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-   -   Organized rides - Leisure riders dilemma (http://www.bikeforums.net/general-cycling-discussion/933216-organized-rides-leisure-riders-dilemma.html)

njkayaker 02-07-14 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dermbrian (Post 16476983)
I was only stating a little dismay over someone saying that someone had no business riding that distance. I suppose people shouldn't walk marathons, either, yet they do....even if the finish line closes and there's no support.

The "no business" comment wasn't made by the ride organizers (as far as anybody knows).

The fact is, it's fairly common for a few people to do the these rides and finish when the course is closed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dermbrian (Post 16475398)
"With respect to the prior comment about the 40 mile rest stop closing at 11:30 almost 4 hours into ride, that individual has no business riding that distance if he cant get 40 miles in nearly 4 hours."

The context for the "no business" comment was a rest-stop being closed.

If a slow rider is OK with the reststop being closed, it doesn't seem to be any problem.

If the slow rider expects the reststop to be open, then they really have "no business" expecting that.

=============

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dermbrian (Post 16476983)
I re-read my initial post and will stand by those comments. I in no way said that rest stops should be kept open for stragglers, or that the finish line should be staffed into the early evening. I was only stating a little dismay over someone saying that someone had no business riding that distance. I suppose people shouldn't walk marathons, either, yet they do....even if the finish line closes and there's no support.

If you are OK with stops being closed and arriving after everybody has left, there isn't any problem doing the ride. No one would really care (unless the SAG wanted to sweep you).

knobster 02-07-14 06:21 PM

Usually organized rides like this that require registration state policy as far as when rest stops, SAG and the finish will end. If you're slower than that, you either get picked up by SAG or you're on your own. I didn't see it on their site so they should either tell you this at the start or they should expect to have everything open until the last rider comes in. Regardless of when that is. My opinion....

My wife and I did our first century at an organized event about 8 years ago and we had a decent pace (I think like 16mph) and when we got to the finish line there was nobody there. Just some people packing up their bikes. We were nowhere near the last people coming in so I think this was poorly organized and very unprofessional. Was a little bit of a let down. Other organized centuries I've done I didn't have that problem. Maybe you'll get lucky with other rides by different folks.

BlazingPedals 02-07-14 07:49 PM

Don't feel too bad about getting back and finding an empty parking lot. I did a 100-MILE route one time with 2 friends. We averaged over 20 mph; but apparently we were the only three to do the long route. Imagine our dismay to do a sub-5 century and come back to an empty lot! They didn't do a sweep or even warn us; they just decided that 3 bikers weren't worth their time and went home. Never went back to that one!

rm -rf 02-07-14 08:41 PM

You'll probably have trouble finding a pay/event ride that stays open for your 40 mile-4 hour pace. Instead, check out the local cycling clubs. Some of them are mostly fast rider or racer oriented, but you should be able to find some weekly rides at your speed.

My local club mostly has rides that are at least 15-16 mph on the flat roads (and some much faster). But there's at least two or three rides a week that really do go at a 10-12 mph speed. It's been difficult in the past to find ride leaders for those slower rides, since many regular riders do build up to a faster speed. But we now have some ride leaders that really like the casual, smell-the-flowers type of riding. Being a ride leader for those types of rides is easy, you basically just need to know the route, and keep track of the group so nobody gets lost.

bradtx 02-08-14 06:26 AM

Brian, How much time do you spend at the rest stops? A lot of lost time can accumulate if spending more than five minutes or so at each one.

Generally I see slower recreational and rehabbing riders opt'g for the thirty something mile routes. They still have a comfortable pace and a good amount of saddle time. I've signed up for a charity ride in May and on paper it's for the 30 mile route as that's where I expect my rehabbing knee capable of at that time. I will also have the map for the 50 miler and the 10 miler. ;)

Rest stops (almost) always have a limited time they're open. Volunteers sometimes move from the early stops to work the century rider's stops. Slower riders and late starters are often left with the short end of the stick. Just the way it is.

I remember the Iron Horse brand and while not a high level bike in general, they're good enough to cover whatever distance desired.

Brad

Retro Grouch 02-08-14 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dermbrian (Post 16475398)
Could I have pushed myself harder and finished a little faster. Yes. But why? I had plenty of water and lunch in a cooler strapped to my rear rack, but I would have liked some camaraderie. Perhaps organized rides should consider posting a schedule of closing times for the rest stops/finish area to allow leisure riders to see what they are up against.

I can understand that volunteers are awesome people that have other plans for the weekend. But at best I ride about a 13 mph pace on my bike for a ride of an hour or so in length. Do I really have "no business riding that distance" of 100K at something billed as a bike ride, not a bike race? I can't see driving somewhere to ride only in the shortest rides offered at the event.

I used to drive a SAG for a century ride every year. I can tell you that all of the SAG activity is on the shorter routes. I could make the case that the short course riders are the ones who have no business riding the distance but that's exactly who I'm there for. The riders who venture beyond about 50 or 60 miles are generally folks who are experienced, have a lot of miles in their legs, and are relatively confident. I've found that they seldom need or want any help.

