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  1. #26
    Senior Member Null66's Avatar
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    My SO had a hybrid (A VERY NICE GIANT!) for her first couple k miles riding.

    It treated her well. She loved it.

    She bought a Specialized Dolce and hasn't ridden it since (another couple k miles)... But her daughter rides it now!

    She could out ride me then, she can out ride me now.

    And I'm the luckiest man alive!

  2. #27
    Ha ha ha ha ha giantcfr1's Avatar
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    Here's an idea. Take your hybrid down to the BMX track and see if you get the same reaction.
    Those dang kids with their baggy clothes and turned back baseball caps on their BMX bikes laughed at me. They called me Grandpa Gumby. Can't they see that I own a hybrid and I can ride on dirt tracks.
    For gosh sake join a hybrid group and show those meany roadies that you are better than them.
    Road Bike: 2004 ORBEA Mitis2+Carbon, Freekin' groovy Urban / Mountain Road Cruising Bike: 2007 CANNONDALE Bad Boy Disc, MTB: 2012 Trek Gary Fisher Collection Marlin WSD 29er

  3. #28
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    Cycling seams to be a very clicky hobby/activity/sport, whatever you want to call it. Can someone enlighten us nubes on how to get in with a group that rides? My other hobby is SCUBA and as a new diver all you have to do is go into any dive shop and ask if anyone is available for a dive and more often than not one of the other customers overhearing the conversation will offer to go with you. I often see veteran divers taking out new divers to mentor them or just to keep them excited about the sport. The way we see it is as long as you are under water blowing bubbles you are one of us. Maybe I need to find a different bike shop to frequent?

  4. #29
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    Every activity has its elitists, wannabes, poseurs and jerks. If some guy on a different bike considers himself superior because I ride a hybrid or doesn't nod hello when we meet on the back roads I truly could not care less. I know why I am out there. I don't care why he is.

  5. #30
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    I've noticed that bicycling seems to be like owning apple products; does the raw material costs justify the price of the product? No, but if you've got the money to throw around and want everyone to know about your status. I can't believe that you can buy a motorcycle for the price of a high-end bike. The material cost doesn't compute. Then again, bicycling is a 5 billion dollar industry...

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aqua_Andy View Post
    Cycling seams to be a very clicky hobby/activity/sport, whatever you want to call it. Can someone enlighten us nubes on how to get in with a group that rides? My other hobby is SCUBA and as a new diver all you have to do is go into any dive shop and ask if anyone is available for a dive and more often than not one of the other customers overhearing the conversation will offer to go with you. I often see veteran divers taking out new divers to mentor them or just to keep them excited about the sport. The way we see it is as long as you are under water blowing bubbles you are one of us. Maybe I need to find a different bike shop to frequent?
    Good point, it does seem like a very clicky hobby. I think the only way to fit in is not how conditioned you are, but the way your bike is set up.

  7. #32
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    Back for a quick visit. The Fredcedrin has worn off; the headache is back.

    What, I wonder, is a "clicky hobby"?? Is that a reference to the practice of placing cards in one's spokes to make a 'clicking' sound? I suppose one could characterize cycling in that way, though it seems odd in the context of a tacit snipe at "roadies", most of whom -- at least in my experience -- would not countenance the idea of placing cards in their spokes to produce an amusing sound.

    Perhaps what was meant was "cliquish"?

  8. #33
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daihard View Post
    OTOH, it looks as though the OP, despite being "not serious," was able to keep up with those serious road cyclists in full kit. The OP should probably just be happy about it. I long for the day when I will be able to do that on my hybrid bike, although I know it's going to take a LONG time (maybe forever).
    "keeping up" means little to nothing in cycling.
    A few reasons why:
    1) riders in front of a pack take a lot more wind than in the middle so if you're "keeping up" by riding in the middle of the pack you're actually not really keeping up.
    2) racers with structured training systems will do HR training with zones ... they will, for instance, stay in the 110-130 zone this time of year to train basic aerobic endurance. This means that if you "keep up" with a pack of roadies this time of year it may well be that they are just casually riding in their LSD-zone while you are doing your best to keep up.
    Those guys will look at you and think: "look at them doing their best now when they should be relaxing ... but next year during the race we'll be in better shape and crush 'm"
    Last edited by AdelaaR; 09-18-13 at 02:15 AM.

