Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

General Cycling Discussion Have a cycling related question or comment that doesn't fit in one of the other specialty forums? Drop on in and post in here! When possible, please select the forum above that most fits your post!

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-17-14, 08:06 PM   #1
BikeAnon
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Bikes:
Posts: 176
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Why do we have seat bags attached to the seat?

Tradition? Because of the name?

I'd like a storage container that fits in the angle between the seat tube and the down tube. Right there by the bottom bracket.

Lower COG. No weight swaying during out-of-the-saddle climbs. More aero?

OK, for convenience , the seatbag wins. But for function, I want a bracket-bag.
BikeAnon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 05:37 AM   #2
wahoonc
Senior Member
 
wahoonc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: On the road-USA
Bikes: Giant Excursion, Raleigh Sports, Raleigh R.S.W. Compact, Motobecane? and about 20 more! OMG
Posts: 16,760
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 36 Post(s)
Different strokes for different folks... I have used seat bags for over 40's years, don't really see an advantage to the frame bags for me.

Aaron
__________________
Webshots is bailing out, if you find any of my posts with corrupt picture files and want to see them corrected please let me know. :(

ISO: A late 1980's Giant Iguana MTB frameset (or complete bike) 23" Red with yellow graphics.

"Cycling should be a way of life, not a hobby.
RIDE, YOU FOOL, RIDE!"
_Nicodemus

"Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
Aluminum: barely a hundred
Which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?"
_krazygluon
wahoonc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 05:45 AM   #3
Machka 
In Real Life
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Bikes:
Posts: 46,637
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 550 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BikeAnon View Post
I'd like a storage container that fits in the angle between the seat tube and the down tube. Right there by the bottom bracket.
Something like this ...

Nashbar Frame Pack Bag - Bike Wedges


They've never really appealed to me and they take up space where I keep my water bottles ... but they might work for you.
Machka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 05:56 AM   #4
Homebrew01
Super Moderator
 
Homebrew01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ffld Cnty Connecticut
Bikes: Old Steelies I made, Old Cannondales
Posts: 20,023
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 268 Post(s)
My seat bag only has 2 tubes & tire levers, so it has no impact on the ride.
__________________
Bikes: Old steel race bikes, old Cannondale race bikes, less old Cannondale race bike, crappy old mtn bike
Homebrew01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 06:26 AM   #5
no1mad
Thunder Whisperer
 
no1mad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NE OK
Bikes: '06 Kona Smoke
Posts: 8,800
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 199 Post(s)
Feel free to design your own.
__________________
Community guidelines
no1mad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 06:55 AM   #6
chaadster
Thread Killer
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Bikes: '15 Kinesis Racelight 4S, '76 Motebecane Gran Jubilée
Posts: 7,963
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 275 Post(s)
Down at the bottom bracket? That doesn't seem like a great location to me, if only because there's all sorts of filth and mess down there for us all season riders. Commercial production seems like it would be a problem, too, because the dimensions of available space down there is variable bike to bike, and often dependent on whether ST bottle cages are used.

But yeah, it could work in specific situations, although I don't really have any issue with seat bags; mine are neither noticeably heavy nor sway while riding, but I definitely have a "sport" kit rather than one of those huge "touring" bags that have the kitchen sink in them. If you're one of the latter types, there are post mounted brackets that may be of use to you, like the Carradice Bagman, or you may also consider consider splitting the load between a bar bag or a frame pack, like Machka suggested, in order to lighten the seat load.

Or custom make a bottom bracket bag and let us know how it goes!
chaadster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 07:06 AM   #7
BikeAnon
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Bikes:
Posts: 176
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Looking at the bag Machka posted, and thinking about the other comments, I can see my idea has a lot of flaws.

The worst flaw would be a safety issue.bump the bag from the left, you stuff it right into the crankset.

My goal would be a minimalistic bag. Tube, CO2, levers, minitool.
BikeAnon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 07:20 AM   #8
Machka 
In Real Life
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Bikes:
Posts: 46,637
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 550 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BikeAnon View Post
Looking at the bag Machka posted, and thinking about the other comments, I can see my idea has a lot of flaws.

The worst flaw would be a safety issue.bump the bag from the left, you stuff it right into the crankset.

