Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Living Car Free Do you live car free or car light? Do you prefer to use alternative transportation (bicycles, walking, other human-powered or public transportation) for everyday activities whenever possible? Discuss your lifestyle here.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-25-12, 05:58 AM   #26
JonathanGennick 
Senior Member
 
JonathanGennick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Munising, Michigan, USA
Bikes: Gary Fisher Hodgepodge 26er Rigid
Posts: 2,500
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
This comment at the very end of the article is pertinent: "Car ownership has indeed become a ball and chain." It is true! We have built a society in which maintaining an automobile is crucial to one's ability to live and be productive. This puts a tremendous burden (and stigma too!) upon the very people the article mentions: those having lower incomes and needing assistance.
JonathanGennick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-12, 06:01 AM   #27
Ridefreemc 
Senior Member
 
Ridefreemc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Western Florida
Bikes: 2015 Bike Friday New World Tourist, 2013 Velo Orange Campeur, 2011 Mezzo D9 (x3), 2004 Marin Mount Vision Pro, 2014 Xtracycle Electric, 2014 Surly Big Dummy electric assist
Posts: 1,334
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
During a public hearing last night the local elected body was chastised for trying to improve a small downtown. They were told that making the area bike and pedestrian friendly would take away this guys ability to drive a car - therefore removing a choice for him.
__________________
On the move!
2015 Bike Friday New World Tourist, 2013 Velo Orange Campeur, 2011 Mezzo D9 (x3), 2004 Marin Mount Vision Pro, 2014 Xtracycle Electric, 2014 Surly Big Dummy electric assist

Last edited by Ridefreemc; 04-25-12 at 08:45 PM.
Ridefreemc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-12, 06:03 AM   #28
Ridefreemc 
Senior Member
 
Ridefreemc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Western Florida
Bikes: 2015 Bike Friday New World Tourist, 2013 Velo Orange Campeur, 2011 Mezzo D9 (x3), 2004 Marin Mount Vision Pro, 2014 Xtracycle Electric, 2014 Surly Big Dummy electric assist
Posts: 1,334
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dynodonn View Post
Locally, getting around by auto is the fastest and easiest form of transportation, and anyone walking, riding a bike or using mass transit as a main means of transportation, is either consider an environmentalist, poor, or a loon.
Or considered to have a DUI (or DWI depending on your state).
__________________
On the move!
2015 Bike Friday New World Tourist, 2013 Velo Orange Campeur, 2011 Mezzo D9 (x3), 2004 Marin Mount Vision Pro, 2014 Xtracycle Electric, 2014 Surly Big Dummy electric assist
Ridefreemc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-12, 06:10 AM   #29
Ridefreemc 
Senior Member
 
Ridefreemc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Western Florida
Bikes: 2015 Bike Friday New World Tourist, 2013 Velo Orange Campeur, 2011 Mezzo D9 (x3), 2004 Marin Mount Vision Pro, 2014 Xtracycle Electric, 2014 Surly Big Dummy electric assist
Posts: 1,334
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roody View Post
I wonder if most people are aware of how much their cars are subsidized by the government.

Especially I wonder if Margaret Thatcher's political heirs (like the Tea Party folks) know that their taxes are higher to pay for cars. How do they support this fact within their philosophy of cutting all taxes--even when it means cutting services to the poor, the elderly, children, and other vulnerable people. Is there an element of hypocrisy here, or are they just unaware of these expensive car subsidies?
If you or anyone else runs across that statistic I would be very interested to see it.
__________________
On the move!
2015 Bike Friday New World Tourist, 2013 Velo Orange Campeur, 2011 Mezzo D9 (x3), 2004 Marin Mount Vision Pro, 2014 Xtracycle Electric, 2014 Surly Big Dummy electric assist
Ridefreemc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-12, 07:31 AM   #30
mustang1
Senior Member
 
mustang1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: London, UK
Bikes: 2006 road bike, 2012 cx bike, 2012 carbon rb, 2014 hardtail
Posts: 2,714
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
that's from the book Carjacked.

Anyway, its a sexist quote. it should be any "person" and they have the age wrong: it should be 25. I cycle more miles than I drive but can't be without my cars.

