, or lay back. Is there even a difference between 25mm set back and lay back??
    Last edited by SurlyLaika; 11-30-11 at 11:19 PM.

  17. #17
    Mad bike riding scientist cyccommute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade View Post
    Once again you make this personal. It it not.

    I had a custom made lay back post made for me to meet my needs. My comments are general in nature.
    Point to the 'personal' in my post. Or am I not allowed to disagree with you? Is disagreeing with you is disagreeable?

    Honestly, how far back do you want to go? There are tons of seatposts with 1" to 1.5" of setback. The Titec Hellbent post had about 2" of setback but the leverage that it generated at the seattube could be hard on frames. SR used to make a seatpost with somewhere around 3" of setback



    but the thing isn't what I would call a quality seatpost. It's a quality boat anchor (435g ).
    Stuart Black
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  18. #18
    Mad bike riding scientist cyccommute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SurlyLaika View Post
    I thought I mentioned the setback. Both seat posts have setback, I think 23 and 25mm, almost identical. The pictures look similar to mine as opposed to zero setback seat posts. So I figured I should just stick to what is similar to what I already have. I want to know, though, how setback or the lack of it affects the fit. Why would someone want a zero setback seat post?

    I know the CC's top tube tends to run a bit longer than the top tubes on other similar 'cross jack-of-all-trade bikes like the Bianchi Volpe and Salsa Casseroll. I would think a zero setback would place the saddle closer to the handlebars.
    People want zero setback posts for the same reason they want large setback seatposts...to adjust the fit.

    Quote Originally Posted by SurlyLaika View Post
    Would a lay back seat post place me farther from the handlebars? That's already a problem for me with the longer than typical top tube on the CC. Is 25mm of setback more moderate or just the same thing as a lay back seat post? A zero setback would put me closer, right?
    Given what you've said elsewhere, a zero setback post might be in order for your needs. It pulls you an inch closer to the stem and shortens your reach. Since a new frame is an expensive proposition, a inexpensive zero setback post might be worth the investment. Pricepoint has one for $18. If that fixes your reach problem, it's worth the investment.
    Stuart Black
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    Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
    Days of Wineless Roads. Bed and Breakfasting along the KATY
    Twisting Down the Alley. Misadventures in tornado alley.
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  19. #19
    Humvee of bikes =Worksman Nightshade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
    Honestly, how far back do you want to go? There are tons of seatposts with 1" to 1.5" of setback. The Titec Hellbent post had about 2" of setback but the leverage that it generated at the seattube could be hard on frames. SR used to make a seatpost with somewhere around 3" of setback



    but the thing isn't what I would call a quality seatpost. It's a quality boat anchor (435g ).
    My lay back post allows 5" of set back of which I use 4" to get my stroke and distance to the ground just right.

    My post is stainless steel 7/8" solid rod that weight (this it the bad part) 1.2 pounds! Heavy I know but the damn thing will never bend under my weight!!!!!
    My preferred bicycle brand is.......WORKSMAN CYCLES
    I dislike clipless pedals on any city bike since I feel they are unsafe.

    Originally Posted by krazygluon
    Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
    Aluminum: barely a hundred, which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by LarDasse74 View Post
    It would. However, it is generally frowned upon to adjust your saddle to change bar-reach. If your bars are too far away from your saddle then the first option to consider is to get a shorter stem. Saddle adjustments are best used to fine-tune the relationship between your legs, your saddle and your pedals.

    Also, what problems are you having caused by too long of a reach?
    So it's not a good idea to change the positioning of the saddle? But Cycocommute says it would be a good idea. I'm confused. Do you two, LarDasse and Cycocommute, have opposite opinions or am I missing something?

  21. #21
    Mad bike riding scientist cyccommute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SurlyLaika View Post
    So it's not a good idea to change the positioning of the saddle? But Cycocommute says it would be a good idea. I'm confused. Do you two, LarDasse and Cycocommute, have opposite opinions or am I missing something?
    It is best to get the proper sized frame but frames come in only a few rather narrow sizes and humans come in all kinds of sizes. Adjusting the saddle to a little more forward position with a seatpost that has zero setback would be acceptable given that you've already shortened the stem and are still experiencing fit issues. Sliding your saddle too far forward starts to mess with the front/rear wheel loading of the bike and can mess with the handling. But just don't go crazy. Try the inexpensive post I linked to above first, put you saddle in the middle of the rails or even pushed back a little. Then experiment with the moving the saddle forwards and backwards. It might take a few rides to get the position dialed in.
    Stuart Black
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by SurlyLaika View Post
    So it's not a good idea to change the positioning of the saddle? But Cycocommute says it would be a good idea. I'm confused. Do you two, LarDasse and Cycocommute, have opposite opinions or am I missing something?
    We have different opinions (I am LarDasse74). Mine more from experience working in a shop and designing & helping customers deign hundreds of custom built and assembled bikes over the years; cycos developed by years and years of reading internet forums (jk)

    In reality, his opinion is as valid as mine, and, as with anything you read on the internet, it is up to you to separate the wheat from the chaf. While I hesitate to move the saddle to adjust reach, I will not say that it never works or is always a bad idea. If it makes the bike feel better, then go for it. Then changes you are talking about (25mm setback to zero setback) is not a major change. Also, I just checked the geometry of the Cross CHeck on the surly website and the 54cm has a slightly steeper seat angle than the 56cm... if you have your saddle height at, say, 64cm from the bottom brakcet, the 1/2 degree of difference between the two frame sizes will result in 0.5cm (5mm) difference in seat setback, while swapping the seatpost will result in a change of 25mm of setback.

    My hesitation in reccomending saddle adjustment to fix a reach problem is that moving the saddle changes how and which leg muscles are used, not just the reach.

    But really, it's not that big of a change. And the top tube length of the 54 is only 10mm less than the 56, so if you had started with the same stem length that you originally had on the 56, you would have started with the same stem reach you have now less 5mm. Like Cycocommute said, a new post can be dirt cheap and is certainly worth a try.

    But speaking as someone who (on more than occaision) has tried to get a bike that was only one size off to fit me (I am quite tall and most manufacturers' largest bikes are borderline unacceptable for me) and failed, or got it as close as I could and it still didn't feel right, I think you should start planning to replace the frame with the correct size.

  23. #23
    coprolite fietsbob's Avatar
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    'Lay back' posts come from the BMX bike market, right?

    Regular bikes have a 'set back' dimension .

    That is from a plumb line thru the BB.. back ..

    +1
    I think you should start planning to replace the frame with the correct size.
    if you need a big lay back and a tall seat post, then the frame is outgrown.

    BMX is not Ridden seated, anyhow..


    .. and now back to carbon fiber seatposts and their benefits to the OP.

    and as i cannot see the bike's fit of the rider on the bike,
    the 'should I get' I'd say , no way to tell.
    get both , cheap ones ...and try the fit, then when you have it dialed
    aside:
    FWIW, Brompton parts, their Saddle adapter pin sits horizontal
    on top of a plain type seat post .. then
    there is their Pentaclip a saddle clip that is stepless,
    and can be places ahead , behind, or on top of the SAP,
    set back is an adjustmet of a few inches then..

    after you have the dimensions taken .. Then go upmarket.

    may need a non standard seat-tube angle , so off the peg Frame
    may not even work..
    Last edited by fietsbob; 12-05-11 at 11:55 AM.

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