shopping & looking for a better way
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,946
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
shopping & looking for a better way
So for errands I have one of those super-bulky, tall, narrow, heavy so-called Dutch bikes...you know, enclosed drivetrain, single-speed, pushrod brakes. So I took it big-time grocery shopping tonight, w/a strapped on milkcrate to hold my schwag, and boy! if it didn't really change my behavior in traffic. First of all, I couldn't stay close enough to the curb for my comfort... the rear weight of a moderate load of groceries really played havoc w/the bike's balance. And I fled to the available bike lanes ASAP, which isn't at all my normal style. Also, given the bike's capabilities and my reluctance to do anything but get home in one piece, if I ever got above ten miles an hour, I'd like to know how. I need to think of some better tactics for car-free provisioning, I guess. Do most of y'all use trailers, or what?
#2
.
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: .
Posts: 3,094
Bikes: .
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I have heard that rear panniers loaded can make a bike act squirrelly, it might be worse depending on the geometry of the bike. You might try rigging up a basket that goes on the front, say get one of those front pannier racks then affix your milk crate to that. Your weight on the back wheel, groceries' weight on the front, it's more equal anyway.
Some messenger types can put a milk crate's worth of schwag in a large messenger bag, that's an option.
Those Dutch bikes sound sooooo cool, but they may not deal with rear loads as well as some other bikes, you might try your present setup on a different bike too.
Some messenger types can put a milk crate's worth of schwag in a large messenger bag, that's an option.
Those Dutch bikes sound sooooo cool, but they may not deal with rear loads as well as some other bikes, you might try your present setup on a different bike too.
#3
Immoderator
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: POS Tennessee
Posts: 7,630
Bikes: Gary Fisher Simple City 8, Litespeed Obed
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
4 Posts
The lower you can move the weight, perhaps by getting panniers or buckets on either side of your rack, the less unwieldy the bike will feel. Army surplus stores are full of acceptable canvas bags that make great panniers for a heck of a lot less than Carradice or Baggins bags, btw. A cheap-o kiddie trailer makes an excellent grocery getter, as well.
__________________
Originally Posted by Bikeforums
Your rights end where another poster's feelings begin.
#4
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,946
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
yeah, I'm pretty glad the bike wasn't that expensive as I bought it w/o any practical testing (load hauling etc.) but I'm thinking my beater w/a trailer or panniers might work better. funny cause the bike's been awesome so far but this is the fisrt time I've tried to use it for a big deal grocery shop. (ever notice how much liquid you buy? weird.)
#6
SE Wis
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 10,513
Bikes: '68 Raleigh Sprite, '02 Raleigh C500, '84 Raleigh Gran Prix, '91 Trek 400, 2013 Novara Randonee, 1990 Trek 970
Mentioned: 40 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2747 Post(s)
Liked 3,394 Times
in
2,056 Posts
#7
Insomniac
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Alabama
Posts: 413
Bikes: 2004 Scattante R650, IRO Mark V, TST /w 2005 Camp. Centaur(RIP thanks to an F150), Specialized E5 TT bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
With rear panniers loaded with 40lbs of groceries (I was curious so I weighed them) my road bike gets squirrelly IF I stand up.
Not a problem if it wasn't also a fixed gear. Accelerating is difficult with a load but at speed it's fine. It does take a bit more to stop of course.
Not a problem if it wasn't also a fixed gear. Accelerating is difficult with a load but at speed it's fine. It does take a bit more to stop of course.
#8
Chairman of the Bored
Join Date: May 2004
Location: St. Petersburg, FL
Posts: 5,825
Bikes: 2004 Raleigh Talus, 2001 Motobecane Vent Noir (Custom build for heavy riders)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
I found mountain hardtails seem to have a geometry that's favorable with loaded panniers, as well as oversized crap on top....like a large suitcase, with all kinds of crap inside.
I'm currently in the process of making my Talus more practical by adding a rack to it....which means disc to vbrake conversion on the back...ugh.
I still feel that multi-speed is the way to go, even if it's just a sturmey archer 3-sp hub.
I'm currently in the process of making my Talus more practical by adding a rack to it....which means disc to vbrake conversion on the back...ugh.
I still feel that multi-speed is the way to go, even if it's just a sturmey archer 3-sp hub.
#9
I'm made of earth!
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Frankfurt, Germany
Posts: 2,025
Bikes: KTM Macina 5 e-bike, Babboe Curve-E cargobike, Raleigh Aspen touring/off-road hybrid.
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10 Post(s)
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Fixed gear and heavy loads: bad combo. Low gear needed to start from 0 mph.
Putting stuff in a crate on top of your rear rack is very unstable because you have a high center of gravity. High C.O.G. = very bad.