Regardless whether you have a car or not, or what your age is, I see that quote more as an inspiration to do better, even if I choose not to pursue car ownership.
mustang1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-12, 09:16 AM   #31
Ridefreemc 
Senior Member
 
Ridefreemc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Western Florida
Bikes: 2015 Bike Friday New World Tourist, 2013 Velo Orange Campeur, 2011 Mezzo D9 (x3), 2004 Marin Mount Vision Pro, 2014 Xtracycle Electric, 2014 Surly Big Dummy electric assist
Posts: 1,334
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ridefreemc View Post
If you or anyone else runs across that statistic I would be very interested to see it.
I think I answered my own question.

This article doesn't support much of our statements, but I do not think it is accurate. What it does not include are the subsidies given to oil/gas companies and the auto industry for example and it does not discuss the actual subsidies:

http://www.newgeography.com/content/...hways-a-primer

Here is a good statement to remember when discussing these things though:

"There is a simple way to tell the difference between subsidies and user payments. With subsidies you pay whether or not you use the service. In contrast, with user fees, you donít pay if you donít use. People who donít use electricity from the Los Angeles Department of Water and Power donít pay and people who donít use the highways donít pay either."

___
This article is more in-line with what we hear on this forum (and likely more accurate):

http://t4america.org/blog/2009/12/11...ly-subsidized/

Good quote there:

"Of the 18.4 cent federal gasoline tax, 2.86 cents Ė about 15 percent Ė is directed toward mass transit projects, and an additional 0.1 cent toward environmental clean-up, according to the report. That leaves more than 80 percent strictly for highways. Even if we spent 100 percent of gas tax revenues on highways, only 65 percent of their total cost would be covered. There would still be a need for significant outside revenue Ė in other words, subsidies. Does that mean highways are ďgovernment waste?Ē Or are transportation dollars an investment to provide access to jobs and movement of goods?"

___
Here is a good related article/study that will help you justify your ditching of the auto for personal reasons:

http://www.1000fof.org/PUBS/lanes/1000ene6.pdf

Or try this quote:

"Highway construction. Itís estimated that
the costs of highway construction, improvement
and repair totaled $33.3 billion in 1989
(MacKenzie, Dower & Chen 1992.) About 60
percent of these costs were paid directly by drivers
in the form of gas taxes, tolls and other user fees.
The remaining 40 percent, or $13 billion, was
subsidized ó predominantly from state and local
government property and sales taxes."

___
Another:

http://www.assmotax.org/Releases/AMC...%20Subsidy.php

And this:

"To what extent is automobile use a "free" good? According to Hart and Spivak, government subsidies for highways and parking alone amount to between 8 and 10 percent of our gross national product, the equivalent of a fuel tax of approximately $3.50 per gallon. If this tax were to account for "soft" costs such as pollution cleanup and emergency medical treatment, it would he as high as $9.00 per galion. The cost of these subsidies-approximately $5,000 per car per year-is passed directly on to the American citizen in the form of increased prices for products or, more often, as income, property, and sales taxes. This means that the hidden costs of driving are paid by everyone: not just drivers, but also those too old or too poor to drive a car. And these people suffer doubly, as the very transit systems they count on for mobility have gone out of business, unable to compete with the heavily subsidized highways.1 "
__________________
On the move!
2015 Bike Friday New World Tourist, 2013 Velo Orange Campeur, 2011 Mezzo D9 (x3), 2004 Marin Mount Vision Pro, 2014 Xtracycle Electric, 2014 Surly Big Dummy electric assist

Last edited by Ridefreemc; 04-25-12 at 09:21 AM.
Ridefreemc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-12, 02:09 PM   #32
kookaburra1701
Senior Member
 
kookaburra1701's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Eugene, Oregon
Bikes: 2014 Specialized Dolce Triple, 1987 Schwinn Tempo, 2012 Windsor Kensington 8
Posts: 1,345
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'd better let the nonagenarian I see cycling around town with his WWII vet hat on his head and his walker strapped to his back rack know that he's a failure at life.
kookaburra1701 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-12, 02:42 PM   #33
shado
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Bikes:
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
It isn't clear Mrs. Thatcher ever said it: http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question...0080112AAery9r

I have been able to find no speech of hers that has this in it, including in the searchable database of Margaret Thatcher foundation - which has speeches made in Commons in the sixties, so, I daresay they're reasonably complete.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dahon.Steve View Post
Good article. Thanks for posting.

