zowie

I would add to that, that on a human powered vehicle there's something nice and right about also having human powered lighting.

But at least for me this is a tertiary factor.

rhm

Right on! With my dynamos, I make my own electricity. I don't use batteries. I don't support the chemical industry. I don't create waste that, at best, will be difficult and expensive to recycle.

Batteries are, of course, cheap, plentiful, and available in bewildering variety. It's because of the economics of scale. Dynamos are expensive, rare, and only a few models available. Again, economics of scale. The world would be a better place if we could reverse this dynamic. Yes, I know, I am naive to think one or two bicyclists will tip the balance one way or another; even so, it strikes me as the right thing to do.

trace22clawson

c'mon... you're goin' extreme with the "save the world" stuff. You didn't "grow your bike" in the garden did you? I guess your trying to make me feel guilty for using rechargeable batteries. I don't give a second thought to riding my bike because it's good for the environment. I ride cuz it's fun. I like the convenience and availability of batteries. It's just nice to see in the dark.

rhm

You bet I am -- is it working?
Seriously, though, don't feel guilty about a thing. You're riding, I'm glad you're riding at night, I'm glad your batteries are rechargable, and so on. You are clearly part of the solution.
But if anyone wants to know, dynamos are great, everyone should have one, and I'm glad more merchants are selling them.

No, but I try. I keep planting those little round seeds I found in the BB, but I can't get them to germinate. Maybe I'm "watering" them with the wrong kind of oil? Any suggestions?

trace22clawson

fertalize with ground up rebar.

Paul L.

My headlight pattern is shaped like Al Gore!

Goonster

I disagree, and think that generators are of tremendous benefit on randonneur events.

Batteries add an unnecessary degree of logistical complexity. You can't leave your lights on by accident, and you have to remember to recharge/replace dead batteries. What if you run out in the middle of nowhere? What if your drop bag isn't where it's supposed to be? What if you can't find your money to buy new batteries? What if you lose your spares? A generator eliminates all of these problems, and frees up your mind to think about riding and eating.

Sure, plenty of folks ride big brevets with battery systems. When asked why, they almost always bring up cost. Let's not even factor in the cost of batteries, ask yourself this: if you run out of batteries in the middle of nowhere on an important event, what would you be willing to spend then to have a generator?

Also, it's true that many LED systems are very bright and "light up the road". Well, that's not always the best thing for night visibility. A very bright, focused beam with sharp cutoffs may cause you to see very little outside the lit patch.

All I can say is that on night rides, I find a lot of riders with battery systems riding behind me.

Goonster

Another thing: I've never met a randonneur who sold their Schmidt dynohub, looking for something better.

Sure, folks experiment with different light setups (mounting position, Lumotec vs. E6, single vs. dual lights, etc.), but the dynohub stays. Nobody complains about drag either.

Aside from the right saddle and a good bag, I can't think of money better spent for a rando rig.

Paul L.

I have to say that I have bought many lights since starting Randonneuring ranging from LEDs to HIDs and think I have found the holy grail in my Dynamo LED setup that I currently am using. Not being battery dependent is a great load off my mind. It is also a LOT lighter than carrying around enough rechargeables to keep that HID cooking all night.

Incidentally the Shimano Hub has been very satisfactory to me on the 300 and 400ks this year and is much cheaper than the schmidt. Not to Poo poo the schmidt, I would buy it if I had the extra cash but find the Shimano to be an adequate substitute

Paul L.

My setup uses a dual K2 led which is roughly equivalent to a Luxeon 5. I had it using 4 but when half the light broke off on the 400k due to a chain coming off (I have remedied that design flaw in the current light) I found that the dual light was pretty much as bright as the 4 with the LED driver circuit I was using so I figure less is better and I can haul a spare setup in case something goes wrong with the first as it weighs pretty much nothing and is easy to afix to my recumbent. If anyone is interested I have details on my blog- randocommute.blogspot.com
It is under the "plans" category. I don't have instruction for the 2 K2 light on there but the main difference is I aligned the 2 K2s vertically to allow room for the chain to slip off without affecting the light. This is the setup I will use on the 600k next week.

Incidentally the light cost roughly $35 dollars to make and rivals my HID though it is not as bright but has a better beam focus.

Goonster

I've heard it said that the Shimano is slightly less efficient than the Schmidt, but I think that they have improved significantly since I bought my Schmidt four years ago. I'd never talk someone out of a shimano either.

bbaker22

OK, I want to look at the diy led info, but I can't find it on your blog page... I went to randocommute.blogspot.com , but I don't see anything about plans or categories. Any idea
what's up?

Thanks,
Brad

SharpT

I am just a commuter, but my setup is as follows.

5W led (cateye HL-EL220) runs on 4AA (60 hour max)
10W halogen MR16 bulb, run off a 60Whour NiMH batterpack (2lbs) (6 hour max)

I use the 10W most of the time, but have the 5W Cateye LED for backup, usually just flashing for visibility during commuting.

I am looking into doing some of these long distance tours, and think my setup should be OK, although, I may carry along an extra 60Whr battery pack, or drop off point, if I'm planning to rdie through the nite.

Also, never had any issues using my battery light setup in my commuting.

SharpT

supcom

Before setting out on an all night brevet with your setup, make sure there is a bag drop available. In my neck of the woods (Dallas area) we have no bag drops on our rides. On our 600K route, you do return to the start about halfway so you have access, but otherwise, you are on your own. For us, it's either carry what you need or buy it along the way.

I know other RBAs do things differently, so be sure you know the deal beforehand.

