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Old 09-17-13, 08:25 AM   #26
DataJunkie
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Man...bike clubs are wonderful. Mine really only races and trains together on a random basis. We tend to have a different mindset than the sue happy riders.
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Old 09-17-13, 08:40 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
Exactly. If someone goes on a club ride and falls and gets really hurt, how will the club insurance protect the club organizers? What's the limit? Who pays when the limit gets exceeded? How do you protect the club organizer's assets? This isn't even thinking about the rider who fell, I'm just thinking of the folks that, out of the goodness of their hearts, try to organize a club and organize some group rides.
Thanks for the clarification! For a moment, I thought you were suggesting that people sue their club!
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Old 09-17-13, 09:12 AM   #28
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Thanks for the clarification! For a moment, I thought you were suggesting that people sue their club!
Heh. No. It's the rider's estate's responsibility to make sure that the rider gets any care s/he needs. It means, in the US, suing everyone that might have money, insurance, etc. Usually it's not personal, it's actually the law. In other words an insurance company may sue the club because their client got hurt on a club ride. However it happens it leaves the club organizers at risk.

One of my wife's clients (she's a CPA) had to sue a family member. I don't know the situation but the client's adult child died and there's some law in CT where the estate must maximize the benefits to the beneficiaries. Therefore one side of the family sued the other. If they didn't then they would be liable if a distant relative called them on it.

I promote races and sometimes organize rides. I use USA Cycling - $150 a year and I can get a ride covered at a minimal cost per rider ($1.50? I forget) and for the risk it covers it's nothing. In races it's $3 for each racer. I organized rides for a long, long time without insurance and I was lucky nothing serious ever happened. I was young, dumb, and lucky. Now I try to cover my ass.
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Old 09-17-13, 09:51 AM   #29
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Here locally, we have a ride that is supposed to be a club ride, only none of the riders seem to be in contact with the club itself. Result is I don't know who to contact to find out if they're riding, when they're riding, etc. So I'm sure communication is wonderful if you happen to know who to contact and get in their email/facebook/whatever loop, otherwise, they are completely out of touch.
Why not just ask someone at the ride what the Facebook page is. And then you could be in the know too. That would be pretty easy.
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Old 09-17-13, 10:09 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
Heh. No. It's the rider's estate's responsibility to make sure that the rider gets any care s/he needs. It means, in the US, suing everyone that might have money, insurance, etc. Usually it's not personal, it's actually the law. In other words an insurance company may sue the club because their client got hurt on a club ride. However it happens it leaves the club organizers at risk.
No, I don't think it works that way (not generally). The "law" doesn't require anybody to sue anybody else.

Every case that I know about has been the injured person or the next-of-kin bringing the suit themselves. You are making stuff up.

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Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
One of my wife's clients (she's a CPA) had to sue a family member. I don't know the situation but the client's adult child died and there's some law in CT where the estate must maximize the benefits to the beneficiaries. Therefore one side of the family sued the other. If they didn't then they would be liable if a distant relative called them on it.
This seems very bogus to me.

The executor has a fiduciary responsibilty to the beneficiaries. They don't have to "maximize" anything.

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Old 09-17-13, 10:36 AM   #31
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Read? Bowling Alone http://bowlingalone.com/
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Old 09-17-13, 10:39 AM   #32
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I know personally know several people who have been sued by the insurance companies of friends or family members. Your insurance company will try to recoup their losses if at all possible, and their not gonna ask your permission to do so. That said, as far as I can tell, these things ended up just being resolved between the 2 parties insurance companies.
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Old 09-17-13, 10:51 AM   #33
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Read? Bowling Alone http://bowlingalone.com/
This is exactly what I was going to suggest. The concept is simple. All types of non-profits, fraternal organizations, and clubs are dying out. However, people are actually doing some of these things more than in the past. The author came up with the idea of the title when he found out, more people bowl now that ever before. However bowling allies are suffering. Why? People do not join leagues anymore, and that is where the real money was made. Working for a non-profit, I see this all the time during conventions and such. It is a room full of white hair that is shrinking.
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Old 09-17-13, 12:52 PM   #34
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There are a number of bicycle "clubs" in my city that are organized as described in the OP. They are run through Facebook groups (a public one plus a private one that only the leaders see). Leadership is by invite, and to date the one that I'm involved in has never had to worry about votes or differences of opinion. We discuss things and reach a consensus. I think it helps that the primary leader is interested in the club's success, but may leave town at some point to pursue other interests, so he's all about sharing power/responsibility and not hoarding it. We also have a checking account; we do shirt orders and raise money for local causes (almost saved up enough for a second publicly-accessible Fixstation and a third one is planned). There's the chance that someone could really abuse it but so far it's been a tight group of people whose primary interest is the club and on a more general basis, cycling and community.

I don't think you need a formal club to do these things. Just do 'em.
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Originally Posted by bragi "However, it's never a good idea to overgeneralize."
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Old 09-17-13, 03:10 PM   #35
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The current medical insurance environment in the US is a classic example of market failure.
What the hell would you know about it, you Commie!

Relax, just kidding.

In Loovul the club interfaces with the city gubmint. That's good.

They also sponsor cookie rides and races.

They send left-over money to needy organizations, like the American Communist Party.

Just kidding again. They send it to the League of American Cyclists.

And you can buy nifty jerseys from them.
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Old 10-01-13, 06:24 PM   #36
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Most of the posts here seem to be from people who live in large cities and have many ride choices. I live in rural area where the towns are 5K-10K people or even less. So I belong to 3 clubs that are based about 30 miles apart. Only 2 of these offer weekeday rides and those are just 1 evening each. Each of the clubs usually offers at least 1 weekend ride. All 3 of these clubs have declining membership over the last 10 years, we just can't get young people to join. Most members are in their late 40s or older. Occasionally when a thirty something person arrives for a ride we try to get them to join but usually they are not interested. They have their own facebook groups they organized for getting together for rides or meetup groups etc. It's become a major problem keeping these clubs going. Without new members these clubs will fail. I'm not sure if it has always been this way and it's just getting worse? Younger people with kids are so much busier than parents of 20-30 years ago. There are just so many organized sports and school events it seems people don't join clubs until their kids are grown?
When I used to belong to car clubs we had the same problem, all of the members were old.
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Old 10-02-13, 08:27 AM   #37
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If run like the bike club here, clubs are great. Probably the biggest benefit is the fully supported rides. Our club puts on a spring ride, and a late summer ride that has 25, 35, and a metric cent. It is fully supported with sag stops, and roving sags. Is lets riders get out of town on a new route that they may not want to ride alone. They have the security of the sag stops and knowing if something unforscene happens they will be taken care of. We usually have any where from 200 to 400 riders. Almost to a one they say how great the ride is run, and thank us for having it.
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