Panniers = lower C.O.G. = better.
Trailer = lowest C.O.G. = best. I use a BOB yak. It rules. Loads up to 60 lbs are no problem in the sloghtest.
Putting stuff in a crate on top of your rear rack is very unstable because you have a high center of gravity. High C.O.G. = very bad.
Panniers = lower C.O.G. = better.
Trailer = lowest C.O.G. = best. I use a BOB yak. It rules. Loads up to 60 lbs are no problem in the sloghtest.
#10
I'm made of earth!
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Frankfurt, Germany
Posts: 2,025
Bikes: KTM Macina 5 e-bike, Babboe Curve-E cargobike, Raleigh Aspen touring/off-road hybrid.
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10 Post(s)
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
uh, slightest.
#11
Banned
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 10,082
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
We use panniers for our grocery gettinng. We haven't had any problems with heavy loads. Bulky stuff gets strapped to the top of the rack, heavest stuff goes in the bottom of the panniers.
#12
Embrace the weirdness.
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 153
Bikes: Motobecane
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Grocery panniers (like this one ) affixed to a good solid rack work well for me; I find it also helps bike stability if the grocery weight is as low as possible, as balanced as possible side-to-side, and if there is also some weight in the front.
With no weight in the front a rear-loaded bike gets wonky steering. You can get detachable front baskets for shopping; I've also just hung plastic shopping bags from my handlebars in a pinch. Even a little weight in the front makes a significant difference in the bike handling.
With no weight in the front a rear-loaded bike gets wonky steering. You can get detachable front baskets for shopping; I've also just hung plastic shopping bags from my handlebars in a pinch. Even a little weight in the front makes a significant difference in the bike handling.
#13
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Savannah, Georgia
Posts: 249
Bikes: '79 Peugeot UE8, '89 Schwinn Mesa Runner, '79 Schwinn Traveler
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by primaryreality
Grocery panniers (like this one ) affixed to a good solid rack work well for me
#14
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,946
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by dedhed
#15
Biker
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: DC
Posts: 1,917
Bikes: one Recumbent and one Utility Bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Laika, when I visited the Netherlands I saw people carrying their friends on those racks. It is hard to believe that a milk crate of groceries would be more difficult to carry than a person sitting side saddle.
The bike pictured in the thread "Panniers without panniers" actually feels more stable with a heavy load but it is a touring bike. I also have a "Dutch bike" but made by Trek and have owned a German made city bike very similar to the dutch bikes. I don't notice the effects you describe. Is the rack loose? Tires inflated? Milk crate attached securely? Does the load shift?
For the tinkerers, the German city bike I had, had a spring running from the bolt where the front rim brake attaches going back to the down tube. I'm out of town right now so can't get a photo of it. When you turned the handle bars to an extreme angle the spring would extend to make it more difficult to steer further. This was handy for those times when you have it on a kick stand with a heavy load and don't want the front wheel to turn too far. I'm not sure if it had a positive effect on handling but I have a broken clavicle to show what can happen when the wheel turns too far while rough riding.
The bike pictured in the thread "Panniers without panniers" actually feels more stable with a heavy load but it is a touring bike. I also have a "Dutch bike" but made by Trek and have owned a German made city bike very similar to the dutch bikes. I don't notice the effects you describe. Is the rack loose? Tires inflated? Milk crate attached securely? Does the load shift?
For the tinkerers, the German city bike I had, had a spring running from the bolt where the front rim brake attaches going back to the down tube. I'm out of town right now so can't get a photo of it. When you turned the handle bars to an extreme angle the spring would extend to make it more difficult to steer further. This was handy for those times when you have it on a kick stand with a heavy load and don't want the front wheel to turn too far. I'm not sure if it had a positive effect on handling but I have a broken clavicle to show what can happen when the wheel turns too far while rough riding.
#16
it's my road too, dangit
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: nebraska
Posts: 216
Bikes: early 90's marin, 1969 schwinn collegiate, waterford, bridgestone rb1
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
i love my trailer. Adapted an old burley into a flatbed with a rubbermaid container bolted on, and it's like a big trunk. Open the lid, throw stuff in, peddle off.
#17
Stoked
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: White Mountains of AZ
Posts: 268
Bikes: S-Works E5, Trek T2000 Tandem, Giant Warp DS/1
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I hauled my sister-in-law arround Amsterdam on this bike without trouble.
She moved arround enough to take pictures while we were riding without causing real handling problems.
The handling of this bike with a load was truly impressive!
One more anecdote: While pulling a BOB Yak from east coast to west I broke my flimsy rear wheel in Ohio. The quality replacement did wonders for the handling of the bike. Turns out the wheel I started with was flexing all over the place and causing all of the undesireable handling I had been experiencing.