My goal would be a minimalistic bag. Tube, CO2, levers, minitool.
Have a browse through the Nashbar site and other sites and see if anything appeals to you. There are a lot of options available.
Machka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 07:29 AM   #9
Homebrew01
Super Moderator
 
Homebrew01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ffld Cnty Connecticut
Bikes: Old Steelies I made, Old Cannondales
Posts: 20,023
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 268 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BikeAnon View Post

My goal would be a minimalistic bag. Tube, CO2, levers, minitool.
Many options if that is what you carry. A small under seat bag, tightly attached will not be noticed while you ride. I don't see what problem you are trying to solve.
__________________
Bikes: Old steel race bikes, old Cannondale race bikes, less old Cannondale race bike, crappy old mtn bike
Homebrew01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 07:49 AM   #10
Dave Cutter
Senior Member
 
Dave Cutter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: D'uh... I am a Cutter
Bikes: '14 Trek 1.1, '10 Fuji Newest 3.0, '98 Cannondale R500, '88 Trek 360
Posts: 5,450
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 353 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BikeAnon View Post
My goal would be a minimalistic bag. Tube, CO2, levers, minitool.
Throw your selection into a little camera bag, other nylon bag, or even a Ziploc bag and just tuck it in a jersey pocket.

It's all a compromise. I like a clean clutter-free look for the bicycle. But I always need a water bottle or two anyway. And since some of my rides are somewhat far from home I like having a few "extras" with me. Stuffing a bunch of crap in my jersey makes me feel clunky and look sloppy. I've never found the "perfect" solution myself. I found a medium sized saddle bag... isn't to Fred-looking... and doesn't get in my way while cycling.
Dave Cutter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 08:04 AM   #11
Bandera 
Ding!
 
Bandera's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Texas Hill Country
Bikes:
Posts: 4,120
Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 223 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BikeAnon View Post
The worst flaw would be a safety issue.bump the bag from the left, you stuff it right into the crankset.
Traditional solutions to common issues work, it's all been thought out over the last century.
Here's a machine set-up for hot/drought & for wet/cold.
2 traditional bags for 2 different loads, both work as required.

-Bandera
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Soma_1.jpg (55.7 KB, 18 views)
File Type: jpg Soma_2.jpg (64.2 KB, 18 views)
__________________
'74 Raleigh International - '77 Trek TX900FG - '92 Vitus 979 - '10 Merckx EMX-3- '11 Soma Stanyan
Bandera is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 08:07 AM   #12
CharlyAlfaRomeo
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Bikes:
Posts: 619
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BikeAnon View Post
My goal would be a minimalistic bag. Tube, CO2, levers, minitool.
I don't see how that small amount of gear would have a noticeable impact on COG or out of the saddle riding.
CharlyAlfaRomeo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 08:16 AM   #13
nymtber
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: NY state
Bikes: See Signature...
Posts: 1,294
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
On frames made for us normal sized folk, a frame bag gets in the way of water bottle access

I have a tube, patch kit, tire levers, multi-tool with chain tool, two spare chain quick-links (10spd, never know I could run into a cute gal with a broken chain!), CO2 inflator with 2 tubes, and I'm sure something I have forgotten. I'm going to find a way to install my Airstik SL pump under my saddle, to keep it out of the way. CO2 should work, but I would like a manual pump for backup... All of the above is stuffed into a pretty small under-seat bag. My canal path bike has a much bigger bag, I can fit all of that PLUS a few granola bars, my cell phone, keys, and my wallet!

Of course, a lot of roadies stuff their jersey with all that stuff. I sweat a bit, so I'll use the bag, and keep granola bars in my jersey...the crunchy ones that are not effected by heat
nymtber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 09:03 AM   #14
spdracr39
Senior Member
 
spdracr39's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Cabot, Arkansas
Bikes: Lynskey Twisted Helix Di2 Ti, 1987 Orbea steel single speed/fixie, Orbea Avant M30, Trek Fuel EX9.8 29, Trek Madone 5 series, Specialized Epic Carbon Comp 29er, Trek 7.1F
Posts: 1,537
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 11 Post(s)
storage container with straps near rotating parts equals liability. No one would build this.
spdracr39 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 09:50 AM   #15
fietsbob 
coprolite
 
fietsbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NW,Oregon Coast
Bikes: 7
Posts: 22,043
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1097 Post(s)
Quote:
I'd like a storage container that fits in the angle between the seat tube and the down tube.
Right there by the bottom bracket.
go for it, you got a Sewing machine at home?

