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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ekdog View Post
    Why do you think they oppose it?
    The isthmus is narrow and they do not want any less space for cars.

  2. #27
    Senior Member Astrozombie's Avatar
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    It'd be great if they extended a line to Santa Monica/Venice and then you pretty much have it all covered. But man those Red and Purple lines need new cars....or at least a power wash/air freshener.

    Let's get a high speed rail to SF too
    Assume nothing; Question everything

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Machka View Post
    Wow! I think I'd be asking about a flexible schedule to work longer hours 4 days a week so I wouldn't have to spend so much time and money on a commute.
    Actually, I could reduce the cost of my public transit to about $100.00 dollars a month. However, the extra 75 dollars allows me to have a seat each day using the more costly express bus. As I said before, the cost is not important in public transit since I'm carfree and what is important is ability to sit down! I have a pretty quick commute into the city at 1 hour 10 minutes. Everyone I know who is commuting into Manhattan takes that much time or longer.

    I've been doing this commute for 20 years. You get used to it.

  4. #29
    Senior Member duckbill's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Machka;16452625]Tell us about the public transportation options in your area. What do you like about it? What could be improved?]

    I feel a little spoiled. When I'm not cycling, two buses with little or no waiting at the transfer station, takes me door to door in about 45 minutes. The bus stop is at the foot of my driveway. What could be improved? The price perhaps, $3.00 each way, $6.00 per day.

  5. #30
    Prefers Cicero cooker's Avatar
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    I live 1.2 km west of a subway station on a line that runs north/south. My office is 8 km south of me and 3 km west of the subway, so it is a three-leg commute.

    I can walk to the station, or walk about half the distance and catch a bus into the station.

    I then take the subway either 8 or 9 stops south. It's crowded and I have to stand the whole way.

    If I go 9 subway stops, I then take a 20 minute streetcar ride across downtown right to my office. It's crowded and slow and I have to fight my way on to it and stand for half the route.

    If I go 8 subway stops, I can take a less crowded, slightly faster streetcar, that misses my office by a few blocks so I then walk down to my office on the cross-street about 600m.

    Alternatively, I can take the bus near my house in the westward direction, away from the subway, and take another bus south. It's slower than the subway, but I always get a seat and it's above ground so I can browse the internet or get a start on the day's emails. There's still a short east west section (5-10 minutes on a streetcar or 800 m walking) at the bottom.

    Either way the trip take 60-75 minutes.

    There's also a middle route that would be preferred, but it is currently blocked by a massive construction project tying up trafficroutes.jpg.

    I'm a big fan of our public transit system, but since my office moved to it's current location, it's just too far and complicated to commute like this. I so wish the ice and cold would abate and I could get back on my bike. I do not ride on ice.
    Last edited by cooker; 02-04-14 at 08:08 PM.

  6. #31
    babylon by bike Standalone's Avatar
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    New Haven's main train station, Union Station is 3.5 miles from us. I could catch a train there twice an hour to a train station 1.5 miles from my job. Made for a nice 10 mile/day bicycle commute. Round trip to work w/o train is 32 flattish miles.

    Just opened on the same line is a brand new station half a mile from our home! Commuting is incredibly convenient now. Riding in this morning's snow was no big deal!



    We can also hop on this and be in NYC in no time flat. Within walking distance! My wife works in uptown Manhattan, not conveniently reached by train. I'm working on her a bit to try a train ride in now and then.
    Last edited by Standalone; 02-04-14 at 07:45 PM.
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  7. #32
    In the right lane gerv's Avatar
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    Why aren't there any people at this station?

  8. #33
    Long Distance Cyclist Machka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Machka View Post
    Tell us about the public transportation options in your area. What do you like about it? What could be improved?
    Quote Originally Posted by duckbill View Post
    I feel a little spoiled. When I'm not cycling, two buses with little or no waiting at the transfer station, takes me door to door in about 45 minutes. The bus stop is at the foot of my driveway. What could be improved? The price perhaps, $3.00 each way, $6.00 per day.
    It's just slightly less expensive than that here, for close zones ... more for areas further afield. From one of the areas we're considering moving would be $3.36 per trip, for a 30-35 minute ride to work.

  9. #34
    Senior Member duckbill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Machka View Post
    It's just slightly less expensive than that here, for close zones ... more for areas further afield. From one of the areas we're considering moving would be $3.36 per trip, for a 30-35 minute ride to work.
    A monthly pass is available for $72.00 which would be a savings if more than 12 trips were taken but I'm sure that if I purchased one the snow and ice would go away and cycling would take precedence.

  10. #35
    Sophomoric Member Roody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by duckbill View Post
    A monthly pass is available for $72.00 which would be a savings if more than 12 trips were taken but I'm sure that if I purchased one the snow and ice would go away and cycling would take precedence.
    You'd probably be safe to buy one for at least one or two more months.


    "Think Outside the Cage"

  11. #36
    Long Distance Cyclist Machka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by duckbill View Post
    A monthly pass is available for $72.00 which would be a savings if more than 12 trips were taken but I'm sure that if I purchased one the snow and ice would go away and cycling would take precedence.
    I expect there would be some who would appreciate your $72 contribution toward an early spring.

