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Living Car Free Do you live car free or car light? Do you prefer to use alternative transportation (bicycles, walking, other human-powered or public transportation) for everyday activities whenever possible? Discuss your lifestyle here.

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Old 09-10-17, 08:29 AM   #176
Dave Cutter
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Originally Posted by cooker View Post
lol
I also try to have fun with these threads/posts. Glad you see the humor too. I've found going (very) car lite to be relatively easy. But it was action that made it so.... not words. These forums are quick, timely, and easy reading. A minute of fun snuck in... here and there.
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Old 09-10-17, 08:30 AM   #177
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What are you still doing here. Have you not evacuated yet?
How do you know I haven't evacuated already, and this is just how I'm keeping myself occupied while I sit in a shelter somewhere?
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Old 09-10-17, 08:31 AM   #178
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How do you know I haven't evacuated already, and this is just how I'm keeping myself occupied while I sit in a shelter somewhere?
The shelters have computer access???
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Old 09-10-17, 08:37 AM   #179
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The shelters have computer access???
Why wouldn't they have wifi?
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Old 09-10-17, 08:39 AM   #180
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Why wouldn't they have wifi?
I didn't think the US had wifi outside of McDonalds, libraries, and universities.
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Old 09-10-17, 08:42 AM   #181
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I didn't think the US had wifi outside of McDonalds, libraries, and universities.
You never know where there's wifi until it pops up on your phone.
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Old 09-10-17, 08:45 AM   #182
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...... At a certain point in academic development, people start partitioning off boundaries ......... people will claim such specialization/differentiation is a natural result of evolving complexity, but it is mostly politically motivated.....
That reminds me of a nurse I once knew. She asked me to take a couple hours to teach her computer science (I had recently completed some studies in that field at the time). I said sure... lets find 4 hours... and you can teach me everything a nurse needs to know too.

My humor was lost on her. She instead explained that nursing was complicated and required much study... and wasn't something that could be briefly shared (like computer science).

This specialty of studies isn't new... by any means. I remember the old book: The specialist 1929
by Charles Sale. Or the Jewish Mystics from century's past. It is easy to think any field of study we know nothing about doesn't contain much knowledge.
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Old 09-10-17, 08:48 AM   #183
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I didn't think the US had wifi outside of McDonalds, libraries, and universities.
Cable TV providers and mobile phone providers offer wifi generally as a benefit to their paid subscribers. The Governor of Florida requested the wifi providers open their systems to the general population during the emergency.... and they complied.

P.S. Coffee shops, grocery stores, etc. all offer free wifi. It is pretty much everywhere you see buildings.
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Old 09-10-17, 08:51 AM   #184
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That reminds me of a nurse I once knew. She asked me to take a couple hours to teach her computer science (I had recently completed some studies in that field at the time). I said sure... lets find 4 hours... and you can teach me everything a nurse needs to know too.

My humor was lost on her. She instead explained that nursing was complicated and required much study... and wasn't something that could be briefly shared (like computer science).

This specialty of studies isn't new... by any means. I remember the old book: The specialist – 1929
by Charles Sale. Or the Jewish Mystics from century's past. It is easy to think any field of study we know nothing about doesn't contain much knowledge.
It has nothing to do with how much or little knowledge a field of study 'contains.' It's simply about the willingness to explore information/knowledge and practice discipline that causes one to progress in abilities that one lacks. It's not a question of total mastery vs. absolute deficiency, but of whether you can transcend absolute deficiency at all. By doing so, you initiate progress toward mastery in any direction you are moving.

What's more, there are many overlapping competencies in different disciplines, so as you gain more knowledge and proficiency in various disciplines, you also gain more meta-competency at a more general level. You may not know all the details of something someone else has specialized in, but that shouldn't stop you from being able to apply your intelligence to thinking about issues. Only defensive, territorial people get angry about people outside their field/territory asking questions and weighing in with critical thinking.