there are waterbottle tool containers to replace 1 waterbottle too ..
add a bottle cage under the Down tube.. like touring bikes have ..
fietsbob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 11:43 AM   #16
Myosmith
Lover of Old Chrome Moly
 
Myosmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NW Minnesota
Bikes:
Posts: 2,548
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I've got a triangle bag similar to the one Machka showed. I use it as my second bag for long gravel grinds or trips into the boonies, especially if I'm wearing something other than a jersey. It carries a couple of extra tools that I don't carry on shorter rides, a second tube, and a few assorted doodads depending on the ride. It works well but doesn't have nearly as much capacity as you would think it might, even with careful packing. It does prevent me from using a tall or oversize water bottle in the seat tube holder but the 20oz size fits fine. My underseat bag is all I need 90% of the time.

Myosmith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 11:51 AM   #17
StephenH
Uber Goober
 
StephenH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Dallas area, Texas
Bikes:
Posts: 11,324
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-61_8k3qtyR...-s/s1600/n.jpg
__________________
"be careful this rando stuff is addictive and dan's the 'pusher'."
StephenH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 01:52 PM   #18
Coluber42
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Medford, MA
Bikes:
Posts: 336
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
If it helps, I make bike bags for a living and I have long thought about making a small bag for tools or a spare folding tire to go in exactly that location. For that matter, at various times I've rolled up a spare folding tire and strapped it into that spot. It was convenient for a spare tire in that most of the time you figure you ought to carry one just in case, you figure the probability of actually needing it is low, so you want it out of the way of everything you actually might need to get at, and having it covered in crap when you need it is worth the trade-off.

But here are the reasons I haven't put a bag meant for that spot into production, if you're wondering:
- it will get splashed and covered in dirt there, and is likely to get filthy even if you have good full-coverage fenders. This means that if it opens and closes by way of a zipper, even a water-resistant one, the zipper is likely to end up full of grit and the stuff inside will get wet. So your tools will be all rusty when you go to use them. Most closure systems that are not zippers take up more space in one direction or another, which is a problem if it needs to clear the cranks on both sides with relatively little margin for error.
- anything that straps to the frame can wear or scratch the paint over time. You may or may not care, but lots of people do. And if it's in an area where it's going to get grit on it, the grit will get under the straps or between the bag and the frame, and scrape it up all the more.
- Different frames have different amounts of space in that location that is shaped differently, and the tubes are different diameters. The difference in length you need to wrap around a vintage steel downtube versus a modern oversized downtube is substantial - larger than the whole diameter of the smaller tube. So the straps need a lot of adjustability, and you can't have any loose ends or excess length flopping around because it will end up in the crank. The alternative is to offer it in at least three sizes, for skinny, medium, and fat downtubes, which makes stocking and production three times as complicated.
-It's inconvenient to access if you lay your bike down on the ground, because unless you lay it down on the derailleur side (not recommended) it's blocked by the crank.
-If you keep the bag down to a size that will fit a reasonably large cross-section of frame styles and bottle cage positions, it's not really a very convenient shape for tools in addition to spare tubes.

In contrast, the space under the saddle is pretty universal. A bag that attaches to saddle rails and seatpost will fit on just about every bike in every size, with simple and intuitive straps that don't even need much adjustability. It's reasonably convenient to access. It's easy to make it a shape that will conveniently hold a couple of tubes, tire levers, multi-tool, patch kit, CO2, etc. And we're not talking about enough weight to affect the center of gravity or climbing out of the saddle to any meaningful degree.

So, that's why you can't buy one at your LBS. But making your own is not rocket science, and yours can be better because you can make it to exactly fit the available space on your bike. Sewing is not rocket science, and even if you don't have a machine, it can be done by hand! A project like this is small enough that sewing it by hand isn't even such a ridiculously time-consuming undertaking. If it helps, I posted a free pattern with comprehensive instructions for making an under-seat bag. But lots of the information in the instructions would still apply, and maybe the pattern would help you visualize how to design your own. It's here if you want it: Pickle Project: Make your own wedge-style saddle pack | Dill Pickle Gear
Coluber42 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 02:15 PM   #19
rumrunn6
Senior Member
 
rumrunn6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: 25 miles northwest of Boston
Bikes: Bottecchia Sprint
Posts: 14,591
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 262 Post(s)
and don't forget the bento bags that strap to the top tube and stem

http://www.amazon.com/Bushwhacker-Di.../dp/B007TNCOD2
rumrunn6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 04:03 PM   #20
slorollin
Senior Member
 
slorollin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Eastern NC
Bikes: '81 Puch '13 Cafe Noir
Posts: 263
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Also by Bushwacker......
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Bikeresize2.jpg (96.1 KB, 25 views)
slorollin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 04:31 PM   #21
Bandera 
Ding!
 
