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-   -   Does where you live have an effect on car-free living? (http://www.bikeforums.net/living-car-free/934814-does-where-you-live-have-effect-car-free-living.html)

phoebeisis 02-26-14 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike (Post 16526106)
Least of all fat men (or women) who aren't already used to riding some sort of bicycle.

Yes it is unlikely someone -not already a rider-will up and buy a $1000 bike-zero chance really.
It will be tough-impossible probably- to get older "not riders" to ride.
I guess I'm thinking ahead- with forum members in mind maybe-when you folks become older fatter gimpier-
Of course it won't happen to me-but I certainly see that in your future-
Generous soul that I am- I'm looking out for you folks!!

Yes I can see it- I-Like-To-Trike

PS Economics-depression- or a huge increase in energy prices- is about the only thing that would change our transportation habits- becoming as poor as folks in China 1980 or so.

phoebeisis 02-26-14 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trike_guy (Post 16528164)
Its not going to happen. Small market, expensive, stigmatized.

For what its worth, my two cargo trikes are at least $2500 each, and I doubt there are many quality options for much less.

Thanks-figured they were pricy , but not THAT pricy-the one I sold used-2006 for $2000 ebay- was $2800 new-and it was very nice-probably not state of art-no CF no Titanium -but very good quality-no cheap outs.

I still see those cheap ones-$150-$300 used on CL-typical 1970's type upright trikes-maybe $500 new? Guessing they are 50lbs or so-and tough to get thru doorway.

Ekdog 02-26-14 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roody (Post 16526416)
They are sitting down...

Yes, the fact that they're sitting down on the bike means they're able to take a load off of their joints, a big advantage.

I-Like-To-Bike 02-26-14 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trike_guy (Post 16528164)
Its not going to happen. Small market, expensive, stigmatized.

In regards to trikes for adults your responses are true, true, true and true.

PS, I think that even children in the U.S. don't ride tricycles anymore, as the HotWheels, BigWheels 3 wheel configuration are much cheaper and safer, and from what I can tell, more fun for the children as they can whip around corners faster without turning over.

Roody 02-26-14 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoebeisis (Post 16528186)
Thanks-figured they were pricy , but not THAT pricy-the one I sold used-2006 for $2000 ebay- was $2800 new-and it was very nice-probably not state of art-no CF no Titanium -but very good quality-no cheap outs.

I still see those cheap ones-$150-$300 used on CL-typical 1970's type upright trikes-maybe $500 new? Guessing they are 50lbs or so-and tough to get thru doorway.

My grandma had one of those big trikes that she rode around the small village she lived in. Us grandkids would ride it when we visited. It was fun as a novelty, but too sedate for ongoing fun for a young person.

There was a guy in his 70s who rode an upright trike for several years in this city. I would see him frequently at distant points around town. My estimate was that he must have ridden that trike at least 20 miles a day to get to all the different places I saw him. He seemed to ride mostly on the MUP, but I also saw him riding on sidewalks.

I'm sure you know that those recumbent trikes are high performance vehicles. In some circumstances they're faster than the best diamond frame racing bikes. They're especially fast going downhill or into a headwind. The upright "adult trikes", on the other hand, are possibly the very slowest pedal vehicles in existence.

trike_guy 02-26-14 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike (Post 16529014)
PS, I think that even children in the U.S. don't ride tricycles anymore

But three wheels is still what it takes for a real cargo cycle. :)

phoebeisis 02-26-14 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roody (Post 16529922)
My grandma had one of those big trikes that she rode around the small village she lived in. Us grandkids would ride it when we visited. It was fun as a novelty, but too sedate for ongoing fun for a young person.

There was a guy in his 70s who rode an upright trike for several years in this city. I would see him frequently at distant points around town. My estimate was that he must have ridden that trike at least 20 miles a day to get to all the different places I saw him. He seemed to ride mostly on the MUP, but I also saw him riding on sidewalks.

I'm sure you know that those recumbent trikes are high performance vehicles. In some circumstances they're faster than the best diamond frame racing bikes. They're especially fast going downhill or into a headwind. The upright "adult trikes", on the other hand, are possibly the very slowest pedal vehicles in existence.