I didn't know Margaret Thathcher said that remark about people over thirty not having cars. LOL! I was a little over thirty when becoming car free and never regretted that decision. I watched a film by her just yesterday with Merrill Streep playing her role. You have to understand that Thathcher was a conservative who did not care much for public transit.

You also have to understand that Ms Thathcher was from a generation where motor transport was cheap. Not anymore. Quite frankly, people who are really "Losing" are those who are spending 20 percent or more on motor transport.
shado is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-12, 09:25 AM   #34
daibutsu
Banned.
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: DC area
Bikes: Marin San Anselmo, old Mountain Bike, real old schwinn road bike, and Birdy folder
Posts: 99
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Back to the OP.... Around here, in DC, that's what the cabbies mostly believe: Worse yet you're a bigger loser if on a bike. They somehow can't comprehend that maybe we bike for exercise and because we can afford a car. Rather than renting a cab for the day, and making time by endangering pedestrians and cyclists....
daibutsu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-12, 06:50 PM   #35
Roody
Sophomoric Member
 
Roody's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Dancing in Lansing
Bikes:
Posts: 23,532
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 126 Post(s)
I don't know about Thatcher, but I'd love to ask Romney or Gingrich what he thinks about people on bikes.
__________________

"Think Outside the Cage"
Roody is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-12, 08:56 PM   #36
Mobile 155
Senior Member
 
Mobile 155's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: So Cal
Bikes: 72-76 Peugeot, 89 Klein Quantum Road Bike,2011 CF Specialized Tarmac road bike. 2013 Haro FL Comp 29er MTB.
Posts: 3,700
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 236 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roody View Post
I don't know about Thatcher, but I'd love to ask Romney or Gingrich what he thinks about people on bikes.
I only know of one president in the last 10 or 15 years that cycled themselves. http://www.cleveland.com/nation/inde...ured_vete.html

I couldn't help myself, you threw the pitch I had to take a swing.
Mobile 155 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-12, 09:21 PM   #37
bjjoondo 
Old, SLOW bike rider! ;)
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Colorado Springs, CO.
Bikes: 1993 Mongoose Switchback MTB
Posts: 1,856
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Well I guess both my wife and I are "losers", La, La, La, what's new??? Were working poor, ride the bus or bicycle and we really feel our lives are now, MUCH BETTER, than before when we struggled every month to pay a car payment, insurance, maintenance, ownership taxes, lic. plates, etc. We now go to a movie or out to dinner "once a week" and actually help the economy, instead of living like a hermit in a cage!!! To each his own. JMHO, YMMV.
__________________
Take care, RIDE SAFE, have FUN!
B.J. Ondo
1993 Mongoose Switchback Ridged MTB, converted to a "Rail Trail Bike"! :)
bjjoondo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-12, 03:20 PM   #38
Keith99
Senior Member
 
Keith99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 5,866
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I think this varies a lot depending on the bus 'service' available.

Where I am, in the suburbs of Los Angeles 90% of the time buses are for losers or idealists. And often the idealists fade out rather quickly.

When the bus schedule sucks few choose to ride the bus. (At least near me they at least seem save and clean).
Keith99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-12, 03:20 PM   #39
Mobile 155
Senior Member
 
Mobile 155's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: So Cal
Bikes: 72-76 Peugeot, 89 Klein Quantum Road Bike,2011 CF Specialized Tarmac road bike. 2013 Haro FL Comp 29er MTB.
Posts: 3,700
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 236 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjjoondo View Post
Well I guess both my wife and I are "losers", La, La, La, what's new??? Were working poor, ride the bus or bicycle and we really feel our lives are now, MUCH BETTER, than before when we struggled every month to pay a car payment, insurance, maintenance, ownership taxes, lic. plates, etc. We now go to a movie or out to dinner "once a week" and actually help the economy, instead of living like a hermit in a cage!!! To each his own. JMHO, YMMV.

While you have a very valid point the government tends to base COLA on Housing and the Automotive industry. When those two tanked so did the economy. Technology purchases are a big part of it as well because when Apple to a little hit last week the stock market was very timid. But still you are right people can move their expenses from cars to something else and it could help the economy.
Mobile 155 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-12, 06:57 PM   #40
Artkansas 
Pedaled too far.
 