  12. #37
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    There is a commuter rail station about 1/4 mile from me and a bus stop about the same distance. The train goes into Boston where it connects to the subway system, Amtrak, and to the Silver Line that goes to the airport. The bus connects to the Red Line, a light rail line. The commuter rail line only runs five days a week now. The bus runs from 6:30 AM to about 7M.

    There is also another commuter rail line about three and a half miles away. This line runs every day including holidays.

    Public transportation could be improved by more service at night and on the weekends.

    The big weakness in the system is that the lines run into and out of Boston, so it is not easy to go to another place outside of Boston by public transport, unless you go into town, and then out again.
    Last edited by ironwood; 02-07-14 at 03:57 PM. Reason: mistake

  13. #38
    Sophomoric Member Roody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ironwood View Post
    The big weakness in the system is that the lines run into and out of Boston, so it is not easy to go to another place outside of Boston by public transport, unless you go into town, and then out again.
    Maybe it's time to abandon the ubiquitous hub-and-spoke transit routes and move on to a grid pattern?

    http://www.theatlanticcities.com/com...us-system/118/

    http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=194545


    "Think Outside the Cage"

  14. #39
    Senior Member Jim from Boston's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Machka View Post
    Tell us about the public transportation options in your area. What do you like about it? What could be improved?...
    I noted that the thread containing this post from 2009 was recently bumped up:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
    …I live on Commonwealth Avenue (Comm Ave) … in Kenmore Square. …. It is an intersection of three major thoroughfares as well as a point of convergence of three branches of the Green subway line (the (T)) before they emerge from underground to fan out westward….
    I live one block from the Kenmore (T) Station, with access to virtually anywhere in the City and suburbs I would want to go, directly or by transfers to other subway lines. About 1.5 miles from home in Kenmore is the Back Bay Commuter Rail station, which is itself about 1/8th mile from the nearest subway stop (Copley Square), which is two subway stops from Kenmore.

    The Commuter Rail extends from Downtown up to about 30 - 40 miles out of town. As a reverse-direction commuter cyclist, I can bring my bike on the train during off-peak hours. A Rail Station is about two blocks from my work place, so for the return trip home, I take my bike on the train back to Copley Square, about a five-minute ride to Kenmore.

    The Commuter Rail also is great to get out of town for some excellent road cycling, and extends my range and bypasses some gritty city-riding. My gripes are few, mostly with late trains. My circumstance are such that:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
    …Humbly, if Bike Forums ever had a Best Commute Award, I would be a frontrunner.

    PS: I just noted these two preceding posts on this thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by ironwood View Post
    …The big weakness in the system is that the lines run into and out of Boston, so it is not easy to go to another place outside of Boston by public transport, unless you go into town, and then out again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Roody View Post
    Maybe it's time to abandon the ubiquitous hub-and-spoke transit routes and move on to a grid pattern?
    NOOOOoooo...!!!...
    Last edited by Jim from Boston; 02-07-14 at 05:57 PM.

  15. #40
    Long Distance Cyclist Machka's Avatar
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    I'm trying to envision how a grid pattern system would work.

  16. #41
    Sophomoric Member Roody's Avatar
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    ^^^
    Basically, buses (or trains) run straight up and down streets, north-and-south or east-and-west, in a grid pattern as mapped out. To go from northwest from southeast: take your nearest bus as far east as you want to go. Then make a street side transfer to the bus that will take you straight south to your destination.

    In contrast, most transit systems currently use a hub-and-spoke pattern. You take the nearest bus downtown to the station, where you transfer to a second spoke bus that takes you to your destination.

    There are advantages and disadvantages to each pattern.


    "Think Outside the Cage"

  17. #42
    Long Distance Cyclist Machka's Avatar
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    Winnipeg used a hub-and-spoke pattern with several hubs, of course ... and that worked quite well. There was enough overlap that you could go partway toward the hub, then catch a bus heading out a different direction.

    Because of the way Winnipeg is laid out, and the rivers, I'm not sure a grid system would work.

    Same with Hobart. It doesn't really lend itself well to a grid.

  18. #43
    Senior Member wahoonc's Avatar
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    Twelve miles from my house to the nearest bus stop... I live in suburgatory.

    Aaron
    Webshots is bailing out, if you find any of my posts with corrupt picture files and want to see them corrected please let me know. :(

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  19. #44
    Senior Member Ekdog's Avatar
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    Buses: About €0.70, including transfer. Elderly ride free. They run every 10 or 15 minutes. Most run on natural gas. Packed to the gills at rush hour.

    Tram: Same price as bus. Just one line, which covers a 1.3 mile route. This needs to be extended and more lines built.

    Underground: Just one line. Connects certain outlying areas. More expensive than the subways in other Spanish cities.

    Local trains: Good, efficient service. Bikes allowed. I pay €42 a month for my 16-mile daily commute.

    Middle and Long Distance trains: Almost anywhere you might want to go. High-speed rail service to Madrid (about 290 miles) takes two hours and 20 minutes. From there, there is high-speed service to Barcelona and Paris. There are restrictions on bikes. I think they have to be boxed. My bagged Brompton raises no eyebrows.
    Smug, car-bashing cyclist and public transport user.