Right-frontal area and CD- determine top speed-so recumbent-huge advantage-guessing you can fair a trike

Yeah the old timer upright trikes are slow-but still 2x-3x walking speed same effort-
and with a big basket you can haul a BIG LOAD- no problem
An older person can't haul 25-50 lbs of dog food home-walking even 1/2 mile
Same story 25 lbs- 2 bags of groceries-too much for a 70 yo to haul 1/2 mile on foot-but nothing on a trike

But the PRICE means they are a no go for now.

trike_guy 02-26-14 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roody (Post 16529922)
The upright "adult trikes", on the other hand, are possibly the very slowest pedal vehicles in existence.

They make upright racing trikes, by the way. For example the guy here http://pedal-trikes.blogspot.no/ has been writing a long blog about wandering around on his. (The oldest posts give more relevant info about that type of machine.) But probably you made your comment without realizing anyone would think of building such a thing.

Also, you make it sound way too dramatic with the speed there. Most riders on three wheels are slow. A fit rider who is willing to learn the fine art of trike balance at speed, and then put some muscle into it, is going to do just fine getting around. It also may be the case that most upright trikes are heavy, but that is not because they have to be heavy. Those upright racing trikes are quite light. My cargo trikes actually weigh less than standard Dutch cargo bikes, as far as I know. So, I don't expect trikes to take over, ever, but the concept of three wheels is not so hopeless as you might think.

Roody 02-26-14 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trike_guy (Post 16530232)
They make upright racing trikes, by the way. For example the guy here http://pedal-trikes.blogspot.no/ has been writing a long blog about wandering around on his. (The oldest posts give more relevant info about that type of machine.) But probably you made your comment without realizing anyone would think of building such a thing.

Also, you make it sound way too dramatic with the speed there. Most riders on three wheels are slow. A fit rider who is willing to learn the fine art of trike balance at speed, and then put some muscle into it, is going to do just fine getting around. It also may be the case that most upright trikes are heavy, but that is not because they have to be heavy. Those upright racing trikes are quite light. My cargo trikes actually weigh less than standard Dutch cargo bikes, as far as I know. So, I don't expect trikes to take over, ever, but the concept of three wheels is not so hopeless as you might think.

I'm sorry to give the wrong impression that I think trikes--upright or 'bent--are hopeless. I think they're great machines and there will always be a niche market for them.

I read somewhere that recumbents, including trikes, would be the main "bike" used in racing, if they were allowed. Is that true?

trike_guy 02-26-14 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roody (Post 16530254)
I read somewhere that recumbents, including trikes, would be the main "bike" used in racing, if they were allowed. Is that true?

Actually I don't know anything about recumbents... not my particular fascination. :) I think they look kinda goofy.

wipekitty 02-26-14 10:51 PM

Let's not forget that a recumbent trike rider recently became the first person to bike to the South Pole!

I actually think that a trike might be kind of awesome for winter riding. One of the year-round riders here in town has one, and it always looks very...safe.

trike_guy 02-27-14 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wipekitty (Post 16531141)
I actually think that a trike might be kind of awesome for winter riding. One of the year-round riders here in town has one, and it always looks very...safe.

Well! Turns out that I am also a year rounder, and currently doing that on a trike (a Nihola) because it helps makes things smooth with picking up and dropping off kids. (Bad mood this morning? Who cares, into the box and we're going!)

I'd say it actually is pretty safe, and not usually too slow, though there are tradeoffs. There is more rolling resistance breaking three tire tracks through snow, but also no problem with stability on a shifting base. There is no problem slipping and falling, but at least on a tadpole trike there is less weight (as a percentage) on the powered tire, making it easier to spin. (For that reason, I use pannier bags and leave the box empty while in commute mode.) You can use the front brakes aggressively (on a tadpole) but its also possible to slide sideways without that being the idea (for example when locking the rear tire). Also three wheels can mean benefiting less from other bikes breaking trail, and its heavier to move around by pushing, pulling or lifting... but you get off the saddle less because you can often rock and dig through spots at speeds too low for a 2-wheeler.

Ekdog 02-27-14 08:16 AM

Trike Guy, could you post a photo or two of your trike?

Zedoo 02-27-14 09:55 AM

3 pages in, I notice the topic is a yes/no question. Yes.

Roody 02-27-14 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trike_guy (Post 16531663)
Well! Turns out that I am also a year rounder, and currently doing that on a trike (a Nihola) because it helps makes things smooth with picking up and dropping off kids. (Bad mood this morning? Who cares, into the box and we're going!)