Bruce Rosar

I suggest growing carbon plants and then harvesting the fibers

prestonjb

To CAP some of the comments... Remember the title of this section is "long distance cycling" So that includes not only randonneuring but also ultra marathon racing, and long distance touring?

So to use that for the base of my following comments here goes:

1) For the 24 hours of Sebring I use 3hour HID battery packs. The track has power so my team plugs in chargers and so I just have to come in around 2.5 hours to swap out the batteries.

2) For Randonneuring you can nearly get away with most any kind of lighting depending on your comfort level. The laws typically require very low (be seen) lighting. And if you are willing to ride slower you can use fairly low lights. In the past I've used #dual Cateye HL500s#Dual Cateye EL500s#Single HID light with 3 battery packs (this works on the 400k where I really only needed two 3-hour batteries and the 3rd was an emergency battery wasn't fully charged backup... And lastly I'm running with the Schmidt hub.

Of all of these the HID is the easiest on the eyes... Sure I could use a flashlight but brighter lights are less eye-strain and therefore better to keep away the weary-eyes-sleeping-running-off-road issues. But the HID requires the most weight and money to handle lighting for the longer randonneuring rides. The Schmidt hub is actually better in brightness (dual E6 lights) than the EL500s/520s and other 10hour LED lights so they are less eye-strain.

Bottom line... If you are using drop-bags you can probably get away with using 10W+ halogens or HIDs and battery packs (spares in your drop bags)... If you don't want to or believe in them and want the best light wo the eyestrain then the dyno-hub lights are the best bet.

3) Touring. I used dual EL500s for crossing the USA in 2004 and because they were only used for emergency (rode from sunrise to sunset but on occasion ran into riding in the dark to make a town or used them as BE-SEEN lights in bad weather. The HUB woulda been better because I would not need to buy batteries along the way... Actually I've started working on a charging circuit for the hub to power a battery charger for the GPS and LED tail light (and cell phone) so I won't need to buy batteries for those devices either...

Bottom line IMHO is to buy the brightest light that will go the distance... Be that HID or hub-gen depends more specifically on the application but if you can use a HID or 10w+ halogen then go that way... Else the next in the line of light choices is the hub-gen with dual E6 lights...

hairytoes

The EL defn isn't a 5W light. It has 5 LEDs, I think in total they use about 1W.

I have a K2 Luxeon with a 6degree lens. The manufacturer calls it a 5W LED, but at the recommended current of 1A it is actually 3.47W.

This gives off around the same amount of light as a 20W halogen bulb.

I'm going by the totally unscientific comparison of shining them across a field at night.

IronMac

Reading this, I am just confused at the moment. I'm now looking into an alternative to purchasing a new US$130 plus shipping battery replacement for my JetLites system. I do long distances consistently at night (60-70% of my rides are in the dark or predawn) on a variety of roads with varying amounts of light. Think city to trail to country roads. I guess I just have to read more.

ollo_ollo

I have either bottle type or bottom bracket mounted generators on several of my bikes, plus for years of commuting, my Winter rain bike had a Sturmey Archer Dynohub powering a lumotec headlight. All of these systems are 6 volt 3 watts & they provide adequate light even on dark country roads. I never experienced any slippage even in heavy rain, & only once saw tire wear (which was from a misadjusted bottle generator).

You can still purchase new Union or similar generator systems but not all bike shops carry them. The last set I purchased was no longer manufactured in Germany & was marked "made in Spain". The generator & lights were also branded "Soubitez" (a French Co.) although the box & directions are marked "Union". The set cost $36 & I felt the headlight scattered light to much, so I replaced it with a "Lumotec" headlight with "standlight" feature. This added an additional $40, so the whole system cost $76. I usually supplemented with a led headlight & blinkies.

For many years I used a system of 2 halogen headlights (10 watt & 15 watt) powered by a rechargable lead acid battery. It gives much more light but the rechargable batteries only last about 45 minutes with both lights or a bit over 2 hours on 10 watts only & need replacement every season. Don

Paul L.

https://randocommute.blogspot.com/200...tor-light.html
https://randocommute.blogspot.com/200...s-inquiry.html

The basic difference between that light and my current version is I reduced it to Two leds. Removed the diffraction lens, and arranged the leds vertical to give more room on the sides so the chain would not rip the light off if it overshifted.

Also, I should point out that they now have Buck Pucks that take alternating current (current version uses this) so you can cut out the Bridge Rectifier from the circuit. You just need to make sure that you get a buck puck that allows strobing so you don't burn it out at slower speeds.

supcom

If you are riding 60-70% of the time needing lights, then you should be seriously considering a generator based light set.

IronMac

Yeah, I know.

The Jet Lites system worked great when new but the cost of the replacement battery is the killer. If I buy a new battery now, I'll just have to repeat the process again in 3-4 years.

SharpT

Ah yes, the Cateye does not draw 5W... Otherwise those AA's would drain in no time.

One of the reasons I went with a 10W halogen MR16 set-up is the multitude of drop in MR16 LED bulbs that are coming to market. I think I will look around and try to find the best MR16 LED bulb at a reasonable price and try it out. It seems there are some that claim 20W replacement at less than 5W draw. We'll see. Even a 15W equivalent would be OK for brevets I would assume.

SharpT

jnoble123

I picked up an Inolight 20+ from Peter White to use with my soon to be installed SON hub. I believe it's a two watt LED.

Unfortunately I can't comment on it's usefulness yet since the bike is still being assembled. It should be interesting to compare it to my offroad lighting systems.

~Jamie

Kimber

Could someone tell me what a buckpuck is? Paul L. ?