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Old 01-27-05, 08:58 PM   #1
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He was one of the most astute and knowlegable posters here. I hope he comes back.

I got a kick out of seeing Joe Breeze post today though!
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Old 01-27-05, 09:01 PM   #2
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I believe he left in a fit of arrogant superiority.
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Old 01-27-05, 09:34 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonshot
He was one of the most astute and knowlegable posters here. I hope he comes back.

I got a kick out of seeing Joe Breeze post today though!
No kidding. Thrills, chills! I ride Ritchey and did lots of reaserch. He's the first in mtb's.
First...not the BEST, Tom is.
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Old 01-27-05, 10:46 PM   #4
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He threw a hissy fit and left.
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Old 01-27-05, 11:04 PM   #5
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Ahhh, here we go: "No time to say, 'Hello,'...."
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Old 01-27-05, 11:16 PM   #6
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That's not why he left, when he left. I messaged a mtb forum mod about Mr.B.
He said notice the 'just visiting' tag, and said that several ol'timers had left.

That bites, and I haven't seen posts by Dave Moulton of late.
Hope I haven't added to this.

These are the folks I want to expulge cycling lore from.
Well, the anomonity of internet causes some people to write things they would not say in person.
Buncha whippersnaps, the lot.
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Old 01-28-05, 05:52 AM   #7
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Gotta love when people leave an internet forum and MUST leave a message bidding us all ado. I wish I was that high on myself.
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Old 01-28-05, 06:20 AM   #8
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Have you noticed though that often the most knowledgeable posters often appear the most arrogant (mentioning no names). I am not sure whether it is their arrogance that drives them to gather knowledge or their superior knowledge that causes them to become arrogant.

Or maybe they just APPEAR more knowledgeable because they are so certain they are always right.

Or maybe they are deep down insecure and only lay themselves on the line in areas that they feel totally confident in.

Or it's even just occurred to me that they may have slight autistic tendencies (re Rainman, i.e. the film not the forum member) and are very good at gathering facts but not very sensitive to the feelings of others.

Who knows?
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Old 01-28-05, 06:31 AM   #9
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There's really nothing wrong with being arrogant if you are indeed very good at what you do.
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Old 01-28-05, 07:04 AM   #10
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There's really nothing wrong with being arrogant if you are indeed very good at what you do.
I disagree. Being good at what you do if fine so far as it goes. At some point though you have to deal with other people. No one likes to deal with an arrogant person however good they are.
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Old 01-28-05, 07:09 AM   #11
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I disagree. Being good at what you do if fine so far as it goes. At some point though you have to deal with other people. No one likes to deal with an arrogant person however good they are.
I'd rather have an arrogant bastard doctor who's the best at what he does operate on me, than some stupid schmuck that everyone likes who is not as good......Same with someone who answers forum questions, fixes my car and so on.
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Old 01-28-05, 07:21 AM   #12
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Sheldon Brown is the least arrogant and one of the most knowledgeable bicycle persons I have read (and talked with). A true gentleman.

Same with the late Ken Kifer.

Arrogance and knowledge don't have to go together.

Now, Jobst Brandt is an entirely different matter!
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Old 01-28-05, 07:21 AM   #13
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[in reply to FXJohn] Ok but what happens for example, when Dr A. Bastard has to; a) train new doctors and it is a disaster or; b) tells you "Yes you will probably die and serves you right for falling of your bike" and you become depressed and commit suicide c); or makes the nurses so jumpy they leave a swab inside you during the op or d); the nurses make a mistake with your treatment and are to afraid to tell him and many other scenarios

The largest aircraft disaster in history (on Tenerife) was caused by a KLM pilot who was no doubt technically very competent but who was quite arrogant and domineering. From the tape recordings recovered from the wreckage it appears that the co-pilot was not confident enough to tell the pilot to cancel the take off when he thought it was unsafe. Result two 747's wrecked.

I don't think you should underestimate the importance of human interactions in every day life.
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Old 01-28-05, 07:42 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by royalflash
[in reply to FXJohn] Ok but what happens for example, when Dr A. Bastard has to; a) train new doctors and it is a disaster or; b) tells you "Yes you will probably die and serves you right for falling of your bike" and you become depressed and commit suicide c); or makes the nurses so jumpy they leave a swab inside you during the op or d); the nurses make a mistake with your treatment and are to afraid to tell him and many other scenarios

The largest aircraft disaster in history (on Tenerife) was caused by a KLM pilot who was no doubt technically very competent but who was quite arrogant and domineering. From the tape recordings recovered from the wreckage it appears that the co-pilot was not confident enough to tell the pilot to cancel the take off when he thought it was unsafe. Result two 747's wrecked.