  9. #34
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aqua_Andy View Post
    Cycling seams to be a very clicky hobby/activity/sport, whatever you want to call it. Can someone enlighten us nubes on how to get in with a group that rides? My other hobby is SCUBA and as a new diver all you have to do is go into any dive shop and ask if anyone is available for a dive and more often than not one of the other customers overhearing the conversation will offer to go with you. I often see veteran divers taking out new divers to mentor them or just to keep them excited about the sport. The way we see it is as long as you are under water blowing bubbles you are one of us. Maybe I need to find a different bike shop to frequent?
    Diving isn't an actual physically demanding sport where you have the problem of having to wait for people that aren't as powerful and take ages to climb that hill.

  10. #35
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by supremekizzle View Post
    I've noticed that bicycling seems to be like owning apple products; does the raw material costs justify the price of the product? No, but if you've got the money to throw around and want everyone to know about your status. I can't believe that you can buy a motorcycle for the price of a high-end bike. The material cost doesn't compute. Then again, bicycling is a 5 billion dollar industry...
    This is true for a certain type of "poseurs", but don't overgeneralize, please.
    The correct answer to your question is: "it depends".
    Last edited by AdelaaR; 09-18-13 at 02:17 AM.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    2) racers with structured training systems will do HR training with zones ... they will, for instance, stay in the 110-130 zone this time of year to train basic aerobic endurance. This means that if you "keep up" with a pack of roadies this time of year it may well be that they are just casually riding in their LSD-zone while you are doing your best to keep up.
    From Wikipedia's article on Albert Hofmann, the man who discovered LSD:

    "Three days later, on April 19, 1943, Hofmann intentionally ingested 250 micrograms of LSD. This day is now known as "Bicycle Day," because after starting to feel the effects of the drug he rode home on a bike, and that became the first intentional acid trip."

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    Diving isn't an actual physically demanding sport where you have the problem of having to wait for people that aren't as powerful and take ages to climb that hill.
    I disagree with this statement, I believe it is physically demanding just in a different way. Try dressing in your warmest winter outfit and then sealing yourself in a air tight, water tight suit(essentially a really expensive trash bag) then then attach close to 100 of gear to yourself and climb down a bunch of rocks to get to the water, Now imagine it is 90 degrees out. This is very typical around here as our water usually never warms to above 50 degrees at depth. There are many times when you are helping a new diver and are almost at the point of heat exhaustion before you even get to the water. Another issue we have is a diver that have poor buoyancy control or just poor cardiovascular efficiency and will blow through a tank of air in 30 minutes when you planned for an 80 minute dive. It is all relative jut different issues, but what is the same is the only way to get better is to participate in the activity and become more efficient. I don't mind helping new divers as I know when I was new there was someone putting up with me when I was a noob. I would think any activity that people are passionate about would be the same.

  13. #38
    Senior Member daihard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    2) racers with structured training systems will do HR training with zones ... they will, for instance, stay in the 110-130 zone this time of year to train basic aerobic endurance. This means that if you "keep up" with a pack of roadies this time of year it may well be that they are just casually riding in their LSD-zone while you are doing your best to keep up.
    Those guys will look at you and think: "look at them doing their best now when they should be relaxing ... but next year during the race we'll be in better shape and crush 'm"
    Is that how those "racers" typically feel about those who aren't "serious" in their book?

    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    This is true for a certain type of "poseurs", but don't overgeneralize, please.
    The correct answer to your question is: "it depends".
    I agree that generalization is bad. It's just like the motorists consider us cyclists to be jerks "in general," which I of course disagree with. What we can do to reduce that type of generalization is to NOT fit in that generalization. That's part of the reason I always stop for the red lights and come to an "almost" complete stop at stop signs. I'm hoping this will help change people's hasty generalization about cyclists.
    Last edited by daihard; 09-18-13 at 10:15 AM.
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  14. #39
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    every activity has its "clicks and snobs". I ride a hybrid and have also experienced the lack of response form roadies.
    On my motorcycle, the ones who wave back the least, are the ones on a Harley, if your not on a Harley.
    Skiiing.....oh wow you have those old ski's and aren't using.....xxxx....you should be on the bunny run
    I know for some, its a way to boost their own self image....wow ...im cooler than that guy...im so cool...look at me .....its all about me..me..me..me..the me monster

    But with my bicycle now, I don't let the snob roadies or the cool kids bother me (yes I too have been called grandpa on a stroller) I just chuckle to myself and keep riding.

    I will also state that I have met very nice people of all ages, on roadies, Harleys, limo's and shopping carts.