Artkansas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: La Petite Roche
Bikes:
Posts: 12,858
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mobile 155 View Post
I only know of one president in the last 10 or 15 years that cycled themselves.
__________________
"He who serves all, best serves himself" Jack London

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bjforrestal View Post
I don't care if you are on a unicycle, as long as you're not using a motor to get places you get props from me. We're here to support each other. Share ideas, and motivate one another to actually keep doing it.
Artkansas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-12, 09:21 PM   #41
gerv 
In the right lane
 
gerv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Des Moines
Bikes: 1974 Huffy 3 speed
Posts: 9,534
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
I think Obama needs a bike fit.
gerv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-12, 04:12 AM   #42
cycleobsidian
cycleobsidian
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Southwestern Ontario
Bikes:
Posts: 441
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjjoondo View Post
Well I guess both my wife and I are "losers", La, La, La, what's new??? Were working poor, ride the bus or bicycle and we really feel our lives are now, MUCH BETTER, than before when we struggled every month to pay a car payment, insurance, maintenance, ownership taxes, lic. plates, etc. We now go to a movie or out to dinner "once a week" and actually help the economy, instead of living like a hermit in a cage!!! To each his own. JMHO, YMMV.
like button.
cycleobsidian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-12, 08:22 AM   #43
DX-MAN
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Bikes:
Posts: 4,789
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I guess I can count myself a success now, since I haven't been on the bus in a year. Bought some studded MTB tires to handle the snow/ice of winter, so my last 'need' for the bus is gone.....

Or not; because I have no hesitation to taking the bus somewhere, for some reason, should I feel it necessary. I just prefer to ride, and keep the bus fare in my pocket. There isn't a destination the local bus system can reach that I can't on the bike.

Guess I've chosen to be a sometimes loser, eh? Regardless of who said that idiotic statement (sounds like it may have come from my mother!), anyone over 30 who's MAKING A LIVING is not a loser.
DX-MAN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-12, 09:44 PM   #44
bragi
bragi
 
bragi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: seattle, WA
Bikes: LHT
Posts: 2,911
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by doc0c View Post
Fiscal conservatives are in favor of tax cuts in order to accomplish a couple of things:
1. reduce the size and scope of government
2. increase personal wealth
I'll assume you can form a thought and arrive at further conclusions from those two points.

Such folks never claimed to not care about the people who are truly in need of help.
Such folks also realize that they will have to sacrifice a lot of things through this process as well.
I know because I'm of the same mindset.

Lastly, there is no way achieve these goals in the near future.
Many people who call themselves fiscal conservatives are no such thing. They may want to reduce the size of government for ideological reasons, but balancing the books doesn't really figure into it. What I'm seeing is a situation where right-wing (fascist?) ideologues get themselves elected, cut taxes, especially for the wealthy, drive the government into debt, and then, then, citing the fiscal emergency that they themselves created, slash the budgets of parks and rec, education, libraries, environmental protection, public transit, and sometimes even road infrastructure. The tragic thing is that this kind of demagoguery hurts pretty much everyone across the entire socioeconomic spectrum. It especially hurts the middle class: in my state of Washington, tuition at public universities has increase 32% in two years because state support for these schools has decreased because of budget shortfalls. In the long run, this will even hurt the wealthy. I ask you: would you rather be a rich person in Germany, where taxes are high, or in Guatemala, where taxes are miniscule and the government about small enough to almost please Grover Norquist?

It should be obvious to anyone who can form a thought that government performs services that no other institution can provide, vital services that make this society tolerable to everyone, including the rich. Personally, I'm willing to pay my fair share, even if that means I'll have to forgo that new LHT with disk brakes that I've had my eye on...

