Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Living Car Free Do you live car free or car light? Do you prefer to use alternative transportation (bicycles, walking, other human-powered or public transportation) for everyday activities whenever possible? Discuss your lifestyle here.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 08-25-07, 05:35 AM   #1
1ply
Plays in Traffic
Thread Starter
 
1ply's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Bikes:
Posts: 484
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Living with less car - becoming more popular?

It looks that way - look what Kona has:



it can be found here: http://www.konaworld.com/08_ute.htm
1ply is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-07, 06:29 AM   #2
wahoonc
Senior Member
 
wahoonc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: On the road-USA
Bikes: Giant Excursion, Raleigh Sports, Raleigh R.S.W. Compact, Motobecane? and about 20 more! OMG
Posts: 16,687
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Nice concept...but why only one frame size? I need a bit more than a 17.5" frame...like 5" more I have one bike now with a 19" step thru frame with a 400mm seat post. Not the best situation, but for what I need it works for now.

Aaron
__________________
Webshots is bailing out, if you find any of my posts with corrupt picture files and want to see them corrected please let me know. :(

ISO: A late 1980's Giant Iguana MTB frameset (or complete bike) 23" Red with yellow graphics.

"Cycling should be a way of life, not a hobby.
RIDE, YOU FOOL, RIDE!"
_Nicodemus

"Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
Aluminum: barely a hundred
Which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?"
_krazygluon
wahoonc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-07, 10:42 AM   #3
acroy
Senior Member
 
acroy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Dallas Suburbpopolis
Bikes:
Posts: 1,480
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Great to finally see an alternative to the xtra-cycle.
this is a landmark bike: a major manufacturer catering to us car-lite nuts.
I hope it is a huge success
acroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-07, 11:49 AM   #4
bragi
bragi
 
bragi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: seattle, WA
Bikes: LHT
Posts: 2,911
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Seen from where we sit, living with less car may seem to be getting a lot more popular, but let's consider this quote from an article I just read about the mortgage crisis: (italics added by me)

The Pents grieve losing their three-acre property in the middle of horse country, with its swimming pool and fish pond.

"It was my dad's house," said Connie, 39, an elementary schools receptionist. "It's quiet, it's open - we love it."

Their troubles began in April 2006 when they refinanced the remaining $207,000 on a 30-year fixed loan to a two-year adjustable rate mortgage so they could pay down hefty obligations on their SUV and pickup truck.
A mortgage broker informed them just before the closing that the remaining debt would be $3,500 more than expected, but they signed anyway.
"We didn't have time to change the terms so we just signed them," Connie said.


Of course, this family seems to be breathtakingly stupid in a variety of ways, but I'm left to wonder how many other people stumble into foreclosure without even for a second considering getting rid of one or more of their cars, or switching to smaller, less expensive vehicles. Living with less car may be more popular than it used to be, but it's still not a mass movement by any stretch of the imagination.

That Kona's pretty sweet, btw.

Last edited by bragi; 08-25-07 at 12:27 PM.
bragi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-07, 11:55 AM   #5
jakbikesdc
Senior Member
 
jakbikesdc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: WesternSlopeCO
Bikes:
Posts: 184
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1ply View Post
It looks that way - look what Kona has:



it can be found here: http://www.konaworld.com/08_ute.htm

NICE!!! I love it. I gunna start saving up for that beast.

*I guess all those years of worshiping the gods of Kona paid off!!*
jakbikesdc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-07, 12:06 PM   #6
lyeinyoureye
Senior Citizen
 
lyeinyoureye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: no
Bikes: yes
Posts: 1,347
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
$800!?!? Do they think we're made of money?
lyeinyoureye is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-07, 06:32 PM   #7
Smallwheels
Senior Member
 
Smallwheels's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: I'm in Portland Oregon
Bikes: Xootr scooter
Posts: 1,381
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Good Concept

Why doesn't it have a rear brake? With it loaded with plenty of cargo a rear brake would be very useful, even on wet pavement. No rear brake is listed on their web site.

