9606

One of the maxims I read for PBP was 'sleep when it is dark, ride when it is daylight'. To that end, I have laid out a plan with sleep at:
Tinteniac outbound (Mon midnightish)
Carhaix inbound (Tue early eve)
Villaines inbound (Wed early eve).
Yes, this sleeping plan still requires some night riding.
84 hour start, 80 hour finish time.
In the past, have these controls offered good sleeping arrangements? Have they been overly crowded? Do these three stops for sleep make sense?
I know all the answers are qualified with assumptions of weather, mechanicals, crowds, health issues, etc.

Machka 

I did not sleep at those locations, but I do remember that they laid cardboard on the floor on one side of eating area at Carhaix, and several people where sleeping there. It didn't seem to be particularly crowded.

The Octopus 

As a 2-time, 80-hr finisher out of the 84h group, I think your plan is optimistic. Loudeac twice and Mortagne are the locations for sleep that will produce that finish time (and at a pace speedier than what you have envisioned - I made Loudeac just after midnight). My guess is that you're not accounting for the enormous amount of time you'll spend not sleeping but nonetheless at the controls. I think stopping at Tintineac out of the 84h group presents too great a risk of a DNF, at least to me....

Good luck, and see you in Paris,
Paul

LWaB

The Octopus has nailed it. Both my 84hr starts (+ 2 x 90hr starts) were sub-80 finishes and you'll need to ride further and faster each day than you think, mostly because of non-riding time.

unterhausen

I've even heard people say that your first sleep stop should be Carhaix -- I think that was for the 90 hour start though. Not sure I believe that, because Loudiac at 440km is plenty far for the first day in my book. I guess if you slept at Tintiniac you would probably catch the people that slept at loudiac.

I agree about not riding at night, but I do ok up until 1-2 in the morning. After that, sometimes I think it's barely worth riding. I would be more concerned about wasting daylight.

This may be just me, but the first day I can ride however I want, the second day I am a waste until about dinner time, and then the rest of the ride I'm fine. Although someone once told me that I probably just think I'm riding fast because I'm passing all those slow people. There is some merit to this notion.

LastKraftWagen

I've never ridden PBP (although I've covered most if not all the general course at one time or another), and I don't often ride these organized endurance rides so I'm probably talking out of my saddle, but is there any "reward" for riding PBP in 80h with the 84h start over the 90h start? If it were me, coming from the states, I would consider arriving in Europe just before the event, use the 90h start (isn't it at 2200hrs?) and use jet lag to ride through the nights. Less traffic on the roads, I imagine controls might be less hectic at night when 5000 other riders are sleeping, and napping at the controls during the day when most are "in and out" may be more restful... I wouldn't know like I said but it's just a thought.

Otherwise, my experience with cross Europe rides is generally all plans are perfect until you clip in...

Machka 

No, there's no reward based on the time you start ... it's just personal challenge. If you think you'll find the 90-hour time too easy, you might select the 84-hour start. Some people also like the 84-hour start because it starts early in the morning.

Personally, I'm a night person so the 90-hour start suited me. On the 1200Ks I've done, I found my energy disappeared as soon as the sun came up, and that's when I took little naps.

At night there is less traffic on the roads and it is quite pleasant to ride at night ... although not so much when it was raining. However, the controls are still busy. Most 90-hour randonneurs are not getting their 8 hours each night. Most are managing 3 to 5-ish hours. By Loudeac, riders are also spread out in a long, long line down the road. So little groups of riders might pull into Loudeac every 5 minutes or so for several hours. They go to sleep, they get up 3 hours later, other riders are just pulling in ... There's a constant exchange of riders all night long. Especially at Loudeac on the way out.

However, from my experience, there were a few times when controls were almost empty. Brest was one of those times. I felt like I was the only person there! And that was in the middle of the afternoon.

Rowan

This is the most critical point to understanding planning for a 1200/ Whatever plans have been put in place in the optimistic comfort of your lounge room on the computer may change dramatically with (a) the weather (b) other riders doing unexpected things (like fall off in front of you), (c) you forgetting a fundamental piece of something such as food or clothing (d) significant mechanical issues (e) a bad night's sleep the night before the start that could influence appetite, rehydration and general attitude.

To sustain a detailed plan, I would suggest a rider has to be totally confident in their fitness, their bike fit, their equipment such as lights/dynohub/batteries, and their patience while dealing with people in a foreign country who are not going to be bullied into speeding up validations processes because someone is behind their personal schedule.

The only way to determine if a plan is sustainable is by going out and doing the qualifiers and whatever other longer distances (maybe a 1000), document the conditions and what happened. then plan to improve what went wrong.