Incidentally, being a SAG driver doesn't come free. I generally burn a full tank of gas on a century ride.

Looigi 02-08-14 07:42 AM

Rest stops? They are aid stops to pick up drinks, food and attend to nature's call. Attend to business as quickly as feasible and get going. What's this resting?

In my experience, stopping and taking time off the bike subsequently makes me slower on the bike. I'm best stopping for as short as possible, or not stopping at all.

shelbyfv 02-08-14 08:22 AM

Rest stop workers, SAG drivers and sweepers are usually volunteers. I think there is some element of good manners involved. I would not want these tired, hot and otherwise done for the day folks waiting around for me if I was significantly slower than the other riders. Choose a distance you can finish with the majority and enjoy the post ride meal.

longbeachgary 02-08-14 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by njkayaker (Post 16476850)
??? Where does he say that he "needs" an organized ride?

Sorry, I didn't know that the OP had an attorney. Here is what he said: I'm getting back into riding and plan to ride in a couple of big rides around Dallas this spring and summer. I was looking at the Tour de Goatneck....

I took that the mean that he was going to do the ride (whether he needs to or wants to is up to interpretation) .

Garfield Cat 02-09-14 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caloso (Post 16476680)
I would also suggest leaving early.

That's what some did during this years Super Bowl.

Retro Grouch 02-09-14 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garfield Cat (Post 16480492)
That's what some did during this years Super Bowl.

And those seats cost more than a Brooks.

VegasTriker 02-09-14 11:02 AM

Find a local bike club who has members who ride at your pace. At least one here in my town guarantees to not drop any riders. They even welcome recumbent riders. Their rides are frequent, of different lengths, vary in difficulty, and have both fast and recreational (slower) riders. I don't ride with them as I prefer to just get out and ride on a whim - where and when I want to ride. In my own case I tend to ride too fast for my own liking if with a group of faster riders. It is just less fun than on my own. I quit going on organized rides a few years ago. It got very expensive. They didn't close the rest stops early as far as I know but I wasn't the last one in for the metric century.

goldfinch 02-09-14 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Retro Grouch (Post 16478105)
I used to drive a SAG for a century ride every year. I can tell you that all of the SAG activity is on the shorter routes. I could make the case that the short course riders are the ones who have no business riding the distance but that's exactly who I'm there for. The riders who venture beyond about 50 or 60 miles are generally folks who are experienced, have a lot of miles in their legs, and are relatively confident. I've found that they seldom need or want any help.

Incidentally, being a SAG driver doesn't come free. I generally burn a full tank of gas on a century ride.

I am slow and I have ridden a tour and several organized rides with a friend who is slow. We can do 60 to 75 miles a day over the course of several days. Our average ranges from 12.5 to 14.5 (at best) and this does not include stops. We like the long rides and if we think there is a time pressure we will try to start early. We prefer rides that start over a period of time, not all at once. Minnesota has a number of organized rides that have many riders like us and accommodate those of our speed.

Those who say 9 to 10 mph with rest stops isn't even a leisure ride are talking about themselves, not those who may not be able to average better than that.

I don't much like doing the shorter routes. The riders tend to be less experienced and ride more haphazardly. For sure I understand your comment about most of the SAG activity being on the shorter routes.

ThermionicScott 02-09-14 04:35 PM

If you're "just getting back into riding", why bother with ambitious rides at this point? Just ride around with friends, focus on enjoying it.

Fastfingaz 02-09-14 04:48 PM

What is interresting to me is the fact that the OP stated that he, had plenty of water and a lunch packed in a cooler straped to the back rack????? I think a nice picnic was in order??? all we need now is a blanket for a nap!!!!!

Dudelsack 02-09-14 08:19 PM

I think you boys done scared off the OP.

Dermbrian 02-09-14 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dudelsack (Post 16482122)
I think you boys done scared off the OP.

Nah. Still here.

I liked the advice given by Bradtx the best....perhaps considering rides more in the 30 mile range rather than the longest rides of a given event. To me, that seems like a distance that would still make the event worthwhile. I really cannot see driving 30+ miles to do something really short. But I'd still be a little resistant to the thought of keeping rest stops as short as possible just to stay on a timetable....unless I was really approaching the event as a test of my ability to ride at a given pace.

Regarding that I like to carry a cooler if I'm going to be on the road all day, it was just a six-pack sized cooler with a couple of sandwiches and cokes. Sorry, I'd rather stop and have a ham sandwich than a powerbar or goo. Crazy, I know!