It needs a rear fender too.
Smallwheels is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-07, 07:17 PM   #8
Platy
Dare to be weird!
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Austin TX
Bikes: Hybridized 1970s Coppi road bike; Townie city cruiser
Posts: 1,991
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bragi View Post
Seen from where we sit, living with less car may seem to be getting a lot more popular, but let's consider this quote from an article I just read about the mortgage crisis...
If you're following the mortgage story you might like to look in on the Broker Outpost forum. Broker Outpost is a sibling to Bike Forums, both being operated by the same company.

Broker Outpost Forum
Platy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-07, 07:44 PM   #9
FXjohn
Banned.
 
FXjohn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: NE Indiana
Bikes:
Posts: 12,901
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 803 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1ply View Post
It looks that way - look what Kona has:



it can be found here: http://www.konaworld.com/08_ute.htm
That is a great bike . How much again?
FXjohn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-07, 08:06 PM   #10
Newspaperguy
Senior Member
 
Newspaperguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Bikes:
Posts: 2,206
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Wow. That one's built for hauling. There's also the Surley Big Dummy which seems to be a similar concept.
Newspaperguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-07, 09:15 PM   #11
Allen
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 4,751
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by FXjohn View Post
That is a great bike . How much again?
About eight bills.
Allen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-07, 09:34 PM   #12
Robert C
Senior Member
 
Robert C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Salt lake, UT
Bikes: This list got too long: several ‘bents, an urban utility e-bike, and a dahon D7 that my daughter has absconded with.
Posts: 1,631
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
My wife, who I am having a nearly impossible time getting on bikes, saw this bike and was actually enthused. To her this was a bike that could actually be usefully. I may end up with one when I return to the states.
Robert C is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-07, 12:32 PM   #13
bragi
bragi
 
bragi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: seattle, WA
Bikes: LHT
Posts: 2,911
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Platy View Post
If you're following the mortgage story you might like to look in on the Broker Outpost forum. Broker Outpost is a sibling to Bike Forums, both being operated by the same company.

Broker Outpost Forum
I took a look, and didn't get it. How anyone can carry on passionate discussions about real estate, and even understand them, is beyond me, I guess. I must be financially ********. It's probably just as well that I didn't replace my fixed-rate mortgage with an ARM so I could make up payments on the Burley Flatbed....
bragi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-07, 02:06 PM   #14
Platy
Dare to be weird!
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Austin TX
Bikes: Hybridized 1970s Coppi road bike; Townie city cruiser
Posts: 1,991
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bragi View Post
I took a look, and didn't get it. How anyone can carry on passionate discussions about real estate, and even understand them, is beyond me, I guess. I must be financially ********. It's probably just as well that I didn't replace my fixed-rate mortgage with an ARM so I could make up payments on the Burley Flatbed....
I'm no real estate wizard either. I just try to see the big picture. Resource limits ensure that consumer culture can't expand indefinitely. Something will come along to stop it. The free market has apparently chosen the housing bubble and mortgage credit constraint as its means for reining in the AWOL (American Way of Life).

In other words, it wasn't a gas crisis, war, epidemics, or economic collapse. It had to be something, though.

It may still be a while before the average American starts taking cycling seriously as an alternative to cars. But I think it's coming.
Platy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-07, 02:50 PM   #15
Nightshade
Humvee of bikes =Worksman
 
Nightshade's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 5,363
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert C View Post
My wife, who I am having a nearly impossible time getting on bikes, saw this bike and was actually enthused. To her this was a bike that could actually be usefully. I may end up with one when I return to the states.
This is a pure "utility" bike which might put Surly ahead of the game with folk's like you wife......
and there are alot of folk's like your wife that just want a "bike that works for a living" like this Surly.
__________________
My preferred bicycle brand is.......WORKSMAN CYCLES
I dislike clipless pedals on any city bike since I feel they are unsafe.

