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Long Distance Competition/Ultracycling, Randonneuring and Endurance Cycling Do you enjoy centuries, double centuries, brevets, randonnees, and 24-hour time trials? Share ride reports, and exchange training, equipment, and nutrition information specific to long distance cycling. This isn't for tours, this is for endurance events cycling

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Old 08-11-10, 07:09 PM   #1
Tybee
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Need advice on rebuilding 83 Trek 720 into a Rando bike

After a long absence from riding, I have begun restoring my racing frames from the 80s. During the 80s, I rode many centuries and double centuries on tubular tires, because they offered a more comfortable ride. During that time period, I picked up a 1983 Trek 720 touring frameset at quite a discount which was built with Reynolds 531 for the frame and fork, Cinelli investment cast bottom bracket and Nitto Italian cut lugs. It has many braze ons for building a Randonneuring bike which has my interest. This evening I removed several layers of dust accumulation and discovered a very nice almost mint frameset with taupe and brown contrasting colors. Since my old parts stash includes many of the parts that can be used on this rebuild, I am seeking advice on replacing some parts.

The seat post will be an old Campy SR

The Tange headset will stay (it still turns smoothly but will be repacked with new grease)

I have a set of Campy NR long reach brakes and levers that I can use. Any caution or advice?

Since the rear axle width will support a 126 mm hub, I have decided to rebuild the wheels using a pair of Campy 36 hole hubs. After reading previous threads here, I am leaning between Mavic Open Pro or Velocity Synergy rims. Any recommendations for a heavier rider? Will be using Conti clinchers 28mm. Any comments on latex tubes?

I would appreciate suggestions on a triple crank and BB (Campy’s 52/42/30 does not appear to be ideal for the hills of Tennessee using a Suntour Ultra 7 freewheel). The freewheel is from my stash using 13-14-16-18-21-26-32.

Shifters will be DC Bar Ends

I have Cinelli stems and bars but would like to use Nitto Randonneur handlebars. But, the Nittos are thinner than the Cinellis. Are there shims available to put a Nitto into a Cinelli stem?

I really need advice on the front and rear derailleurs, Any suggestions? I do not have any long cage rear derailleurs, and I am not sure my Campy NR or SR fronts will work.

Last, I have been looking a Brooks B-17 saddle, but I see Brooks has reintroduced the Colt which is wider that the B-17. Can anyone offer advice on either saddle?
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Old 08-15-10, 03:41 PM   #2
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Well, as a rando I'm a rank neophyte, but I can say something about those parts.

Brakes: The Campy NRs have some collectible value, especially the long reach. I feel they are great brakes, but I'm odd here. Most people want Tektro dual pivot or similar. I know they'll give you more stopping power for a given degree of hand power.

A 126 rear axle has zero to do with using a 36 hole hub. It does allow you to use a vintage hub with no more than 7-speeds in the rear. I've just done three metrics on 7-speed friction rear ends (on a 198-something Woodrup), and two on a Campy-10 equipped Mondonico, and I prefer more gears for this sort of riding.

I'm using Sun CR18 rims on the Woodrup. Good ride, but can't say about the durability - not more than 500 miles on them.

Latex tubes seep air through the rubber walls. You WILL have to do a major re-inflation every morning.

Your hubs should be able to handle a 7-speed freewheel with ease, if the axle spacers are as new. I like the Campy triples, but I don't understand what is the issue with yours. You will have gear duplication, usually ... just the nature of the beast.

For derailleurs I would not go too vintage. I have Huret DuoPar or EcoDuoPar on two bikes, and while they work well, I check them every few days and sometimes have to make a tweak. I'd go instead with a 9-speed rear: late '80s+ Campy, or any indexing Suntour or Shimano with long cages. Pre-index Shimano, like the 600/6207s, are not up with the late '80s Deore and some others. Used in friction mode these should all shift well. Many front derailleurs can handle triples in friction use.

Cinelli stems are designed for 26.4 mm handlebar diameter at teh center. Nitto bars come in 25.4 and 26.0. The clearance that must be made up is about 7.9 thousandths of an inch. I don't know if one can reasonably find sufficiently flexible .007 inch shim stock with which to make your own shim, but if you can shim it, the Cinelli will work well. The bigger question here is whether the Cinelli stem, as classic and beautiful as it is, will get the bars up as high as you will want them - only you can decide about that, maybe with fitter assistance. If not, you'll want a Nitto Technomic Deluxe or other Nitto stem with an 18 cm total quill length - that is the next step up from the racing-style stem. Rando bars are rather unique - you might or might not like them.

