Doohickie

Move.

I live in the suburban sprawl.

chipcom 

not really...not only have I seen some pretty close-knit urban neighborhoods, that anonymity trend seems to have spread into communities of all sizes over the last 30 years or so.

Artkansas 

From what I've seen, TV tends to sensationalize crime and leads people to think that crime is going up even when it is going down. The distortion is not best seen from a single broadcast, but from the constant flow that's based upon the need to get ratings rather than any need to be objective. I wouldn't presume to suggest something ridiculous like they not cover a child abduction because they met their quota for child abductions for the year, but rather, you need to balance TV news with other sources, which can even be your own eyes and ears listening to your neighborhood or what your neighbors have to say.

Of course. How could I have been so silly to think of it as any other way. Mothers helping children, people helping strangers, groups of people cooperating to build things that no one could build by themselves.

Roody

A child is probably a million times more likely to get hit by a car while getting a popsicle than to be attacked by a crazed molester. If you knew anything about the psychology of risk assessment, you would know that people almost always get it wrong. And the more TV news they watch, the more inaccurate their perceptions of risk.

B. Carfree

I grew up in the East Bay near Oakland. The popsicle index was 100%. My son spent several years (age nine to fifteen) in a town of several hundred. The popsicle index for his community was 0%. That doesn't prove you wrong, it's just that my experience is the opposite of yours.

I would say the most important factor in determining the popsicle index is likely to be the perceived likelihood of kids being run down as they move about. Sadly, since we decriminalized traffic violations in the '70s, the perception of safety on and along our roadways seems to have diminished, in spite of the fact that technological improvements in motor vehicles has resulted in fewer deaths over time.

Perhaps part of the reduction in highway deaths has to do with people who would walk/ride being terrorized out of it and therefore not being in the line of fire. I listened to a traffic engineer from Portland, OR last night who thought that when only 2% of the cars are running the red lights and driving in the bike lanes things were going well. Would any sane parent put their child in front of cars with those odds? No wonder our kids are obese and strokes among those under 55 are rising at obscene rates (up 65% in 12 years).

bragi

Where I live, it's probably about 50%. It's not actually a dangerous neighborhood, but it's not really kid-friendly, either. Where I work, it's definitely 100%. Parents let their kids wander freely, and if I were a parent there, I would, too. It's a safe urban neighborhood full of upper-middle class people who will not hesitate to take care of a neighbor's kid when necessary.

wahoonc

Ours would be about a -25 score. Narrow roads, no shoulders traffic routinely speeds 10mph+ above the posted speed limit, no cross walks, side walks or any pedestrian access to anything. Does it stop people from walking? No, but that is why we have the second or third most deadly road in the county for pedestrians.

What would it take to fix it? A complete shift in the thinking of the politicians, DOT, and the people that have the most influence. There is a country club near the end of the road, and every time anyone suggests making the area less car centric they are the first to fight it from behind their gates.

Aaron

gerv 

Where I live is about 2 short city blocks from a community strip mall. There's a haircut places, tanning salon, nice coffee shop, baker, couple bars, two or so restaurants, a violin shop... so not sure where you could buy a popsicle.

The main drag is a 25mph 4 lane (which is detested throughout the metro for its police activity) + there are all kinds of ultra quiet side streets.

However, thanks to Hans Rosling, I also notice there aren't many kids in the area. You may notice that all the retail shops are kind of yuppified. A lot of retired people.

I'm guessing most of the young population are living out of town in suburbs where I know they would likely be driven to the popsicle shop.

chewybrian 

That was a great presentation. It gives you some idea how misleading statistics can be, especially when the person presenting them to you has an agenda (I don't mean him, I mean people with a political or economic interest in your perception of the statistics). It's too easy to make the data 'show' what you want to be seen. It's just too bad more of us are not smarter than the chimps...

gerv 

Yes... it's is a classic. Great to see a demonstration that can turn popular opinion on a dime. We all believe the world is overpopulated, but what we miss is that the world is actually depopulating while our demand on resources escalates.

It's convenient to blame the starving, but fertile, masses. However, the real problem points the figure squarely back at ourselves and our squandrous use of oil, land, water, air, etc.