Originally Posted by krazygluon
Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
Aluminum: barely a hundred, which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?
Nightshade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-07, 04:09 PM   #16
Doug5150
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: IL-USA
Bikes:
Posts: 1,661
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bragi View Post
Seen from where we sit, living with less car may seem to be getting a lot more popular, but let's consider this quote from an article I just read about the mortgage crisis: (italics added by me) ....
The mortgage crisis was caused by lots of people signing their names for loans that they simply could not pay for over the long run.
That's all it is, and there's no real excuse.
You want to laugh, google search "Dr Housing Bubble's Real Homes of Genius".

-------

The Kona.....

...is nice, in a way. Bicycles are a lot more useful when you can easily carry things on them besides yourself. The one frame size stinks however, and $800 is a lot of money. And it appears they are still using a left-side leaner kickstand, instead of a proper rear-mounted dual kickstand (which makes loading bikes with panniers MUCH easier).
~

Last edited by Doug5150; 08-26-07 at 04:54 PM.
Doug5150 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-07, 06:38 PM   #17
Dahon.Steve
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: New Jersey
Bikes:
Posts: 6,845
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug5150 View Post
The mortgage crisis was caused by lots of people signing their names for loans that they simply could not pay for over the long run.
That's all it is, and there's no real excuse.
You want to laugh, google search "Dr Housing Bubble's Real Homes of Genius".

~
What gets me is they lost her father's home for overpriced cars. A sad situation indeed.
Dahon.Steve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-07, 11:30 PM   #18
KnhoJ
Mister Goody Two Shoes
 
KnhoJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 417
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallwheels View Post
Why doesn't it have a rear brake? With it loaded with plenty of cargo a rear brake would be very useful, even on wet pavement. No rear brake is listed on their web site.

It needs a rear fender too.
The photo shows three cables headed back thataway... Maybe the brake got airbrushed out along with the background?

Looks kinda short in the wheelbase department, though...

Alright, according to completely unscientific measurements referenced against the wheels and seat tube, that looks like a 46-49 inch wheelbase or so. IOW, a little bmx frame with a super-stretched rear triangle and 26 inch wheels. Just barely longer than my ancient unstretched Schwinn Sierra, and that bike's too small for me. Oh well, I could be wrong though. I do like the integrated rack.

It gets better: According to an update on Bikehugger, they won't be making it compatible with xtracycle stuff. No longbike style accessories until Kona gets around to making their own proprietary goodies. So for now, it's an $800 longbike that's sized for kids, with a giant rear rack you'll have to rig up with something homemade to use. But on the bright side, you'll have the only longbike in town that fits on the bus racks.
KnhoJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-07, 11:47 PM   #19
Robert C
Senior Member
 
Robert C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Salt lake, UT
Bikes: This list got too long: several ‘bents, an urban utility e-bike, and a dahon D7 that my daughter has absconded with.
Posts: 1,631
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
From the Bike hugger story you referenced. It seems that the bike will use 700c wheels. No matter what, the frame looks bigger than a BMX frame. However, I will wait until I start seeing pictures of it, the production model, and with something else in the picture.

In other pictures I have seen, the bike clearly had a brake on the seatstay.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bike Hugger website
  • 700c wheels & tires
  • longer head tube for better handlebar position
  • lower top tube to increase standover/clearance
  • change of specification on stem, grips and saddle (aesthetics)
  • rear plastic deck on the rear is machined from 100% post consumer recycled material
  • Ships standard with two specifically designed, grocery-style pannier bags that include a raincover. Four bags capacity with with additional bags and accessories offered.
  • MSRP is $799, explaining some of the spec decisions (rear V-brake, no internal hub, etc.).
  • Xtracycle compatibility — ” … the design concept was to make a complete bike that is economical, comfortable, light & offers a cargo area/options. Although we considered making the bike compatible with Xtracycle bags, this compromised the other design objectives. Xtracycle is a wonderful concept, but to accommodate their accessories, we would have added to the weight, complexity and expense of the model. We are definitely considering a variety of accessories & bags that will become available for the bike.”
  • Wheels — Kona tested this bike with both 26” and 700c wheels and 700cc was preferred
  • Foot Rests — Kona is considering and will keep us posted
Here, this is from the Kona website.