  15. #40
    Senior Member mrodgers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by niuoka View Post
    every activity has its "clicks and snobs". I ride a hybrid and have also experienced the lack of response form roadies.
    On my motorcycle, the ones who wave back the least, are the ones on a Harley, if your not on a Harley.
    Skiiing.....oh wow you have those old ski's and aren't using.....xxxx....you should be on the bunny run
    I know for some, its a way to boost their own self image....wow ...im cooler than that guy...im so cool...look at me .....its all about me..me..me..me..the me monster

    I will also state that I have met very nice people of all ages, on roadies, Harleys, limo's and shopping carts.
    Yup. I didn't ride a Harley, but it was a cruiser looking bike. I rode with my brother-in-law who rode a sport bike. The Harley riders would pass him without acknowledgement and then wave to me.

    Post a photo on a photo forum. You will get those who will comment about your camera after they've looked at the EXIF info rather than your photo. Ask a question about your inexpensive guitar that isn't at least a Squire Strat or an Epiphone (my guitar is a Cort.) You get the same thing. Ask about using a proprietary beginner RC airplane and you won't get help, you'll just get suggestions on replacing your equipment with a Spektrum computer radio and a different airplane. That's how it is no matter what the hobby.

    Now for the OP, you are the cool one in my book. I'm riding a Walmart $99 mountain bike, LOL.
    Ride no faster than your Guardian Angel can fly!

  16. #41
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daihard View Post
    Is that how those "racers" typically feel about those who aren't "serious" in their book?
    I have no idea, but, yeah, probably.
    The reason I have no idea is because there's a huge difference between roadies and triathletes or at least the guys in my tri club are very relaxed about such things.
    What I was trying to say is that passing a roadie on a hybrid (a thing I do almost every time I ride my hybrid, btw) isn't something one should be proud of.
    Once one gets a HR monitor and starts following a structured training system this becomes quite obvious.

  17. #42
    Senior Member daihard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    I have no idea, but, yeah, probably.
    The reason I have no idea is because there's a huge difference between roadies and triathletes or at least the guys in my tri club are very relaxed about such things.
    I hope the average racers behave like your Triathlon club riders.

    What I was trying to say is that passing a roadie on a hybrid (a thing I do almost every time I ride my hybrid, btw) isn't something one should be proud of.
    Once one gets a HR monitor and starts following a structured training system this becomes quite obvious.
    You seem to assume that every time someone on a hybrid passes a roadie, the roadie is following that structured training system and not going nearly as fast as they can. While that may be true in some situations, I can't imagine every roadie that I see on the trail or on the road is doing that all the time. I also believe that a good rider on a hybrid can pass a mediocre roadie on a road bike when they both intend to go fast. Do you disagree?
    Badly-behaved cyclists are usually just cyclists with inadequate infrastructure. Or none at all. - Mikael Colville-Andersen

  18. #43
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    I wonder if roadies just like to think that speed=better than you. Can't remember where, but I remember reading on these forums somewhere that the speed difference between road bikes and hybrids isn't that much. Rolling resistance, bike weight, etc. only account for a small percentage in speed. The biggest difference comes into play with riding positioning and aerodynamic drag. Sure, the small percentages of those other factors add up when you extrapolate your ride to many miles, but not so much on shorter rides. Point of all this being that roadies shouldn't feel all that superior to us hybrid riders.

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    Quote Originally Posted by supremekizzle View Post
    I wonder if roadies just like to think that speed=better than you. Can't remember where, but I remember reading on these forums somewhere that the speed difference between road bikes and hybrids isn't that much. Rolling resistance, bike weight, etc. only account for a small percentage in speed. The biggest difference comes into play with riding positioning and aerodynamic drag. Sure, the small percentages of those other factors add up when you extrapolate your ride to many miles, but not so much on shorter rides. Point of all this being that roadies shouldn't feel all that superior to us hybrid riders.
    Who, or where, are these "roadies" you and others on this thread refer to?

    I've been cycling seriously for going on twelve years now. I've never owned a (drop-bar) road bike, and have no present intention of doing so. I ride road on a flat-bar road bike. I ride mostly solo (distance, commute) and -- yes -- the occasional group ride here and there. I have never, ever yet encountered this 'attitude' you speak of from 'serious' road cyclists -- and I know many. Serious road cyclists, including those who race and train for racing, most certainly don't have this attitude in my experience.