I'd say it actually is pretty safe, and not usually too slow, though there are tradeoffs. There is more rolling resistance breaking three tire tracks through snow, but also no problem with stability on a shifting base. There is no problem slipping and falling, but at least on a tadpole trike there is less weight (as a percentage) on the powered tire, making it easier to spin. (For that reason, I use pannier bags and leave the box empty while in commute mode.) You can use the front brakes aggressively (on a tadpole) but its also possible to slide sideways without that being the idea (for example when locking the rear tire). Also three wheels can mean benefiting less from other bikes breaking trail, and its heavier to move around by pushing, pulling or lifting... but you get off the saddle less because you can often rock and dig through spots at speeds too low for a 2-wheeler.

That's very good information! I wish it was in a thread about trikes so it would be more easily accessible to people with an interest in trikes.

In fact I think I will start a trike thread. Would you be willing to participate? And maybe paste this post into the new thread?

gerv 02-27-14 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wipekitty (Post 16531141)
Let's not forget that a recumbent trike rider recently became the first person to bike to the South Pole!

That is so amazing! It's hard to believe what people do on these things.

http://fcdn.mtbr.com/attachments/fat...42957231_n.jpg

trike_guy 02-27-14 11:48 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ekdog (Post 16531676)
Trike Guy, could you post a photo or two of your trike?

OK, here are two I like. For those that are particularly interested, I also have a blog with the name that I have in my signature.

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=366393

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=366394

Ekdog 02-27-14 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trike_guy (Post 16534279)
OK, here are two I like. For those that are particularly interested, I also have a blog with the name that I have in my signature.

Nice! :thumb: If only I had somewhere to store one of those (and the €€€ to buy one)...

If you click on the thumbnails you get a bigger image.

jbibm 03-30-14 08:51 PM

There are many factors that going into living a car-less lifestyle. The most significant factor is location. Within the U.S. it's often easier to live without a car if you're closer to the center of the city with a dense network of streets and land-uses that compliment the shorter trips. Higher densities also support walking and bicycling - think NYC vs. LA.

I recently moved to Montana from Portland, OR, and I can attest that it is much more difficult and frustrating to live without a car here than downtown Portland. I find that everything is far apart and the transit system is often not the cost-effective choice. Once I get to where I need to go it's often difficult to find a place to park my bicycle and the network of wide arterial streets invite fast-moving automobile traffic.

In short ... yes, where you live has a significant impact on car-free living.

Roody 03-31-14 02:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbibm (Post 16626938)
. Once I get to where I need to go it's often difficult to find a place to park my bicycle....

Do you have a cable type lock? If so, it's easy to lock to a railing, signpost, tree, even a sewer grate. I have never had trouble finding a place to lock a bike.

Machka 03-31-14 04:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roody (Post 16627276)
Do you have a cable type lock? If so, it's easy to lock to a railing, signpost, tree, even a sewer grate. I have never had trouble finding a place to lock a bike.

Not always allowed.

There are even places over here where we're not allowed to lean our bicycles up against the exterior walls of buildings.

Roody 03-31-14 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Machka (Post 16627333)
Not always allowed.

There are even places over here where we're not allowed to lean our bicycles up against the exterior walls of buildings.

Like I said, I never had a problem. YMMV.

Artkansas 03-31-14 06:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roody (Post 16530254)
I read somewhere that recumbents, including trikes, would be the main "bike" used in racing, if they were allowed. Is that true?

Recumbent's were banned from racing in 1934 by the Union Cycliste Internationale (UCI) after Francis Faure used it to set a record for distance ridden in an hour. Faure was 43 and considered a second rate cyclist. It wasn't until 41 years later at the First International Human Powered Speed Championship that recumbents found a venue and immediately dominated it.

Even at what was the beginning toward the current International Human Powered Speed Challenge at Battle Mountain where the speed of 83.13 mph was achieved, recumbents were unassailably faster. Some people tried to ride a standard diamond frame bike with an aerodynamic shell, but the recumbents, in their renaissance, were consistently faster.

http://www.meta-bikes.com/images/carrera455.jpg

Weatherby 03-31-14 08:41 AM

Yes.

Car-free would be impossible for where I live and my responsibilities.


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