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  1. #51
    Senior Member RPK79's Avatar
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    It would depend on the ride.

  2. #52
    Senior Member Keith99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shelbyfv View Post
    Rest stop workers, SAG drivers and sweepers are usually volunteers. I think there is some element of good manners involved. I would not want these tired, hot and otherwise done for the day folks waiting around for me if I was significantly slower than the other riders. Choose a distance you can finish with the majority and enjoy the post ride meal.
    Yup.

    I've been one of those once and it leads me to point out one thing people might not think of.

    I was manning the last full rest stop on "The Grand Tour" back in the 90s. At that time the ride had 6 options, Highland and Lowland 200, 300 and 400 miles.

    That rest stop was mainly for the 300 and 400 mile riders. At about the 150 mile mark the 200 miles rides hit Rincon and turned South for home. But the 300 and 400 mile riders turned North and ride 50 miles to Santa Barbara. The 400 mile riders made it back to the start and then did a 'small' 100 mile loop that also hit the same stop.

    While the stop was open mainly for the 300 and 400 mile riders it was still there for the 200 mile riders.

    That is organization and similar organization often occurs on shorter rides where there is an associated longer ride. A stop that is 75 miles into a Century is often the midway stop of a half century.

    Unless you stop and think about it this works out to be counter intuitive. One is prone to think that if you are doing 35 miles an event that is only that length is where you get the best service. That can be flat out wrong if you are a slower rider.

    EDIT: If one only counts rides one pays for as organized rides I've only done 4 every. Rosario - Enseneda when I was just starting. The Grant tour the first time I rode it. (second time was the time I volunteered and I did the volunteer ride the week after and scored big, it was 10 degrees cooler), The Land Rush (San Francisco to Los Angels in 2 days) and The Lighthouse century (Which was really strange, it had highland and lowland options. I was blowing people away until the routes split, then climbing like a rock left me alone until they rejoined).
    Last edited by Keith99; 02-10-14 at 02:37 PM.
    Perish any man who suspects that these men either did or suffered anything unseemly.

  3. #53
    A might bewildered... Dudelsack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spdracr39 View Post
    So having studied all the various comments and trying to learn a little something. What speed should we be expected to average on a 20-50 mile charity type event? For me 20 is out of the question 15 is in my future but 12 is probly reality right now. Should I steer clear until I can go faster because it would not be a great motivator to roll in and hear the crickets chirping.
    12 MPH is fine.

    For some rides they specify a dazzling 14 MPH.

    If you're slow, just start early. I chug along at 12 MPH average (hills really slow me down, on the flats I scoot along quite a bit faster). On "cookie rides" I do fine. I either don't stop at SAGs or I stop just long enough to water up and use the Porta Potty. Otherwise I really stiffen up. But I finish before the broom wagon sweeps me up.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephenH View Post
    I've never seen posted closing times on intermediate rest stops.
    I've seen it quite often. It's not unusual at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by StephenH View Post
    However, some of these rides do have posted limits on the overall ride. If you're riding at a pace to finish in that time, they SHOULD have every rest stop open for you, still.
    It doesn't make sense to keep all of the rest stops open for the same overall end time. They wouldn't keep the 25 mile stop open as long as the 80 mile stop.

    What organizers do, sometimes, is route the shorter courses so they use the same stops that are used as the last stop or two for the long course (allowing short-course riders to go very slowly).

    Sometimes, they have shortcuts available for slow riders.

    Quote Originally Posted by StephenH View Post
    And if they are closing intermediate rest stops, they SHOULD have SAG vehicles both checking on any riders behind that point to see if they're okay, and also to let them know what is going on. You can't just abandon people out on the course.
    Often, there are drivers sweeping the routes and stragglers are given the option of a lift.
    Last edited by njkayaker; 02-10-14 at 06:16 PM.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by spdracr39 View Post
    So having studied all the various comments and trying to learn a little something. What speed should we be expected to average on a 20-50 mile charity type event? For me 20 is out of the question 15 is in my future but 12 is probly reality right now. Should I steer clear until I can go faster because it would not be a great motivator to roll in and hear the crickets chirping.
    Many of the charity rides expect less experienced riders (especially, if they have short courses available).

