Skeleton

A couple of decades back I did lots of riding on my old road bike (400~500 km / week). I always carried spare spokes as I was needing to replace them perhaps once a week or two. Equally, I was getting flats once a week. Granted, back then the spokes and tires weren't using the advanced materials of this era.

I recently bought a Cervelo R3. Believe it or not: I am using this as an ultra-light touring bike. I have already had a few trips - fast and light. Of course, on my trips I take spare tubes, tire, patch kit, and basic repair tools.

I am now wondering if I should bring spare spokes. Actually, the wheels on this bike (Shimano R-550) has three different spoke groups, so I would need three types to bring. The wheels are fine enough for me to keep.

My wheels:
> Review: https://www.roadcyclinguk.com/news/ar...ps/UAN/411/v/2
> Shimano R550 Wheels
> Weight: 1852g per pair
> Dimensions: 700c clincher only
> Material: Aluminium hub and rim with stainless steel aero spokes
> Spoking: 16 front & 20 rear

My tire:
> Specialized armadilo 700cX25

My weight:
> Bike: 16 lb
> Accessory: 4 lb
> Touring luggage: 10 lb
> My weight dressed: 165 lb
> Total weight: 195 lb

QUESTIONS:
1) Do spokes break on modern road bikes under normal conditions? (If so, how often when riding typical good-quality roads?)
2) How well can a wheel continue to be used with one broken spoke?
3) Can high tensile wire be rigged to temporarily mend a broken spoke?
4) Is it common for long-distance riders on road bikes to carry spare spokes?

mattm

i don't have all the answers you're looking for, but after busting a spoke on my Mavic Ksyrium's during a century this summer, I carry the three types of spokes my wheels (may) require.

the thing was, there was a mechanic at a rest stop, but he didn't carry my spoke-length! i was screwed.

i've read that if a wheel is built correctly, then a spoke will NEVER break - but that probably applies to hand-built wheels, not factory/machine-built wheels.

so what i do now is tape my three back-up spokes together, and stuff 'em in a jersey pocket - they aren't so long that they'll fall out or get bent.

i've also heard that some people put their spokes in their seat-tube using a cork, but i havne't tried that one yet.

Hocam

If I were in your position I would seriously consider purchasing or building a set of 3x 32 hole handbuilt wheels. If you return to your 400-500 km/week mileage that you will eventually break a spoke, and because your wheels only have 20, it will throw the wheel much further out of true than a wheel with more spokes. On strong, overbuilt wheels a broken spoke can simply mean opening the brake calipers until a repair can be made. I doubt this would be the case with so few spokes. Those shimano wheels are more of a marketing gimmick, made to look like fancy low spoke ultra light weight wheels when in reality they're weak and heavy.

Even with 32 hole wheels, most distance riders and nearly all touring cyclists will carry either spare spokes or spare kevlar spokes. The kevlar spoke can be installed without removing the cassette, which is something impossible to do on the road without the heavy tools required (you need a chainwhip, cassette tool, and large wrench).

In fact, you could even take off 100-200 grams from your wheels by going to a quality handbuilt 32 hole set. I would recomend dura ace hubs, laced 3x to velocity aeroheads. The dura hubs are fantastic quality and easy to service by yourself with very quality loose ball bearings and great seals. The aerohead rims are available with an off center rear rim that can build a much stronger wheel by reducing the difference in spoke tension between drive and non-drive sides.

valygrl

Bring one Fiberfix spoke - costs about $10, weighs about nothing, works in any length, as long as you have normal j-hook type spokes (not the thread-into-the-hub kind like Easton/Velomax has).

I haven't used mine yet, but I hear they work great, definitely enough to ride for a few days until you can get to a bike shop.

If you have a low spoke count wheel and break a spoke, it's unrideable. Ask me how I know

Bacciagalupe

I don't believe it.

Seriously, if I were in your shoes I'd use a different bike for touring unless you are going fully supported and not carrying any luggage at all on your bike.

You may want to try a plusher saddle and/or 28c tires, if your bike can fit them.

Oh, and uh... "Touring" isn't quite the same thing as "Long Distance Rides."



With 10 lbs of luggage, you should be fine. That bike can probably take up to what, 250 lbs of rider weight.

Fortunately, spokes don't break that often; AFAIK that was pretty much always the case.

Basically if more than 2 spokes break on the same wheel, chances are all the spokes are screwed anyway, and you should have them all redone. So chances are that back in the day, you had a bad wheel rather than any sort of major improvement to wheels since then.