LastKraftWagen

I would also guess riding qualifiers that mimic, or even better exceed, expected terrain... train for conditions beyond what you expect.

SBinNYC

Unless the ACP goes back to the pre-1991 departure times, your schedule won't work for a 90 hour ride. It's also risky for the 84 limit.

The 90 hour ride used to start at 4am. The Tinteniac, Charhaix(ret), Villaines stops are perfect for a contemplating a 90 hour ride.

Back in 1979/1983 sleeping accommodations at Tinteniac were a college dormitory. Carhaix was on gym mats on a gym floor. Villaines was a chicken coop with fresh straw spread on the ground. I brought an air matress with me in 1983. It served me well because they ran out of gym mats at Carhaix. They were not taking any more riders because they would not allow them to sleep on the bare floor. I produced the air mattress and they allowed me to sleep there. They still charged me 10 francs for the privilege.

The post 1991 schedule means 90 hour riders must ride by night and sleep by day. The 84 hour alternative means your first two stops must be Loudeac but most of your riding will be in daylight.

One important note, if you plan to sleep. It gets cold and your body's metabolism stops. Bring along space blankets to keep from shivering, when you sleep.

Machka 

From what I've been hearing over the last couple days, the start location and start date (and possibly times too??) are all changing from previous years.

Something I read just the other day strongly suggested that people hold off on booking flights until the dates, times, etc. are all settled.

LWaB

The start and (almost certainly) the bike check moves to the newly-opened National Velodrome in St Quentin-en-Yvelines, near both the railway station and the camping ground.

Negotiations are ongoing with the police about whether PBP has to start on Monday, rather than the expected Sunday. They'll know the answer in a week.

9606

Hmm -
What brought this all about?
What happens during the next week? Some city/prefecture council meeting?

Where did you first read about this?

unterhausen

I think the ACP told the national orgs about it. My guess is the police didn't want to work on a weekend during the national holiday, but that's just a guess

9606

"I think the ACP told the national orgs about it..."
I hope that is not the case.
There is nothing on RUSA.org about it. I know it is a volunteer staff(?) but this seems like a fairly critical issue. Families are making some serious vacation plans, some around PBP dates.
The first rule of randoing is 'be flexible', but for RUSA to know about it and not put it on the NATIONAL body's website seems strange.

La Tortue

Fear not. Its well known and been prominently on the official PBP web site for awhile.

Machka 

Follow this site ... this is the official ACP site:
Offical Web Site of Audax Club Parisien

This is the PBP portal with links to both PBP sites
Portail Paris Brest Paris 2015



I first heard about it one or two weeks ago when one Audax organisation on Facebook announced it ... might have been the ACP, I'd have to check. Then the other Audax organisations passed the message along as well.

unterhausen

has it been a couple of weeks since they said it would be resolved in a week?

I recommend taking that week off, it's tough to get back and go to work

Machka 

No ... I think they announced that the start location would be in a new place a couple weeks ago (maybe longer?) and then ...

RUSA Facebook page had this post on Nov 23 (or so):

For our members who are interested in PBP and ready to make plane or hotel reservations, please be aware that the start of the event may be pushed back by one day. You may want to wait for the resolution of this before purchasing anything non-changeable or non-refundable.
+++++++++++++++
We received today bad news from the french administration. We will have an unfavorable opinion for a departure on Sunday. We could have to postpone all the organization by one day and so the bike’s check could be held on Sunday 16th and the first departures on Monday 17th.
The final decision will be received within 10 days.

Audax Club Parisien

That message, or similar, has been passed through all the digests and facebook pages of the audax organisations I'm aware of.

Machka 

According to this PBP page, they are just starting to organise the checkpoints.
Paris-Brest-Paris 2015

unterhausen

Made me look. It looks like the Velodrome is a little more convenient than the Gymnasium.

thebulls

My advice to DCR randonneurs is that if you can get 3 hours of sleep and finish our tougher 600's in 36 hours or less, then you have a good chance to finish PBP. Slower than that &/or less sleep means you are at more risk of running into serious difficulty. FWIW, our tougher 600's have about 23,000 feet of climbing.

What is your RUSA #?

Knowing what your experience is will help us get a better sense of how to answer your questions. Have you ridden a 1000km or 1200km yet? How many 600's have you ridden?

Are you able to ride a tough 600 with little night riding, finishing it with several hours in the bank? If not, then there is no way that you're riding PBP without plenty of night riding.

How you do on 600's should tell you a lot about where you'll need to sleep and when and for how long.

Nick