    I have encountered this 'attitude' from idiots piddling along (or riding with dangerous, unskilled aggression) on the MUP in full kit/on full carbon 'road bikes' or tri-bikes, but those people are not "roadies" -- they are idiots -- no different from unskilled idiots-with-attitude on hybrid bikes, mtbs, and so on (of whom there are just as many, if not more, than those on "road bikes").

    I can't for the life of me see why many of the posters on this thread can't make this elementary distinction. Your Strawman is dead. Give it up; HTFU, STFU and ride.

  20. #45
    Senior Member Ridefreemc's Avatar
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    My cousin showed up to a group (road and road bikes) ride while on his mountain bike with full knobs. Took his turns at the front, no issues keeping up, climbing, etc. but he was breathing just a little heavier than normal though. We got to the breakfast stop and found out he had a flat and the tire was down to about 20 pounds for most of the ride. I loved it!
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  21. #46
    Senior Member daihard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by badger1 View Post
    I can't for the life of me see why many of the posters on this thread can't make this elementary distinction.
    I can easily see why. I'd call it generalization. If I see a group of cyclists in full kits riding road bikes, I consider them roadies. Sure, they may be idiots if they blast through the MUP at 20 MPH in double lines, but I still label them as "roadies," because that's exactly what they look like.

    It's like this. I know a lot of good and considerate BMW drivers out there as I used to own one and belonged to the local BMW club. If you came out and told me how the BMW drivers had an attitude problem, I would be inclined to tell you that those that you refer to are not the true BMW drivers - they're just idiots. OTOH, I don't think that's the kind of distinction someone outside the circle can easily make.
    Badly-behaved cyclists are usually just cyclists with inadequate infrastructure. Or none at all. - Mikael Colville-Andersen

  22. #47
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    I don't disagree, save that I'd refer to it as "hasty" or "faulty" generalization, predicated on extrapolation from 'appearance'. That is an all-too-human tendency, and one we ought all of us to fight against. It's rather the point I was making, in an oblique -- and possibly overly-harsh -- manner.
    Your analogue is apposite, though, and your point well-taken.

  23. #48
    Senior Member daihard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by badger1 View Post
    I don't disagree, save that I'd refer to it as "hasty" or "faulty" generalization, predicated on extrapolation from 'appearance'. That is an all-too-human tendency, and one we ought all of us to fight against. It's rather the point I was making, in an oblique -- and possibly overly-harsh -- manner.
    Your analogue is apposite, though, and your point well-taken.
    Thanks!

    Yes, I agree it's hasty generalization. I admit that I'm guilty of getting trapped into it from time to time. I think you'll be less likely to make hasty generalization about something that you know well than what you're not familiar with. The more true roadies I get to know down the road (I currently only know 3), I'm sure I will be better able to tell whether a rider is a truly serious road cyclist or just a "poseur." I'm just not there yet.
    Badly-behaved cyclists are usually just cyclists with inadequate infrastructure. Or none at all. - Mikael Colville-Andersen

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    Sorry for making the generalization also, as it's unfair and prejudice. It's just frustrating when I come onto this forum and walk into the LBS as a newbie and was subsequently greeted with comments on how my bike is $hit, get a real bike, and the like. Based on the few ignorant a$$holes I have come into contact with is it fair for me to generalize all roadies? No. It's just conditioning. It's not just me either. I have talked to a few runners at my place of employment that would like to get into cycling but have been apprehensive due to hearing about elitism in the activity, and they didn't hear it from me...

  25. #50
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daihard View Post
    You seem to assume that every time someone on a hybrid passes a roadie, the roadie is following that structured training system and not going nearly as fast as they can. While that may be true in some situations, I can't imagine every roadie that I see on the trail or on the road is doing that all the time. I also believe that a good rider on a hybrid can pass a mediocre roadie on a road bike when they both intend to go fast. Do you disagree?
    Oh surely not ... I've passed many a roadie and sometimes whole clubs while they didn't seem to be slacking.
    Still:
    Most "roadies" do more miles than most hybrid riders.
    This makes for a huge difference, also.
    Let's say a hybrid rider did 20 miles and had a nice warm-up and then encounters a roadie who just did over a hundred miles and is nearly home.
    If you've ever done over a hundred miles at a reasonable pace you'll know that it can be very demanding and by the end of it you might be completely burned up.
    The point is that it's impossible to measure ability by simply overtaking someone in the streets.
    The only way to compare to other people is by taking part in a sanctioned race.

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