Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

General Cycling Discussion Have a cycling related question or comment that doesn't fit in one of the other specialty forums? Drop on in and post in here! When possible, please select the forum above that most fits your post!

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12-29-12, 06:06 PM   #1
maltess2
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Bikes:
Posts: 132
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Vibration Damping systems? SAVE, Zerts and Isozone

Hello, Cannondale is using the SAVE system in most hybrids, Trek is using Isozone and Specialized the Zert Inserts. All these are annoince as road vibration absorbing systems. Its this true or just marketing? Any actual experience with any of these?

Best regards
maltess2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-12, 06:37 PM   #2
Burton
Certified Bike Brat
 
Burton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Bikes:
Posts: 4,251
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Maybe vibration damping is a better description. Do they work? Sure. They reduce the amount of road vibrations that would otherwise be transmitted through the frame, forks and seatpost. OK - thats my experience from a Specialized Roubaix Ultegra with Zertz Inserts.

On the other hand - a hybrid with 700x50 tires doesn't need them.
Burton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-12, 07:33 PM   #3
doctor j
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Central Louisiana
Bikes:
Posts: 2,875
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
My 2012 Cannondale Synapse carbon has the SAVE system, and it works well. It provides a smoother ride than my aluminum bike which has a very similar geometry, curved seat stays, "relaxed" frame etc.
doctor j is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-12, 07:40 PM   #4
maltess2
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Bikes:
Posts: 132
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
I guess the carbon frame has to do with that
maltess2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-12, 11:36 PM   #5
rolliepollie
Flying Pig
 
rolliepollie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Francisco, CA
Bikes: 06 Specialized Allez Sport, '10 Trek Fuel EX 7
Posts: 319
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I had handlebars with zertz before I pretty much replaced almost every part of the bike except the frameset and seatpost, and couldnt tell a difference before. Obviously my wheelset, tires, bar tape, and saddle could've affected it but I wouldn't get zertz to smooth out a ride. You're better off switching one of the above parts. Plus for hybrids and wider tires, I don't see the point. Kind of like getting a carbon mtn frame to smooth out a ride even with tubeless tires and full suspension.
rolliepollie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-30-12, 06:15 AM   #6
martianone
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Northern VT
Bikes: recumbent & upright
Posts: 1,870
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Unless you are racing, why get a frame that is so uncomfortable that it needs damping ? Try a modern steel frame and wider tires ?
martianone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-30-12, 12:28 PM   #7
Nightshade
Humvee of bikes =Worksman
 
Nightshade's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 5,363
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by martianone View Post
Unless you are racing, why get a frame that is so uncomfortable that it needs damping ? Try a modern steel frame and wider tires ?
Funny how the solution to vibration is well known but ignored anyway.
__________________
My preferred bicycle brand is.......WORKSMAN CYCLES
I dislike clipless pedals on any city bike since I feel they are unsafe.

Originally Posted by krazygluon
Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
Aluminum: barely a hundred, which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?
Nightshade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-30-12, 12:54 PM   #8
Looigi
Senior Member
 
Looigi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Bikes:
Posts: 8,942
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have a Specialized Rubaix I got back in 2004 when they first came out. The frame had a pretty nice ride but I attribute that more to compliance than damping the inserts provided. Damping and compliance are, of course, two different things, though they can work together to provide smooth ride quality. An example is the typical suspension system where springs (coil, torsion, or air) provide compliance and oil filled dampers (aka shock absorbers) provide damping. Some elastomers can function both as a spring and damper.
Looigi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-30-12, 03:13 PM   #9
fietsbob 
coprolite
 
fietsbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NW,Oregon Coast
Bikes: 7
Posts: 18,830
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 221 Post(s)
Trek Domane, adds an elastomer at the top/chainstay union,
and so seat tube flexes from the BB upward, how far is controlled by the elastomer..

Then there is the Pan Tour hub, it places an elastomer between the axle and the hub shell
to soften up road buzz.. reads like they sell quite a few to Recumbent builds
most of which have no suspension.
and obviously you cannot rise from the saddle and put your weight, on the pedals
and bend your knees when you see a Bump ahead, like on a traditional bike.