The one century ride that I did, again 15 years ago or so, was the Capital City Century in Springfield, Illinois. 3 of my brothers, my nephew, and myself all rode it one year. Because we all had differing abilities and goals, we didn't really see each other much on the ride. My last hour was in the pouring rain....but I did finish in time to have the meal at the end which was still going, maybe because nobody wanted to leave in the rain. On my hybrid Iron Horse, with a cooler on the back. I've also done the short ride at the Meunster Germanfest in Texas once. From my first bike, to my Sturmey-Archer 3 speed Sears bike in high school, my Schwinn Varsity in college and the Iron Horse later in life, I've enjoyed riding and maintaining my bikes and challening myself, at least a little, with commuting on occasion and walking or riding to places most people (like we all know...) would drive. At 58, I'm still enjoying it, and have enjoyed reading a lot of topics throughout these forums.


Brian

Machka 02-10-14 01:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dermbrian (Post 16482505)
I liked the advice given by Bradtx the best....perhaps considering rides more in the 30 mile range rather than the longest rides of a given event. To me, that seems like a distance that would still make the event worthwhile. I really cannot see driving 30+ miles to do something really short. But I'd still be a little resistant to the thought of keeping rest stops as short as possible just to stay on a timetable....unless I was really approaching the event as a test of my ability to ride at a given pace.

And that's precisely the difference between riding with a cycletouring club or friends ... and riding an event. Many/most events are supposed to be a challenge ... something that you have to train at least a little bit for ... something that you have to push yourself a bit to complete.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Dermbrian (Post 16482505)
Regarding that I like to carry a cooler if I'm going to be on the road all day, it was just a six-pack sized cooler with a couple of sandwiches and cokes. Sorry, I'd rather stop and have a ham sandwich than a powerbar or goo. Crazy, I know!

Real food is fine, but how much do you need?

The general recommendation is 250-ish calories per hour.

rydabent 02-10-14 08:30 AM

Our bike club here in Lincoln along with weekly rides that are shorter have two major long rides spring and late summer. Bragging a little we run really friendly well sagged rides. The big thing is the course. We run a course with 3 loups, roughly 25, 35, and 45 miles. The loups all have out laying sags stops, and they loup back to a center one that remains open till late afternoon. We also have roving sags that look out for lagging slow riders. The club alway get great comments on how the sags look out for the riders. That is why riders of all speeds come back and ride with us year after year.

StephenH 02-10-14 12:20 PM

I've never seen posted closing times on intermediate rest stops. However, some of these rides do have posted limits on the overall ride. If you're riding at a pace to finish in that time, they SHOULD have every rest stop open for you, still. And if they are closing intermediate rest stops, they SHOULD have SAG vehicles both checking on any riders behind that point to see if they're okay, and also to let them know what is going on. You can't just abandon people out on the course.

I rode the Goatneck rally several years ago on my Worksman cruiser, on the 40-mile option, and didn't have that problem.
I rode the Beauty and the Beast tour on the 100k option on my Worksman cruiser. I think they had a 6-hour limit, and I made that limit. I'm not positive, but I think I was the very last rider in, too. But they still had the rest areas open when I came through, and those rest areas still had food and drink available.
I've ridden the Hotter-n-Hell 100 in about 10 hours (including the half-hour delay to get to the starting line) on my Worksman cruiser. I think they allow you 12 hours there. And there were still a lot of people out on the course when I got done, too. But, the rest stops were still open.

I once rode my cargo tricycle on the 16-mile option of the Richardson Wild Ride. It took me two hours, including stops, and I actually passed people doing it. So yes, there are people back there riding 8 mph. People riding up front may not realize that!

shoemakerpom 02-10-14 01:15 PM

I actually find myself in the middle area a lot on these organized rides. Most of the rides I have been on including the MS 150 people either treat it like a race with a 25mph or more pace or like super slow with a 12mph pace and I am in the middle with about 18-22. Like someone mentioned before map a route yourself to see how far you can go before you get to an organized ride.

Dudelsack 02-10-14 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoemakerpom (Post 16483881)
I actually find myself in the middle area a lot on these organized rides. Most of the rides I have been on including the MS 150 people either treat it like a race with a 25mph or more pace or like super slow with a 12mph pace and I am in the middle with about 18-22. Like someone mentioned before map a route yourself to see how far you can go before you get to an organized ride.

Strava or it didn't happen.

Cruising speed of 22 MPH on a charity ride. I'm calling you out.

elcruxio 02-10-14 02:00 PM

I probably wouldn't consider a century event or a 70 miler if I couldn't ride an comfortable 15mph average. I would like to be able to do 18mph on zone 1 but that isn't happening just yet...

But that's just me. Riding fast is part of the fun.

shoemakerpom 02-10-14 02:18 PM

That's funny. Next time Ill take a picture of every retired senior kickin my butt with an 80's frame and 7sp shifting......

spdracr39 02-10-14 02:57 PM

So having studied all the various comments and trying to learn a little something. What speed should we be expected to average on a 20-50 mile charity type event? For me 20 is out of the question 15 is in my future but 12 is probly reality right now. Should I steer clear until I can go faster because it would not be a great motivator to roll in and hear the crickets chirping.


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