wolfchild

I never had a need for any therapist. Self control is one of my strong points, and self control doesn't mean that one always has be a politically correct nice guy and always say yes to everybody...My point was that it just get annoying when the same thing happens over and over again. It's not just few questions from a cashier, some of these cashiers make a lot of effort to convince people that accepting wallmart credit card is the proper thing to do and that consumers have saved themselves millions of dollars using wallmart credit cards. Seriously, I saved myself more money by being car-free then by using wallmart credit card.

tandempower

I've saved a fortune in money and time shopping car-free at Walmart and never used a credit card. It's so convenient to pick up a few groceries along with hardware, clothing, toys, camping supplies, paint, or whatever in a single trip after work. I think it would be more time consuming to do all my shopping by bike (let alone bus!) if I had to go to many different stores. The exception might be if everything was sold downtown but it isn't and to be honest I'm glad downtown businesses are more geared toward special needs and other unique goods and services since those require more customer service than the standard life wares sold at Walmart and other discount one-stop shops.

I-Like-To-Bike

How much money is saved by bizarre Walmart bashing on BF?

tandempower

I had the chance to look inside a new Walmart neighborhood market on a trip out of town and it seems to be mostly just a small supermarket with competitive pricing. It was about the size of a Dollar General but with more cold cases (open ones at that, which are less energy-efficient) and less housewares and other variety.

Personally, I think Dollar General is a better discount one-stop shop but I think the point of this small Walmart (Smalmart?) is to give some competition to expensive rural supermarkets and drive down prices for consumers. So maybe rural consumers will at least benefit from lower prices.

Maybe if the big, expensive rural supermarkets are driven out of business by Smalmarts, their legacy will re-emerge as other, smaller supermarkets that compete with the Smalmarts, and those competitors will be positioned to service a smaller local area, which will make it easier for people to bike and walk to do grocery shopping.

Misplaced optimism or market trend?

CliffordK

Are they putting these new mini-Walmarts in rural locations or urban locations? Suburbs?

The rural supermarkets struggle, especially those in smaller satellite communities where many of the local residents make frequent trips to the big city.

MikeRides

I can speak from my experience of being in one of their suburban "neighborhood markets," it seems to be a bad decision. The main reason everybody shops at their Walmart in the first place is because consumers love the convenience of everything in one store, even I prefer that once in awhile, but they're not going to shop at Walmart just for food price be damned and still have to go elsewhere for their housewares, automotive, toys, gardening, hardware, sporting goods, etc.

Target announced a decision to open "express" stores(starting in their hometown of Minneapolis) in addition to their regular stores, prior to Walmart's decision (coincidence?). Some companies like Dollar General and Family Dollar has seen success with these "mini-have-everything" store models, especially those located in rural /suburban communities, but personally I don't see how it'll profit Walmart or Target.

tandempower

If big city prices are available close to home, why make frequent trips there? Boredom?

CliffordK

It depends on the family.

There are a lot of people that will live 10 to 30 miles out of town and commute to town every day. So adding groceries to one's normal commute isn't a big imposition.

I live about 5 miles from a small rural supermarket, and about 8 miles from the edge of the city.

In the small town, there is 1 restaurant, 1 supermarket, and 1 feed & tack store, plus the post office.

I actually frequently head to the rural post office there since I get better quicker service. However, I'll often be off puttering around the city and decide to swing by the supermarket there, where the selection is better, and if I'm already in town, then it is not far out of my way.

Depending on what is on the menu for the day, I often only do a big shopping trip every month or so. Perhaps a few "snack runs" in between. So, I don't worry about the extra trip to the store (which is always tied into another trip to town anyway).

I know of 2 satellite communities within 15 miles of "the city" that have had their supermarkets close.

If one is building rural supermarkets, the better location would be 50 miles or so from the nearest city, and thus have fewer commuters, and pull people from all directions, not just those that live further out of town. Then again, those communities would be served by a mini-supermarket + mini-department store.

tandempower

You seem to basically presume that a supermarket should have a monopoly area to avoid losing business to competitors. I think the idea of these Smalmarts is to stimulate a trend of multiple small markets so that there's more competition. What I'm hoping is that they don't set up competing stores near each other but instead put them a couple miles away from each other so that each is accessible car-free to the residences in the immediate vicinity of the store. That way, more people have the option of biking/walking to the store instead of always having to drive to do shopping.

CliffordK

I don't foresee Walmart as encouraging friendly competition.

I think it is a tragedy that so many small corner stores, both rural and suburban have closed over the years, but find myself passing up many of the small grocery stores for the larger ones that generally have a better selection and better prices. And, I will generally choose one-stop shopping over spreading my shopping over 3 different stores that carry unique selections. If the old corner store that is about 1/2 mile from my current house was still open, I might periodically stop down there, but alas, it closed before I moved out here, and once I'm on the road, an extra mile to go shopping or so doesn't make a differnece.