    If the ride starts and ends at the same place, there's a good chance the time you can spend on the short course will be the same as for the longest course. Maybe, not quite as long because that would be really slow.

    The general rule of thumb is an overall average of 10 mph (including stops) for any organized ride.

    Keep in mind that your average speed will generally be lower for longer or hillier rides. You probably don't want to be struggling at a 10 mph pace.
    Last edited by njkayaker; 02-10-14 at 06:46 PM.

  6. #56
    Uber Goober StephenH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
    I've seen it quite often. It's not unusual at all.


    It doesn't make sense to keep all of the rest stops open for the same overall end time. They wouldn't keep the 25 mile stop open as long as the 80 mile stop.
    What I meant is that if they allow 12 hours for a 100 mile ride, the 50 mile rest stop ought to be open at least 6 hours, etc.
    "be careful this rando stuff is addictive and dan's the 'pusher'."

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephenH View Post
    What I meant is that if they allow 12 hours for a 100 mile ride, the 50 mile rest stop ought to be open at least 6 hours, etc.
    Yes, that's how they do it. It's really the only reasonable way (they might stay open a bit longer, just in case riders have a slower than expected segment).

    You know this but others might not.

    You don't have to stop at every stop and you don't have t stay the same amount of time. Often, there are stops that are worth staying longer at. Being aware of your pace/progress during the ride will let you manage it better.
    Last edited by njkayaker; 02-10-14 at 07:04 PM.

  8. #58
    Senior Member goldfinch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spdracr39 View Post
    So having studied all the various comments and trying to learn a little something. What speed should we be expected to average on a 20-50 mile charity type event? For me 20 is out of the question 15 is in my future but 12 is probly reality right now. Should I steer clear until I can go faster because it would not be a great motivator to roll in and hear the crickets chirping.
    For charity rides of that length you should be fine.

  9. #59
    Long Distance Cyclist Machka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spdracr39 View Post
    So having studied all the various comments and trying to learn a little something. What speed should we be expected to average on a 20-50 mile charity type event? For me 20 is out of the question 15 is in my future but 12 is probly reality right now. Should I steer clear until I can go faster because it would not be a great motivator to roll in and hear the crickets chirping.
    A minimum of 18 km/h on the bicycle ... preferably 20 km/h so that you've got time to have a bite to eat mid-ride.

  10. #60
    Senior Member digibud's Avatar
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    That was rude. You should feel free to join in, but you shouldn't expect the tents and support to remain. In races I've done where the speed of some folks is a possible issue, there has been a sweeper van to pick up those who were straggling and at the very least, to give them a chance to bail. I can see how that might not be possible in all races but it's a nice thing to be able to do. I think if you're going to sign up for a race you should only expect the organizers to stay "open" for most of the folks; not each and every entrant no matter how slow (and yeah....4 hours for 40mi is too slow).
    Don't be discouraged. Join in or not. Don't take their wrap-up personally.
    Alaskans for global warming.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dudelsack View Post
    Strava or it didn't happen.

    Cruising speed of 22 MPH on a charity ride. I'm calling you out.
    Around here a lot of the various clubs will have A+ level riders take advantage of the rest stops on charity rides and will pull down 25+ MPH averages because they ride as a group. They are, of course, the exception.

    Brad

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by spdracr39 View Post
    So having studied all the various comments and trying to learn a little something. What speed should we be expected to average on a 20-50 mile charity type event? For me 20 is out of the question 15 is in my future but 12 is probly reality right now. Should I steer clear until I can go faster because it would not be a great motivator to roll in and hear the crickets chirping.
    Twelve MPH is fine, enjoy the ride. To me three hours in the saddle is a worth while and satisfactory ride and that's what I hope to accomplish this May. If my knee is better than I think it will be I'll up the distance or the speed, but probably not both.

    Brad

  13. #63
    Senior Member Retro Grouch's Avatar
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    I've done some organized tours in which the opposite issue has come up. The tour organizer set up a rest stop at around the 18 or 20 mile mark. The problem was folks who'd both leave early and ride fast. They'd get to the rest stop before the ride helpers.
    My greatest fear is all of my kids standing around my coffin and talking about "how sensible" dad was.