I don't think you should underestimate the importance of human interactions in every day life.
On the other hand, a drill sargeant makes you tough by being a hardass...so if you can please the arrogant bastard who is training you, you are getting "tough love"
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Old 01-28-05, 09:49 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FXjohn
I'd rather have an arrogant bastard doctor who's the best at what he does operate on me, than some stupid schmuck that everyone likes who is not as good......Same with someone who answers forum questions, fixes my car and so on.
My wife has worked with surgeons every day for decades, so I hear lots of stories. My sense is that there are certainly ones who are nice people but incompetent, but also the competent ones are seldom arrogant. The arrogant ones blame everyone else but themself when something goes awry. Crass generalization of course...
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Old 01-28-05, 09:57 AM   #16
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I must agree with FXjohn. Having serious medical problems in the past I've learned that most of the brightest people in medicine do not have time for social skills, nor do they care about the subtle nuances of bed side manner. People may snicker about nerdy scientist/MD types, but I am thankful they have taken such great delight in learning.
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Old 01-28-05, 09:57 AM   #17
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I guess the point that I was trying to make was that i can overlook some arrogance if a person is indeed knowledgeable and competant.
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Old 01-28-05, 10:11 AM   #18
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Quote:
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I guess the point that I was trying to make was that i can overlook some arrogance if a person is indeed knowledgeable and competant.
I suppose you are right in that nice but incompetent is no use to anyone
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Old 01-28-05, 01:04 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by jazzy_cyclist
My wife has worked with surgeons every day for decades, so I hear lots of stories. My sense is that there are certainly ones who are nice people but incompetent, but also the competent ones are seldom arrogant. The arrogant ones blame everyone else but themself when something goes awry. Crass generalization of course...
Agreed.

There are plenty of good doctors out there and I won't go to one who's difficult. I can see having no choice but to visit an arrogant doctor if he was the only physician in town. Otherwise, I go to one who works with me. The same goes with bike shops.
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Old 01-28-05, 01:23 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by royalflash
. . . Ok but what happens for example, when Dr A. Bastard has to; . . .
. . . b) tells you "Yes you will probably die and serves you right for falling of your bike" and you become depressed and commit suicide . . .
you just get it over with with sooner?
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Old 01-28-05, 01:33 PM   #21
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Saying not liking someone knowledgeable but arrogant doesn't mean there must be ignorant but nice people left. There are those who are highly intelligent yet courteous people around too. The point many posters made is that intelligence doesn't warrant arrogance; it is as unexcusable a trait as the imperfect everyone.
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Old 01-28-05, 01:39 PM   #22
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Quote:
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Saying not liking someone knowledgeable but arrogant doesn't mean there must be ignorant but nice people left. There are those who are highly intelligent yet courteous people around too. The point many posters made is that intelligence doesn't warrant arrogance; it is as unexcusable a trait as the imperfect everyone.

No, it's NOT inexcusable. It's just one person's perception. Arrogant, but intelligent people
are worth listening to. Life isn't all about never getting your little feelings hurt.
Was that arrogant ?
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Old 01-28-05, 02:58 PM   #23
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Was that arrogant ?
Homer impression: Arrogant like a fox!
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Old 01-28-05, 03:28 PM   #24
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Quote:
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No, it's NOT inexcusable. It's just one person's perception. Arrogant, but intelligent people
are worth listening to. Life isn't all about never getting your little feelings hurt.
Was that arrogant ?
yes your right in theory but everyone has their baggage and things that send them off the edge. Unfortunately when you deal with people you have to deal with that. For instance if I were to say that you were an ignorant **** who didn“t know his ar*se from his elb*w that woul be very likely to send you off the edge. Why? because you would interpret that I was being aggressive and parental and that would force you respond in an emotional childlike way. Maybe that wouldn“t and something else would. That is the way humans behave like it or not. Most of what people say is not straight information exchange but operates on a more emotional level.
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Old 01-28-05, 03:47 PM   #25
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Quote:
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yes your right in theory but everyone has their baggage and things that send them off the edge. Unfortunately when you deal with people you have to deal with that. For instance if I were to say that you were an ignorant **** who didn“t know his ar*se from his elb*w that woul be very likely to send you off the edge. Why? because you would interpret that I was being aggressive and parental and that would force you respond in an emotional childlike way. Maybe that wouldn“t and something else would. That is the way humans behave like it or not. Most of what people say is not straight information exchange but operates on a more emotional level.
It depends...If you were to say that about say "My knowledge of computer language" you'd be right...but I'd never act like I knew something about a subject that I didn't. Some people just don't mind arrogant, sarcastic people, other people really can't deal with it.
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