Last edited by fietsbob; 12-30-12 at 03:19 PM.
fietsbob is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-30-12, 06:53 PM   #10
dynaryder
PatronSaintOfDiscBrakes
 
dynaryder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: BicycleSPACE warehouse in SW Washington DC
Bikes:
Posts: 6,983
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
Then there is the Pan Tour hub
FRACK THAT! My Mu SL has one of those god-forsaken things. Such a pain to set up unless you've got a friend to adjust the brakes while you sit on the bike. And then you have to witness mark it so you can get the wheel back on solo. And then the suspension action isn't all that great(not compared to a properly set up fork).

When I ride my Mu,I swap on the front wheel from my Pro TT.
__________________

C'dale BBU('05 and '09)/Super Six/Hooligan8and 3,Kona Dew Deluxe,Novara Buzz/Safari,Surly Big Dummy,Marin Pt Reyes,Giant Defy 1,Schwinn DBX SuperSport,Dahon Speed Pro TT,Brompton S6L/S2E-X
dynaryder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-31-12, 04:40 AM   #11
maltess2
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Bikes:
Posts: 132
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
The steel can ba a solution for those who like steel bikes. This is out of the topic, I am triying to find out id SAVE, Zerts and Isozone works, I am interested in alu bikes
maltess2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-31-12, 06:56 AM   #12
Burton
Certified Bike Brat
 
Burton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Bikes:
Posts: 4,251
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by maltess2 View Post
The steel can ba a solution for those who like steel bikes. This is out of the topic, I am triying to find out id SAVE, Zerts and Isozone works, I am interested in alu bikes
'Works' is relative. You should have noticed by now they pretty much come on road bikes equipped with 700x23c tires, which due to the narrow high pressure tires, tend to transmit more road vibration through the frame. The improvement is marginal at best. Double taping handle bars and/or moving to a 700x25c tire is just as or more effective - it just weighs more.
Burton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-31-12, 08:51 AM   #13
bkaapcke
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 3,222
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
I have an aluminum framed LWB recumbent with a 20" front tire (real stiff). Pavement vibration drove the nerves in my hands nuts. Eventually I had carpal tunnel surgery, which helped a lot. However, the vibration was still there. Slightly fatter folding bead tires with thin sidewalls have really reduced the vibration and brought comfort back to riding. I experimented with lower tire pressures and found a combo that reduces vibration well and maintains decent riding speed. Not racing speeds, but good workout speeds. bk
bkaapcke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-13, 11:22 AM   #14
maltess2
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Bikes:
Posts: 132
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
I trying to find out if when choosing a hybrid bike these damping systems are something to consider. For example a Specialized sirrus comp (Zerts) vs. a Jamis Allegro (No damping system at all)

You mean in the case of a Sirrus, the 28 tyres makes actually pointless the use of Zerts inserts
maltess2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-13, 11:23 AM   #15
maltess2
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Bikes:
Posts: 132
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Burton View Post
'Works' is relative. You should have noticed by now they pretty much come on road bikes equipped with 700x23c tires, which due to the narrow high pressure tires, tend to transmit more road vibration through the frame. The improvement is marginal at best. Double taping handle bars and/or moving to a 700x25c tire is just as or more effective - it just weighs more.

MemberJoin DateJun 2012Posts43

I trying to find out if when choosing a hybrid bike these damping systems are something to consider. For example a Specialized sirrus comp (Zerts) vs. a Jamis Allegro (No damping system at all)

You mean in the case of a Sirrus, the 28 tyres makes actually pointless the use of Zerts inserts

maltess2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-13, 11:55 AM   #16
fietsbob 
coprolite
 
fietsbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NW,Oregon Coast
Bikes: 7
Posts: 18,830
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 221 Post(s)
Supple, light wider, tires will do more .. they will cost more ..
The RBW/Panasonic Jack-Brown 33.333 wide tires are quite nice..

my test-bike , a Cross bike, steel, Pinarello..
fietsbob is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:38 AM.