Not very well. You can screw up the other spokes that way....


https://www.peterwhitecycles.com/fiberfix.htm

If I were in your shoes: Less than a week, no worries. 1-4 weeks, FiberFix. 4+ weeks, definitely.

The Smokester

It appears I have similar wheels to you on my '06 Roubaix and I am also using it for long distance rides. To get increased reliability my solution is similar to what Hocam suggest--Namely, a high zoot 32-spoke wheel. In my case it will probably be a hand-built DT-Swiss rim, spokes and hubs. Expect a pair to cost just shy of US$1k. They will be stronger, easier to tune, more fault tolerant and slightly lighter.

thebulls

+1 on Kevlar spoke: I've only had to use a FiberFix spoke on two occasions, but the first time was in the middle of a 600K, and without the FiberFix, I wouldn't have finished. I rode it 175 miles on the 600, then I rode it another two or three hundred of commuting miles before bothering to replace it with a real spoke. The FiberFix is observationally equivalent to a real spoke. I guess some high-zoot wheels nowadays are built around fiber spokes.

-1 on the need for heavy stuff for removing cassettes. Buy a Stein cassette remover (https://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/s...ock/index.html). It weighs about an ounce or two. I've had cassettes come loose on rides, and have a friend who DNF'd a brevet because of this problem.

It's yet another of those things that as you're packing for a brevet you think "This is so light, I should really bring it along just in case" that accounts for several pounds worth of tools, bike parts, medications, etc. that I seldom need, but when I need it, I really need it.

Oh, and +1 on using reliable, old-school wheels that can be fixed by any mechanic anywhere, and that are unlikely to fail. I prefer 36 spokes, as the weight penalty of 4 spokes and nipples is nearly indetectable. From what I've read, the actual rims on the low-spoke wheels have to be heavier-duty to handle the low spoke count, which means more rotating mass at the rim. Seems like having more spokes with rotational mass near the center would be better. Though thousands of pro and amateur racers must be right.

Skeleton

Bacciagalupe:

Thanks for the link to FiberFix.

I carry some high tensile wire in my tool kit. I carry this as a potential fix for broken shifter or brake cable. You have taught me another use for it - spokes. The kevlar fibre is a neat idea, but I will stay with my steel wire for now - it too will be strong enough and should make for a quick and easy fix on the road.

BTW, all my randonneur rides are fully unsupported without even the use of motels. My only resupply is water and snacks from road-side convenient stores. I carry an ultra-lite sleeping bag and silnylon tarp or hammock. British Columbia is nothing but roads through endless mountains, so a road-side sleep is easy in the secluded in the forests.

My saddle is a Selle Italia SLR. For me, its comfortable up to six hours. After that time, I slip on a gel bike seat cover and lower the seat post accordingly.

I've been riding 700cX25 tires cuz they are virtually as fast as 23 tires, but carry about 10% more weight and softens the ride a wee bit. I agree that 28 tires would be even more comfortable, but for me, it is all about the speed. The Cervelo R3 and these tires lets me race along at 40 kph on the flats all day long (albeit, my quads really enjoy the sleep afterwards). Yeah, this is not a touring bike - it is a fast randonneuring bike. Just don't tell the other guys on the brevets ;-)

Skeleton

thebulls:

Just saw your Stein cassette remover. Wow - Is that ever neat! I'm ordering it today. Thanks for the tips.

PS to All:
I love this forum. I always get the best advice on biking right here. Thanks to all you experts.

Six jours

FWIW, I agree with most of what has been written here, especially re. the unsuitability of 16 spoke wheels for anything except time trials. On a 32 or 36 spoke wheel a broken spoke is almost a non-issue. You can tighten a couple of neighboring spokes to mostly true up the wheel, or you can simply open up the brakes a little.

You're also less likely to break a spoke on a 32 or 36 spoke wheel in the first place. I don't agree with the idea that a "properly built" 32 or 36 spoke wheel will never break a spoke, but they should give years of reliable service before the first spoke breaks -- which is often a sign that it's time for new wheels.

As for the spoke technology of 20 years ago, they were essentially the same things we have now. I still occasionally ride a 30 year old wheelset without problems. The wheels mentioned in the OP that were constantly breaking spokes were either worn out or were not correctly built in the first place. Or maybe he didn't have enough spokes in those wheels too.

Hocam

I feel like modern double wall rims build a much stronger wheel. The old single wall rims flex easily and don't feel as strong when stress relieving the spokes to me.


On the cassette cracker, I've seen those things split in half before so you can't rely on them 100% but it is a neat idea.

Skeleton

Would you know if my rims are double-walled?