  14. #64
    Packfodding 3 caloso's Avatar
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    A group of racers or experienced century riders can easily do 22mph on a flat, no wind ride. That's barely above social pace.
    Cyclists of the world, unite! You have nothing to lube but your chains!

  15. #65
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    The Tulsa Route 66 Marathon that I'm training for...using the Galloway run/walk approach....has a nice, clear summation of the time limits for that event. Something like this is really helpful in deciding to take part in something for those that are slow and OK with that.

    Course Time Limit

    • The marathon course will remain closed to traffic for 6 1/2 hours.
    • The half marathon course will remain closed to traffic for 3 1/4 hours.
    • Participants taking over 15 minutes per mile may be asked to move to the sidewalk.
    • The electronic timing system will remain open for 7 1/2 hours.
    • Everyone finishing in 7 1/2 hours will receive an official finishing time.
    • We do not guarantee that the Gatorade or Medical Aid Stations will be open longer than the 15 minute per mile pace.

  16. #66
    Senior Member Keith99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bradtx View Post
    Around here a lot of the various clubs will have A+ level riders take advantage of the rest stops on charity rides and will pull down 25+ MPH averages because they ride as a group. They are, of course, the exception.

    Brad
    The only paid century I did had a train at least a couple hundred yards long following a tandem going over 25 mph. The first double I did had me hitting over 25 mph solo near dusk on the last 40 miles. (I had flatted and was chasing a couple of other riders, it was flat and the tailwind going south is usually significant, it sure was that day).
    Perish any man who suspects that these men either did or suffered anything unseemly.

  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
    I've done some organized tours in which the opposite issue has come up. The tour organizer set up a rest stop at around the 18 or 20 mile mark. The problem was folks who'd both leave early and ride fast. They'd get to the rest stop before the ride helpers.
    This happens but it's not really an "issue". (In the same way that not having stops for off-course/lost riders isn't an "issue".)

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dermbrian View Post
    The Tulsa Route 66 Marathon that I'm training for...using the Galloway run/walk approach....has a nice, clear summation of the time limits for that event. Something like this is really helpful in deciding to take part in something for those that are slow and OK with that.

    Course Time Limit


    • The marathon course will remain closed to traffic for 6 1/2 hours.
    • The half marathon course will remain closed to traffic for 3 1/4 hours.
    • Participants taking over 15 minutes per mile may be asked to move to the sidewalk.
    • The electronic timing system will remain open for 7 1/2 hours.
    • Everyone finishing in 7 1/2 hours will receive an official finishing time.
    • We do not guarantee that the Gatorade or Medical Aid Stations will be open longer than the 15 minute per mile pace.
    Things like "closed for traffic" or "timing systems" are not usually concerns for most organized bicycle rides.

    Pretty-much, all this is doing is talking about one thing: minimum pace. (All if the other stuff really doesn't need to be said since it all follows from the required minimum pace.)

    Organized rides typically indicate when the facilities at the end terminate. They often indicate a start time. If you have these two pieces of information, you can easily determine the minimum overall pace required. Almost certainly, the intermedate stops will be open for a rider doing that pace.

    They should make the start and end times clear.

    If you can't compute the required minimum pace, assuming 10 mph will often work.

    Anything more than that really isn't necessary. If somebody really thinks they need more detail, it is a good indication that the ride isn't appropriate for them.
    Last edited by njkayaker; 02-12-14 at 10:36 AM.

  19. #69
    Senior Member Ky_Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dermbrian View Post
    I was pretty much alone at the end, but I enjoyed the atmosphere at the start, the light vehicle traffic on the well planned course, and having the goal of the ride as an incentive to stay active in the months leading up to the ride. I think I'll save my money on the short rides (since I do short rides in my neighborhood and local park trail system on a consistent basis) and continue to look for well-organized and interesting longer rides....where I can meander a bit...maybe take some nature pictures....instead of thinking about the finish at the start.


    Brian
    Like others have suggested start early if possible. I only average about 10-13 mph on my hybrid. If I push hard I can get to 15 mph, but I don't enjoy it. I tend to avoid organized rides because everyone seems like they're in such a hurry. I wish you were closer. We could do some rides together.

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