Last edited by bragi; 05-09-12 at 09:53 PM.
bragi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-12, 12:14 PM   #45
Anewbike
I run A New Bike
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Boise, ID
Bikes: Peugot fixed gear, old BMX
Posts: 54
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I know this is probably just me, but I feel stealthy riding a bus, like James Bond or something. The buses are running at the same schedule if I get on them or not, so I feel like I can hop on and get to another destination without anyone knowing. Adds some spice to getting groceries.
Anewbike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-12, 05:49 PM   #46
Roody
Sophomoric Member
 
Roody's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Dancing in Lansing
Bikes:
Posts: 23,532
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 126 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anewbike View Post
I know this is probably just me, but I feel stealthy riding a bus, like James Bond or something. The buses are running at the same schedule if I get on them or not, so I feel like I can hop on and get to another destination without anyone knowing. Adds some spice to getting groceries.
Interesting--I feel the opposite, I think. I feel very public on a bike. Friends often say something like, I saw you riding over on the west side the other day. looked like you bought some toilet tissue at Meijer's....They would never know that if I was in a car or even the bus.
__________________

"Think Outside the Cage"
Roody is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-12, 08:43 PM   #47
gerv 
In the right lane
 
gerv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Des Moines
Bikes: 1974 Huffy 3 speed
Posts: 9,534
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roody View Post
Interesting--I feel the opposite, I think. I feel very public on a bike. Friends often say something like, I saw you riding over on the west side the other day. looked like you bought some toilet tissue at Meijer's....They would never know that if I was in a car or even the bus.
Yeah there's nothing worse than people commenting on your brand of TP. I usually shop with a trailer and can get the tp under cover....
gerv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-12, 05:15 AM   #48
wahoonc
Senior Member
 
wahoonc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: On the road-USA
Bikes: Giant Excursion, Raleigh Sports, Raleigh R.S.W. Compact, Motobecane? and about 20 more! OMG
Posts: 16,687
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Mine sits up on top of the rack...but we buy in bulk But then again when I ride my bike to the grocery store it is very obvious, there are a grand total of two of us that ride bikes to the grocery store.

Aaron
__________________
Webshots is bailing out, if you find any of my posts with corrupt picture files and want to see them corrected please let me know. :(

ISO: A late 1980's Giant Iguana MTB frameset (or complete bike) 23" Red with yellow graphics.

"Cycling should be a way of life, not a hobby.
RIDE, YOU FOOL, RIDE!"
_Nicodemus

"Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
Aluminum: barely a hundred
Which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?"
_krazygluon
wahoonc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-12, 09:20 AM   #49
unterhausen
Randomhead
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Happy Valley, Pennsylvania
Bikes:
Posts: 14,588
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
our buses around here are really nice, quiet and comfortable. I'm really a little surprised that more people don't ride them because it's cheaper than the gas required to drive a car, even my Prius. If you had the same schedule every day, I don't see the downside.
unterhausen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-12, 11:51 AM   #50
ubringliten
Senior Member
 
ubringliten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Oakland, CA
Bikes: 2010 Wabi Lightning, 2014 Brompton S2L-X
Posts: 213
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bragi View Post
Many people who call themselves fiscal conservatives are no such thing. They may want to reduce the size of government for ideological reasons, but balancing the books doesn't really figure into it. What I'm seeing is a situation where right-wing (fascist?) ideologues get themselves elected, cut taxes, especially for the wealthy, drive the government into debt, and then, then, citing the fiscal emergency that they themselves created, slash the budgets of parks and rec, education, libraries, environmental protection, public transit, and sometimes even road infrastructure. The tragic thing is that this kind of demagoguery hurts pretty much everyone across the entire socioeconomic spectrum. It especially hurts the middle class: in my state of Washington, tuition at public universities has increase 32% in two years because state support for these schools has decreased because of budget shortfalls. In the long run, this will even hurt the wealthy. I ask you: would you rather be a rich person in Germany, where taxes are high, or in Guatemala, where taxes are miniscule and the government about small enough to almost please Grover Norquist?

It should be obvious to anyone who can form a thought that government performs services that no other institution can provide, vital services that make this society tolerable to everyone, including the rich. Personally, I'm willing to pay my fair share, even if that means I'll have to forgo that new LHT with disk brakes that I've had my eye on...
Excellent post. This is exactly how I feel about politics.

Anyhow, I love riding public transit. It' fun and I get to see all kinds of characters. People watching is one of my favorites when I go to a park or eat at an outside cafe. I even think that people by nature like to be around other people and why public squares, public parks, public transit, etc. exist. I have a car and I drive it about once or twice every month to get outside the city but man, I hate the journey. The stimuli deprivation. No wonder motorists are called "cagers".
ubringliten is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:13 AM.