B17 seems to be designed for having the bar just a little lower than the saddle. B72 and B68 (and similar) are designed for more upright bikes like the old Raleigh three-speed roadsters. I'm not too familiar with the Colt, but I like a B17 and a Selle Anatomica for toury-longdistancy bikes. The B17 is worth a try, but nobody can guarantee it will work for you.
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Old 08-17-10, 12:21 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tybee View Post
The seat post will be an old Campy SR
Thats what I'm using

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tybee View Post
The Tange headset will stay (it still turns smoothly but will be repacked with new grease)
I used mine for a while but I got tired of the dirt and grit getting in.
I ordered a Velo Orange Grand Cru and was going to order another but they are out until september so I found an old stock Stronglight A9.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tybee View Post
I have a set of Campy NR long reach brakes and levers that I can use. Any caution or advice?
Thats what I'm using. They work fine. I use lined cable housing, stainless cables and Scott Mathauser pads though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tybee View Post
Since the rear axle width will support a 126 mm hub, I have decided to rebuild the wheels using a pair of Campy 36 hole hubs. After reading previous threads here, I am leaning between Mavic Open Pro or Velocity Synergy rims. Any recommendations for a heavier rider? Will be using Conti clinchers 28mm. Any comments on latex tubes?
I was using my old wheels I built back in the 80's (Campy Grand Sport hubs, DT spoke, Super Champion rims). I got tired again of dirt and grit getting in because they aren't sealed very well. So I found a set of NOS Sachs New Success Hubs and built those up 36h on some Mavic A719's. Used the 7 speed all last year. This year I finally got some Campagnolo Veloce/Mirage hubs and built a set of wheels using Mavic Open Pros and rebuilt my A719's to the 10s Campy hubs. By the way I am between 200 and 210 and the 32h Open Pros are fine for the weight, The A719's are just, well, bomb proof almost at 36h, those are made for touring and shouldn't go smaller than 700x28's. The Open Pros on the other hand can handle up to a 700x32

The Campy hubs are sealed units and so were the Sachs. It is so worth it to have sealed hubs. Don't get me wrong, I love the old Campy hubs, they are smooth and last forever but the maintenance involved, especially on a rando bike gets old fast. Who wants to maintain when you can ride?

Skip the latex tubes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tybee View Post
I would appreciate suggestions on a triple crank and BB (Campy’s 52/42/30 does not appear to be ideal for the hills of Tennessee using a Suntour Ultra 7 freewheel). The freewheel is from my stash using 13-14-16-18-21-26-32.
If you are keeping the 126 spacing build up a good half step gearing setup and get a 26/28 granny for it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tybee View Post
Shifters will be DC Bar Ends
That will work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tybee View Post
I have Cinelli stems and bars but would like to use Nitto Randonneur handlebars. But, the Nittos are thinner than the Cinellis. Are there shims available to put a Nitto into a Cinelli stem?
You will have to measure your Cinelli stem, some really old ones were 26.0.
No shims for 26.4 to 26 but some shim stock would probably do the trick, however, depending on how you ride you might like the Nitto Technomic tall stem. That would give you an all new setup.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tybee View Post
I really need advice on the front and rear derailleurs, Any suggestions? I do not have any long cage rear derailleurs, and I am not sure my Campy NR or SR fronts will work.
See half step above and search the forums for some recent threads on it.

ex: http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...f+step+gearing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tybee View Post
Last, I have been looking a Brooks B-17 saddle, but I see Brooks has reintroduced the Colt which is wider that the B-17. Can anyone offer advice on either saddle?
If you are bending over, i.e. on the drops, then you want a narrower saddle. Do a forum search for B17 or Brooks though to read some other thoughts.
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Old 08-17-10, 06:15 PM   #4
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Road Fan and canopus,

Thanks for your suggestions. I am restoring three bikes currently.

I have decided to have the Trek frame spread to accomodate a 130mm rear which will provide me alot of gearing options. I also have a custom Scott Paisley racing bike with a 126mm rear, and Scott suggested I have this frame spread to 130 for the addition of a compact crank. I rode the Paisley quite a few miles in your neck of the woods, Road Fan, during the late 80s when I consulted for a year near Ann Arbor. I am originally from Indianapolis where my 52x42 cranks and 13-23 freewheels worked fine, but the hills of my current home near Nashville require better gearing for hill climbing. I have another frame custom built by Matt Assenmacher in Swartz Creek that may be the best Rando option for speed. It has a 73 head and seatube ankles with 17 inch chainstays. It is fast and comfortable for longer rides.

Since I have too many vintage components and other bikes, it may be time to clear the closet and obtain some Nitto stems and bars, caliper brakes, sealed hubs, Aero brake levers for the Paisley and the Trek, and retain the vintage Campy for the Assenmacher. I will continue to update this thread as these bikes start coming together.
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