If someone has an idea about something I know how to do, I don't mind listening to what they have to say and giving them my assessment of their thoughts. I figure they might have some insight that I lack, or they might gain insight from proposing things and listening to feedback from someone with more experience. Communication can always be fruitful, if people remain positive and constructive. It's when it degenerates into defensiveness and territorial ego-bickering that it becomes problematic.

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Old 09-10-17, 09:01 AM   #185
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I had to think about that. You're obviously much younger than myself. I remember those three consecutive Sundays back in 1960. "Sabin Sundays" they were called. People smiled, laughed, I remember seeing a few tears too. Trust me.... people know progress when it happens.
The Sabin vaccine was certainly a great step forward and continues to be recognized as such. But the perception would be much different if its introduction had been followed a decade later by some unforeseen side effect such as happened with thalidomide.

Similarly, the use of an antibiotic dip for chickens in the '50s was seen as a big step forward in the poultry industry but was later found to result in serious problems both in the chicken meat and in the health of workers. The process ended up being banned about a decade after being hailed as progress.
'Big Chicken': The Medical Mystery That Traced Back To Slaughterhouse Workers : The Salt : NPR

Best to wait awhile before making an assessment of the overall benefits vs. costs.
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Old 09-10-17, 12:30 PM   #186
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I didn't think the US had wifi outside of McDonalds, libraries, and universities.
Plus bars, restaurants, stores, municipalities, hotels, personal hotspot w/cellular data...
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Old 09-10-17, 02:51 PM   #187
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Then you KNOW... preventing polio was progress.
I didn't say it wasn't.
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Old 09-10-17, 09:08 PM   #188
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It has nothing to do with how much or little knowledge a field of study 'contains.' It's simply about the willingness to explore information/knowledge and practice discipline that causes one to progress in abilities that one lacks. ...... .
If that is in fact true.... it should be criminal for intuitions to market degrees and advanced degrees.

Or.... maybe knowing how to use a search isn't all you think it might be. What great breakthroughs in science have been made by non-professionals using search sites to "explore information/knowledge". I would guess if you are correct... since I myself have been "searching" since 1993.... nearly 25 years of of such activities should have already produced mountains of new discoveries.
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Old 09-10-17, 09:11 PM   #189
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..... Best to wait awhile before making an assessment of the overall benefits vs. costs.
I am sure General Ludd would have given you a field promotion for your valor sir. I understand your caution... but caution can a very expensive commodity. Like Saffron.... caution should be used sparingly.

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Old 09-12-17, 07:49 AM   #190
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If that is in fact true.... it should be criminal for intuitions to market degrees and advanced degrees.
Why is that?

Quote:
Or.... maybe knowing how to use a search isn't all you think it might be. What great breakthroughs in science have been made by non-professionals using search sites to "explore information/knowledge". I would guess if you are correct... since I myself have been "searching" since 1993.... nearly 25 years of of such activities should have already produced mountains of new discoveries.
Breakthroughs are a different issue. The issue here is that people can simply develop high levels of general knowledge and understanding that would eliminate a vast amount of dependency on specialists. The fact is that you can achieve a whole lot in terms of self-reliance if you just possess general knowledge and the will to exert the effort required to apply it.
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Old 09-14-17, 12:10 AM   #191
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He proposed saving that money by not using a car, not by cutting back on food or home heating or whatever. Mind you, people with that income probably already don't have cars of if they do, I hope they spend less than $5000/year on them.
Good lord; not counting gas, oil and insurance (all of which become tricky to figure in as I was an outside sales rep, a field service tech and a site inspector during that time, using my own car for most of that, and some of it was on a fixed vehicle allowance, while other trips had a per-mile rate and insurance allowance, which was actually profitable for anyone getting better than 15mpg, especially in a reliable beater that's pretty much immune to depreciation) I didn't spend $5000 total on my last four cars, and that's over about 14 years. Maybe $2500 total on buying them, $700 on registration, and $1500 on repairs and long term maintenance. Granted, if I hadn't done most of the labor myself, the repairs and maintenance would have been 3-4x as much, but still not even $1k/year.