Even more reason to make sure popsicles are available within walking distance.

myrridin

And if you knew anything about (well just about anything,,,) you'd realize that the reality of the risk is irrelevant to your index. Risks abound and any parent who feels such things are safe is deluding themselves. Doesn't mean that they shouldn't curtail their natural tendencies and allow their children to experience that risk and learn to become adults...

myrridin

Stalinist purge of millions
NAZI holocaust
Pol Pot's genocide
Rwandan genocide
Bosnian genocide
The need for the word genocide...
Serial killers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ers_by_country)
Sex trade (sex slaves, etc...)
Slavery - "The number of slaves today remains as high as 12 million[SUP][1][/SUP] to 27 million,[SUP][2][/SUP][SUP][3][/SUP][SUP][4][/SUP] the highest number in human history", https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contemporary_slavery
Murder - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._homicide_rate

The list of human depravity could go on.

Artkansas 

As can the list of human compassion and love.

And in every case you cited, the number of people doing bad is fewer than the people not doing bad. And the behaviours are spurred on by just a tiny (well-armed) sliver of humanity. Human nature is a mixed bag.

myrridin

Human compassion is far from unlimited, particularly passionate for those considered 'others'.

And no, sorry, but those that stood by the side and allowed those crimes (which covers most/all of the population) are as guilty as the ones who perpetrate the evil directly. On a more specific case, consider some of the recent cases of assault where one or two individuals assault another person while a crowd of individuals watch (and video record) the attack. Are the observers any less guilty than those who commit the crime? In my opinion the answer is no. With experience comes the realization that those we think of as good have simply not been placed in a situation where the wrong choice is convenient... or that we don't know they have...

I am not saying that all people commit evil all the time. I am saying that all people commit bad acts at least ocassionally. People considered good, either do so less often (or more likely) don't get caught at them...

chewybrian 

You make it too simple. What would you suggest the average citizen in the U.S. or France or Australia should have done about any of these events? Knowing that evil acts were occuring in these places did not mean there was an easy solution.

Was Joe Lunchbox working at some factory in Indianna supposed to do something about Stalin? My grandfather was not a Soviet spy, and in my book, shares exactly none of the blame, any more than you are to blame for events in Syria, etc.

Roody

But when it comes to raising the Popsicle Index, there are some things that average people can do without too much inconvenience. For example,

• simply look out your window frequently when you're at home, and call the police if you see suspicious activit.
• Try to communicate with your neighbors and foster a feeling of community solidarity.
• Get invlved with city planning to make streets and neighborhoods safer for cyclists, walkers and children.
• Shop at local businesses and help them to thrive.

There are probably a lot of other things we could do--maybe others will think of some also.

Roody

If people did more of the simple proactive things I mentioned above, it really wouldn't matter so much if they are good or evil at heart. It's really more a question of whether enough people in a given society do barely enough good things to improve the local quality of life. The simple steps I mentioned won't fight off a dictator once he's in power, but they might prevent the dictator from gaining power in the first place. People who trust society enough to send their kid out for a popsicle probably aren't going to support dictators and extremists.

mr geeker

i wold not let a kid walk from my place to the closest ice cream shop. not because of the neighbor hood, but because they would have to cross multiple extremely busy streets. streets so busy they only slow down way after the ice cream place is closed for the day.

myrridin

To not be evil and equally responsible, all they had to do was something, anything--something as simple as standing up to be counted and saying this is wrong. Success at stopping the acts is not required. But silently allowing those acts is evil.

davidmcowan

A very good question, I'd imagine given Westminster's recent tragedy the popsicle index here has changed dramatically in the past week. I spend a great deal of time thinking about this very thing and something I've been doing in my neighborhood (outside of advocating for safer streets) is the idea of building a "playborhood" (https://playborhood.com/) that addresses the anonymity and works to build a community where people sit on their front porches, know and play with their neighbors while looking out for one and other by building a community through easily available opportunities to play.

KlibanQat

The popsicle index here in a wealthy California suburb would be low just due to the lack of corner shops. The neighborhoods are laid out beautifully, there's so many postage-stamp-sized parks that kids can pick and choose what one they like, but the west side of the neighborhoods abuts a commercial zone and the east side does not--up to 30 minutes at an adult's walking pace just to get to a store and this is in a densely populated area. Bikes would extend the index and this area is wealthy enough for the kids to have their own wheels. In Ireland it would have been higher (kids roam with feral freedom but rarely have their own wheels, the damp climate rusts toys so they don't last) and in Sweden higher yet (any child old enough to dress itself for winter has a bicycle, and they plow the cycle roads).