The walk/bike to the store is a good model, but living in urban, suburban, and rural communities, I just haven't seen a lot of people walking a half mile or so to the local store. And, one definitely has to limit what one buys when it all goes in a backpack, or is carried home on foot.

It is not that a monopoly is needed, but say one plunks a store in a population center of 1000 people. If 10% of the people shop at the new store, and 90% shop elsewhere, then that is only 100 regular customers... and the store will surely fail. On the other hand, if they can snag 90% of the local customers, as well as pull in customers from the surrounding area, perhaps that would be over 1000 regulars, and perhaps enough to barely squeeze by (perhaps by raising prices... and driving away customers).

tandempower

I don't know what you mean by 'friendly competition.' Price competition means selling things for lower prices, which means competitors have to lower their prices to maintain market share. 'Friendly' is setting your prices higher than you competition and hoping people will buy your products anyway out of kindness. Market collusion, or niche-differentiation is non-competitive market activity. It is what businesses do when they want to avoid stepping on each other's toes by selling comparable products at lower prices.

As more Smalmarts and Dollar Generals open up in rural areas, more people may take advantage of affordable land prices and live within walking/biking distance of stores to save money and live better.

The old store might be too big, with too much overhead, to compete with smaller stores. Or maybe it will figure out a way to slim down and use the surplus shelving for other products besides groceries. Or maybe it will rent out space to other local businesses or provide seating for an indoor cafe/restaurant. Or maybe it can attract customers by holding community meeting points where people can come together to help each other with bike-repair, health advice, hobby-sharing, etc. Maybe it can provide washrooms and showers for hiker/bikers coming through on tours. A lot is possible.

Roody

It was explained today on CBS This Morning that the main reason that Walmart and now Target are building these mini-stores is to compete better with Amazon and other online retailers--not with each other and other brick and mortar stores.

https://www.cbsnews.com/videos/big-bo...laim-shoppers/

Evidently, this small-store development has really heated up, just in the short time since I started this thread. Once again, Roody is on top of the latest trends!

tandempower

I didn't even think to check whether the one I visited had a site-to-store counter. I guess I could just check the site-to-store website and see if they ship to that location. (edit: just checked and they do)

Being able to pick up an internet order at a store is better than Amazon, imo, because 1) you can return it to the store if you need to, instead of mailing it back, and 2) you don't even have to take it home in the first place if you open it and it's not what you planned for.

Maybe the big supermarkets can reduce their grocery area and rent out sections of the store as Amazon/Ebay pick-up counters.

Roody

No, I think the opposite. They (Target, Walmart, etc.) will expand their grocery areas--especially fresh meats and produce--because that is where they have a clear superiority over delivery companies like Amazon. Also prepared goods like coffee, bagels, salads, meals, etc. These items also have high profit margins, and profit is what Walmart needs right now.

People walk or ride in to buy a coffee and a scone on their way to work. While there, they place an internet order for a couple inner tubes and a set of Allen wrenches. Then, on the way home that afternoon, they stop and pick up the internet order, while also purchasing a rotisserie chicken and a fresh head of lettuce for dinner. I don't know about you, but this business model suits my "urban lifestyle" very well.

cooker

BTW, do you pronounce it "scohn" or "sconn"? Maybe we can all argue about that

Roody

My mother was of Scottish descent but spoke with a heavy U.P. accent. She made lovely scones and taught me to call them "scawns". Most baristas in southern Michigan don't know what the hell I'm talking about when I ask for a scawn, so I clarify by asking for "one of them biscuit-y things." I usually end up with a biscotti!

cooker

lol

My 3rd gen Scottish-Canadian mother also said 'scawn'. I often order one at a local coffee shop and usually they get it, although occasionally a staff will double check - "a 'scohn'?"

Roody

Yes, my grandmother. who was born in Goderich, Ontario, also said scawn. There probably isn't much difference between a eastern U.P. accent and a southern Ontario accent, although both would deny it. They both have a lot of that Scottish in them...and both love scawns!

fitftw

Only thing I buy at Walmart is white chocolate Reese's cups, and that's once or twice a year. Target doesn't sell them.

tandempower

Right, but I'm thinking ahead to the next step in the competition: once the Targettes and Smalmarts get established as grocery stores with site-to-store outlets for internet orders, the traditional stores can compete by consolidating their grocery selection to make room for internet distributorships. That way, Amazon and Ebay customers can benefit from the convenience of a pick-up location with a return counter (and the shipping cost savings that come with that).

It will be interesting to see how the competition between the Targettes and Smalmarts play out against Amazon and Ebay. I think many surprises may be in store.