I'm pretty sure I've spent more on crap for my Trek in the last couple of years than I did on buying and maintaining my Saturn in the 3 years I had it. Luxury gas (i.e. not commute or normal errands) was probably most of the cost over that time, and of course, that depended entirely on disposable income at the moment. (And went almost entirely to trips that I wouldn't be able to do without a personal vehicle. 130 miles each way on a bike, plus 3 hours of dancing in between isn't really a viable Friday night option.)

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Old 09-14-17, 01:51 AM   #192
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The Bureau of Statistics here in Australia has actually moved transport down the spend list for Australian families to third place.
I quote:

Thirty years ago the largest part of the weekly household wage was spent putting food on the table. The second largest expense was on transport - including keeping the family car running and travelling to and from work - and the third was on keeping a roof over the family's head.

But those outlays have since almost turned upside down, with the largest proportion of household spending now going on housing, then food and transport.


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Old 09-14-17, 07:13 AM   #193
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That's what happened in the US back in the 80's - Our poverty computations were all based on the cost of food originally as that was the largest household expense in the era, but starting in the 80's (possibly slightly before, I was too young in the '70's to care about much besides starting grade school) the cost of housing started to exceed all other standard cost of living expenses by a great deal.
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Old 09-24-17, 12:38 AM   #194
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2017 is turning out to be a disaster as far as weather is concerned.

The economy, isn't getting any better in most places either.

The days of privately owned property that is paid in full are becoming a distant memory.

Biometric based austerity for almost everyone.
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Old 09-24-17, 12:47 AM   #195
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The Bureau of Statistics here in Australia has actually moved transport down the spend list for Australian families to third place.
I quote:

Thirty years ago the largest part of the weekly household wage was spent putting food on the table. The second largest expense was on transport - including keeping the family car running and travelling to and from work - and the third was on keeping a roof over the family's head.

But those outlays have since almost turned upside down, with the largest proportion of household spending now going on housing, then food and transport.


Did they say why transportation has become relatively cheaper?

I doubt if that's the case here. Bus fares have stayed about the same. Bikes are much more expensive. Cars (purchase price, new or used) are much more expensive. Gas is a little cheaper, but that fluctuates so much I wouldn't count on it. Walking is still practically free.

Of course, we're talking about relative costs, so maybe transportation is becoming cheaper when compared to other expenses?
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Old 09-24-17, 12:54 AM   #196
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That's what happened in the US back in the 80's - Our poverty computations were all based on the cost of food originally as that was the largest household expense in the era, but starting in the 80's (possibly slightly before, I was too young in the '70's to care about much besides starting grade school) the cost of housing started to exceed all other standard cost of living expenses by a great deal.
Housing costs went way down in the Great Recession. But now rents, especially, but also house ownership, are going up a lot, although you can still find great bargains. They told us in high school to budget about 25% of income for housing, but now it's 30% or even 40%. At least around here in the so-called rust belt.

Food from the store is cheaper now but restaurant food (other than fast food) has gone up a lot. The quality of food I think has gone up a great deal since I was a kid in the 1960s and 70s.
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Old 09-24-17, 01:30 AM   #197
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I seem to remember the introduction of mass scale junk food in the 1980's and the associated increase in obesity.

Quality, in terms of overall health of the population, is in decline related to a lack of nutritious food.

Junk food has only increased in abundance, its becoming quite common in China, most people in big cities rarely cook at home anymore.
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Old 09-26-17, 07:36 AM   #198
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Housing costs went way down in the Great Recession. But now rents, especially, but also house ownership, are going up a lot, although you can still find great bargains. They told us in high school to budget about 25% of income for housing, but now it's 30% or even 40%. At least around here in the so-called rust belt.

Food from the store is cheaper now but restaurant food (other than fast food) has gone up a lot. The quality of food I think has gone up a great deal since I was a kid in the 1960s and 70s.
I'm a renter, and those prices never really went down during the great recession.
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