Frame Size: 17.5"
Head Angle: 71 degrees
Seat Angle 74 degrees
Top Tube 23"
Chain Stay 24.6"
Head Tube 4.3"
BB Height 12"
Standover 29.3"


Please understand that I am interested in this hike primarily because this one of the first bikes that I have shown a picture of to my wife that resulted in a highly positive reaction. There as no where that reaction from the extra-cycle kit.

As far as size goes, I am concerned that it may be too big.

Last edited by Robert C; 08-28-07 at 12:10 AM.
Robert C is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-07, 03:40 AM   #20
Doug5150
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: IL-USA
Bikes:
Posts: 1,661
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dahon.Steve View Post
What gets me is they lost her father's home for overpriced cars. A sad situation indeed.
Yes,,,, -but the car bit is really a minor detail.

Lots of people have overextended themselves. Losing your home over a luxury car is a silly thing, but it's just one silly thing, and there's a whole lot of them.

Trying to tack the subprime mess to "car ownership" is simply false. We're going to get a lot more of these sob-stories over the next 12 months, and most of them will have nothing to do with cars. The great majority of them will have something to do with someone taking out more loan than they could pay off with their incomes. (-their actual incomes, not the one they stated on the application-)
~
Doug5150 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-07, 08:33 AM   #21
cerewa
put our Heads Together
 
cerewa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: southeast pennsylvania
Bikes: a mountain bike with a cargo box on the back and aero bars on the front. an old well-worn dahon folding bike
Posts: 3,155
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug5150
The great majority of them will have something to do with someone taking out more loan than they could pay off with their incomes. (-their actual incomes, not the one they stated on the application-)
It certainly does seem that people who default on a home loan are likely to have bought a home that was too large/high-priced for them. Excessively large homes are just like cars in that they usually have a high initial cost, they consume lots of petroleum energy ($$) to be usable, and you pay a lot to repair them too. Of course, even a small apartment requires huge amounts of energy to be kept within the 65-85 degree temperature range at all times.
cerewa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-07, 09:09 AM   #22
cosmo starr
Senior Member
 
cosmo starr's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Dallas
Bikes:
Posts: 498
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
id go with a "big dummy" i think id like the freeloaders better
cosmo starr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-07, 10:11 AM   #23
bmike
Bye Bye
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Gone gone gone
Bikes:
Posts: 3,677
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cerewa View Post
It certainly does seem that people who default on a home loan are likely to have bought a home that was too large/high-priced for them. Excessively large homes are just like cars in that they usually have a high initial cost, they consume lots of petroleum energy ($$) to be usable, and you pay a lot to repair them too. Of course, even a small apartment requires huge amounts of energy to be kept within the 65-85 degree temperature range at all times.
yes...
and from my experience in another line of work i just kept seeing houses getting pricier and pricier - and the value wasn't really there. in 5 years we've seen an explosion of housing costs - in both new and old stock - so much so that average folks like me and my wife had to work really hard to find something reasonable.

when easy credit fuels a market people who make sensible choices can get shut out because of the frenzy brought on by easy money and the people seeking profits from it. i really wish we had waited a year - there are some really nice places (small, functional, well built, attractive and closer to downtown) that are starting to come back to earth in price. instead we are renovating a POS crafted townhouse (and making it far better than it ever was) that we paid too much for in a really tight market. we didn't have much choice and made the best decision we could...
__________________
So long. Been nice knowing you BF.... to all the friends I've made here and in real life... its been great. But this place needs an enema.
bmike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-07, 11:12 AM   #24
jeff-o
Recumbent Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Bikes: Rebel Cycles Trike, Trek 7500FX
Posts: 2,991
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Sweet bike! Needs an extra wheel though.
jeff-o is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-07, 01:15 PM   #25
fat_bike_nut
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: San Francisco!
Bikes: 2010 Surly LHT (main rider and do-everything bike), 2011 Bike Friday NWT (back-up bike and multi-modal)
Posts: 909
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Hmm, one frame size only? I guess I'll stick to just slapping an Xtracycle over a bike sized for me instead, then.
fat_bike_nut is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:48 PM.