#18
Sophomoric Member
I don't use a trailer, probably will someday. I shop European style, buying stuff every couple days in small quantities. The advantages for me are that my food is always fresh, I don't have to carry much, and I have less food around to eat, so I don't get as fat. If I had to feed a lot of people, this might not work, so I'd probably make them help me.
I'm not a purist, either. When I cooked for my family, I used to take the bus to the supermarket, then take a cab home wit 250 bags of groceries (seemed like). My friends often call me when they're going shopping, and shlepp me along with them in their cars. I like to buy them a treat for their trouble.
I'm not a purist, either. When I cooked for my family, I used to take the bus to the supermarket, then take a cab home wit 250 bags of groceries (seemed like). My friends often call me when they're going shopping, and shlepp me along with them in their cars. I like to buy them a treat for their trouble.
#19
Chicago Cyclist
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Chicago
Posts: 369
Bikes: My frame is covered in reflective tape. After adding ridiculously large handlebars, a comfy seat, and enough carrying capacity to haul a Thanksgiving grocery run home, the manufacturer wouldn't recognize it.
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Hauling a heavy load on a bicycle is like captaining a tandem for the first time. The extra weight in the rear seems very disorientating. Getting used to it is like... well, urm, learning to ride a bicycle. You may want to carry some heavy loads under circumstances where you don't have to worry about traffic, etc.
By the way, if you're going to use the milk crate, then you may want to pick up some automotive hose clamps. These can be used to clamp the crate securely in place. (Crates with heavy loads can sometimes slip if only secured by a bungee.)
By the way, if you're going to use the milk crate, then you may want to pick up some automotive hose clamps. These can be used to clamp the crate securely in place. (Crates with heavy loads can sometimes slip if only secured by a bungee.)
#20
I'm Carbon Curious
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,190
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I've been using Performance Bike's Transit grocery getters. They're about $39.99 for each side. They're nothing special, but they work. One of them are getting a bit flimsy, but it still works. They're designed to fit the brown paper bags. I'm only shopping for myself so it's perfect for one weeks worth of shopping.
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 757
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Xtracycle!!!!! Seriously, I had one for awhile and it was awesome - I could carry 4 bags of groceries on it with no problem. It's the truck equivalent of a bicycle. As soon as I can afford to, I want to build up another one.
https://www.xtracycle.com
https://www.xtracycle.com
#22
Banned
Thats with nine 2 liter bottles, it will hold about 4-5 more and still close the lid.Grocery shopping is not a problem.
#23
I'm Carbon Curious
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,190
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
pedex—do you attach that bag to your rack or do you carry it on your back?
If you attach it to your rack, what is the brand and model of the bag and how do you attach it.
From the looks of it, it looks like a messenger bag, if so, I'd be worry about your poor back if I was you.
If you attach it to your rack, what is the brand and model of the bag and how do you attach it.
From the looks of it, it looks like a messenger bag, if so, I'd be worry about your poor back if I was you.
#24
Banned
Its a messenger bag, and back problems arent an issue when carrying one loaded with stuff.
Panniers have their issues, they dont carry well off the bike, they get filthy when riding in bad weather while mounted on the bike, and they typically dont hold much. Most panniers Ive seen, it would take at least 2 or 3 to equal one medium sized messenger bag. On top of that, panniers need hardware to mount them to a bike, meaning, switching bikes means switching the mounts too. panniers as noted above, also affect the bikes handling bigtime. Given those traits, messenger bag works better cept on really really long trips.
Panniers have their issues, they dont carry well off the bike, they get filthy when riding in bad weather while mounted on the bike, and they typically dont hold much. Most panniers Ive seen, it would take at least 2 or 3 to equal one medium sized messenger bag. On top of that, panniers need hardware to mount them to a bike, meaning, switching bikes means switching the mounts too. panniers as noted above, also affect the bikes handling bigtime. Given those traits, messenger bag works better cept on really really long trips.
#25
Velocipedic Practitioner
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 488
Bikes: Specialized Sirrus, Bianchi Volpe, Trek 5000, Santana Arriva tandem, Pashley Sovereign, among others
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
When grocery shopping for large loads, I use a trailer. It works great and doesn't affect bike handling at all.
For smaller loads, I use two foldout baskets attached to my rear rack. These baskets can carry more than one would think. They also ride lower than a milk crate so the lower center of gravity has less impact on bike handling.
For smaller loads, I use two foldout baskets attached to my rear rack. These baskets can carry more than one would think. They also ride lower than a milk crate so the lower center of gravity has less impact on bike handling.