  20. #45
    Pedalin' Erry Day lasauge's Avatar
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    My city's bus system isn't much to speak of: it uses a hub-and-spoke pattern that makes journeys very lengthy unless you can stick to a single line, 30 minutes between stops, service is very limited (none on Sundays, no routes anywhere near the entire eastern third of the city, limited service on Saturdays and after 6:00 on weekdays). As you can guess, not many people use something so inconvenient (I haven't personally since I was in highschool a decade ago), the people I know who do ride the bus are those who have 'temporary problems of liquidity' but aren't aware of or interested in bicycles or have some condition that makes walking or riding impractical.

    Actually, it's remarkable that we have a functioning bus service of any kind considering that much of the city is suburban sprawl. Density is low, giant parking lots are attached to every business, and going most anywhere requires navigating 6-8 lane roads - it's a pattern that's meant to serve automobile drivers exclusively.

  21. #46
    Sophomoric Member Roody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Machka View Post
    Winnipeg used a hub-and-spoke pattern with several hubs, of course ... and that worked quite well. There was enough overlap that you could go partway toward the hub, then catch a bus heading out a different direction.

    Because of the way Winnipeg is laid out, and the rivers, I'm not sure a grid system would work.

    Same with Hobart. It doesn't really lend itself well to a grid.
    As ironwood and Jim from Boston implied, the hub-and-spoke pattern works well if a lot of travel is headed to a downtown or other central location. A grid pattern is nice when a lot of popular destinations are outside of the center.

    I guess geography might enter into it as well, although I don't really understand that.
    Last edited by Roody; 02-08-14 at 10:20 AM.


    "Think Outside the Cage"

  22. #47
    Sophomoric Member Roody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ekdog View Post
    Buses: About €0.70, including transfer. Elderly ride free. They run every 10 or 15 minutes. Most run on natural gas. Packed to the gills at rush hour.

    Tram: Same price as bus. Just one line, which covers a 1.3 mile route. This needs to be extended and more lines built.

    Underground: Just one line. Connects certain outlying areas. More expensive than the subways in other Spanish cities.

    Local trains: Good, efficient service. Bikes allowed. I pay €42 a month for my 16-mile daily commute.

    Middle and Long Distance trains: Almost anywhere you might want to go. High-speed rail service to Madrid (about 290 miles) takes two hours and 20 minutes. From there, there is high-speed service to Barcelona and Paris. There are restrictions on bikes. I think they have to be boxed. My bagged Brompton raises no eyebrows.
    Quote Originally Posted by lasauge View Post
    My city's bus system isn't much to speak of: it uses a hub-and-spoke pattern that makes journeys very lengthy unless you can stick to a single line, 30 minutes between stops, service is very limited (none on Sundays, no routes anywhere near the entire eastern third of the city, limited service on Saturdays and after 6:00 on weekdays). As you can guess, not many people use something so inconvenient (I haven't personally since I was in highschool a decade ago), the people I know who do ride the bus are those who have 'temporary problems of liquidity' but aren't aware of or interested in bicycles or have some condition that makes walking or riding impractical.

    Actually, it's remarkable that we have a functioning bus service of any kind considering that much of the city is suburban sprawl. Density is low, giant parking lots are attached to every business, and going most anywhere requires navigating 6-8 lane roads - it's a pattern that's meant to serve automobile drivers exclusively.
    The contrast couldn't be clearer!


    "Think Outside the Cage"

  23. #48
    Pedalin' Erry Day lasauge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roody View Post
    The contrast couldn't be clearer!
    And that's before I mention the cost! 1 bus fare with transfer here costs $1.75.

    I'll save you the trouble of looking up the exchange rate, for comparison that would be €1.28 at the current rate.

  24. #49
    Long Distance Cyclist Machka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roody View Post
    I guess geography might enter into it as well, although I don't really understand that.
    Many cities are not built on a grid system.

    If you take Winnipeg, for example, you can travel from the far west into the centre of the city, and there is a bus that does that, but then you run into the Red River. Portage Avenue does not go across the river. The way Winnipeg is laid out, there are a lot of spoke streets that all end in the centre of the city hub.

    Hobart is built on the sides of hills and Mt Wellington. There's very little that is "grid" about it. And it make sense to have the centre of town as the hub.

    Of course in both cases, there are several hubs. In Winnipeg if you want to start in the far west and go to the college which is sort of north-west-ish, you don't have to go all the way downtown and then catch a bus back, you go to one of the other hubs (at Polo Park, the shopping centre) and then catch a bus northward to the college.

  25. #50
    Pedaled too far. Artkansas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roody View Post
    I guess geography might enter into it as well, although I don't really understand that.
    You were in San Diego for a while. It has grids where it can, but the canyon and mesa terrain tell San Diego where to put the roads.
    "He who serves all, best serves himself" Jack London

    Quote Originally Posted by Bjforrestal View Post
    I don't care if you are on a unicycle, as long as you're not using a motor to get places you get props from me. We're here to support each other. Share ideas, and motivate one another to actually keep doing it.

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