Bandera's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Texas Hill Country
Bikes:
Posts: 4,120
Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 223 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by coluber42 View Post
i make bike bags for a living
c_42,

Not only do you make high quality kit but you also have extensive experience in LD cycling (FG no less).

How do you set-up yourself for moderate conditions at 200KM distances vs. Nasty 1200KM?
How is the load carried, what goes along for the ride?
Pics please.

Regards,

-Bandera
__________________
'74 Raleigh International - '77 Trek TX900FG - '92 Vitus 979 - '10 Merckx EMX-3- '11 Soma Stanyan

Last edited by Bandera; 03-18-14 at 04:40 PM. Reason: I have no financial interest etc......
Bandera is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-14, 09:50 PM   #22
Coluber42
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Medford, MA
Bikes:
Posts: 336
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The basics that come on every ride are what you'd expect: multi-tool, tube(s), patch kit, pump, etc. For a typical 200k I'll bring a few hundred calories' worth of bike food or maybe a lot more than that, depending on what the food options at controls are. I usually keep my rain jacket in my saddlebag since it weighs practically nothing. If the weather looks like it might change, I'll bring either additional layers of clothing or some way to carry layers I take off. The small saddlebag I make is plenty big enough for this; the food goes in the side pockets or in my jersey pockets where I can get at it while riding. For rides long enough to have night riding, add reflective stuff. I use a dynamo hub for lighting. Also, night riding can get chilly in many areas, particularly in mountains, so that often requires more layers of clothing. If it's going to be a whole night, or more than one, I also carry spare batteries for my helmet light and my tail light.

On rides where I need to have more food on board than just a couple of bars, I add a handlebar bag. That and a small saddlebag can get me pretty far unless I need to carry lots of extra clothing.

For anything 600k or up that would qualify as "nasty" (which, for purposes of this post really means unsupported and cold/wet/variable weather) I usually have a thermal jacket, some sort of knee/leg warmers, arm warmers, dry jersey, clean socks, clean gloves, and assorted other layers as needed. I usually have a spare tire, as well as both clear and dark sunglasses, and I use the largest saddlebag I make plus the handlebar bag. The handlebar bag contains food and whichever sunglasses I'm not wearing, and the saddlebag contains everything else. I use the side pockets of the saddlebag either for layers I want to put on or take off without stopping, or for additional bottled beverages purchased at convenience stores.
If I were to do a 1000 or 1200k with no pre-arranged sleep stop and no drop bag, I'd bring a pair of clean shorts and an extra clean jersey, and a toothbrush as well. If possible, I prefer to change my shorts every 24 hours, or every 48 hours minimum.

Otherwise, I pretty much use the same bike with the same gear on it (42x16) and don't change anything beyond what goes in the bags.

The biggest reason I prefer to carry mostly food in the handlebar bag and clean clothes in the saddlebag instead of using a much bigger front bag is that my handlebar bag is usually a disgusting mess by the end and I wouldn't want my clean clothes in there. Also, I like to have easy access to the stuff I need to get at while riding without rooting through everything else.

Pics:

This one is why you should bring warm clothes... this was a 1000k where I was the only participant, and I did not expect to get snowed on. It doesn't really show in the photo, but in this picture I have taped garbage bags around my legs and shopping bags over my feet because I only had shorts and leg warmers otherwise. And I had on everything in my bag, pretty much. There's even snow on the saddle because I'd been climbing out of the saddle all the way up. The handlebar bag is an earlier one, not the one I sell now.





This one was on the same ride the following year, where one other person joined in and also rode a fixed gear. He uses a smaller saddlebag but a large handlebar bag; I think overall we had about the same amount of stuff. It did not snow that time.

Coluber42 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:58 AM.