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  1. #576
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzTallRider View Post
    I was basing things on this: http://ridewithgps.com/routes/75323
    Okay, this is really strange:

    1. Ride website says: "The 103 mile century ride includes challenging hills with approximately 6100 ft of climbing"
    2. The ridewithgps.com route I found, which looks accurate when you compare the elevation profiles, says 8,751 feet of climbing.
    3. A mapmyride.com route I found, which also looks accurate, shows only 4,475 feet

    I guess I'll find out next weekend. I grew up in SD, Hermes, and think you are right that 6,100 seems more likely to be accurate.

    And of course I intend to break all the century rules for this one. I'll (hopefully) be on a new bike, and using a different saddle. The new saddle is a narrower model of what I've been using, and I'm going to ride it this week to show I'm not a total lunatic. If it isn't God's gift to my butt, I'll use the old one.

    Nothing shows whether you got the fit right like a hard century, right?
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  2. #577
    Senior Member Allegheny Jet's Avatar
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    Yesterday's circuit race was conducted in the rain. Once home I washed and lubed the bike, rinsed the shoes and helmet and put them out to dry. I got early and packed up everything needed for today's road race but once there I realized my helmet and shoes were sitting on the laundry room floor over the heater vent.

    Once back home I called a buddy who had sent me an email earlier in the week seeking a Sunday riding partner. I called Dan and he was just heading out the door for his ride. We met up and did 4 x 5min Z4 intervals and 6 x 2 min Z5b intervals over a 39 mile ride together. It was a very productive day in the rain, even though I missed a race.
    oldschool areodynamic brick

  3. #578
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
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    AZT, I lived in La Costa for 5 years and rode the north county routes / climbs. They are not that tough. Now having said that an 1800 foot climb in the middle of a century is going to be hard. Hopefully, you will have great weather.

    Also, I use the climbing information as indicated on my Garmin 705. I find that the programs that import the data tend to overstate climbing a lot. So for comparison purposes, overstatement is okay as long as the error is repeatable.
    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  4. #579
    gone ride'n cyclinfool's Avatar
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    Today it was raining pretty hard, I went to the fitness center at work but had forgotten they were closed. They have a trainer I like that displays power, HR & cadence and has a video display with a pace rider. You program in the type of workout you want and the duration and it gives you something to follow. The pace rider helps you to stay on track, you have to shift going up & down the hills, I can never seem to get the down shifting done fast enough and am always catching back up to the pace rider on the down hills.

    Anyway - I digress, I set up my stationary trainer in the garage and spun for an hour. Today I just couldn't get my HR up above 145, I was working hard, sweating like mad, breathing hard, etc. I settled into a pace that felt like a good effort and just stayed there. My trainer was set up for my MTB and I had not used it since I put road slicks on it. When I tried a few intervals the wheel slipped and I could not tighten the roller any more. So I had to settle for a constant effort. I will have to refit the trainer to my roadie, I just hate to put the wear on them.

    Tomorrow is a rest day, if the weather clears I will drive to Boston to meet a PhD student who's thesis research I am funding, I am going to help guide him through a field experiment, if it isn't raining... Tuesday AM it's back on the sub-LT threshold intervals, again - if it isn't raining.
    "Of all the things I ever lost I miss my mind the most." Mark Twain
    If all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

  5. #580
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
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    Turned on Versus to watch the Tour of California and they canceled stage 1 due to icy roads. I knew it was not going to be good when Paul and Phil were standing outside and it was snowing. A number of friends traveled to Tahoe to ride and watch the tour. Hopefully, the will commence tomorrow.
    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  6. #581
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Power Data from Tour of California

    This link is to Greg Henderson's power data from yesterday's race. He was lead-out for the race winner.

    https://www.trainingpeaks.com/sw/T5K...G7QNEZK66XWY7M

    Quoting Hunter Allen:

    Greg’s normalized power for the race was 274 watts and he spent 18.9% of the stage NOT pedaling(to save energy!) and his final lead out to the finish line was 45 seconds long, averaged 671 watts (max of 1210), an average HR of 190 and cadence of 108rpm. This is really impressive in the fact that he was able to ride at 671 watts for 45 seconds, which goes to show just how talented a sprinter Greg is himself. When you have a world class sprinter leading out another world class sprinter, that’s tough to beat! Greg’s final sprint to launch Ben was 11 seconds long at 1015 watts average, at 39.7mph!!!! Considering that most riders are happy just to generate over 1000watts for a single second, for Greg to do over 1000 in the last 11 seconds ON TOP of the previous 34 seconds? WOW.

    Hermes, thanks for letting me know about the Wattage list... I've been enjoying it and learning a lot.
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  7. #582
    Senior Member Allegheny Jet's Avatar
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    A 45 second sprint would really put the hurt on, especially when your launch with 10 seconds to go. 274 average watts does not seem too hard, but a look at all the 700+ watt efforts during the race brings it to perspective. I averaged 238 watts at Saturday’s race with 23% spent @ 0 watts, however the surges were nothing like the those shown on the data file. If my power file was compared to the pro’s it would look like a corse rip saw blade compared to a fine toothed hacksaw blade.

    Tomorrow is my hard workout for the week and I'll be doing 8 x 30 second L7 intervals. My coach wants me to be able to keep the power over the whole 30 seconds and to make adjustments to the efforts to maintain peak wattage at the finish of the intervals. Sunday's circuit race has a short climb then false flat to the finish line so the workout will be a good experience.
    oldschool areodynamic brick

  8. #583
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    The post race interview of Ben Swift was interesting. Sky's plan was to take control of the peloton at the bell, and he said it didn't work out that way. It sure looked like they had control, but maybe that was a bit earlier - they were spread across the front for awhile, and then maintained the best position, with the most riders. But he said what keyed the win was the positioning of the leadout, which forced the others to go around, while they kept a nice smooth acceleration to the line. Clearly a real team win. It looked like Goss basically used the Sky leadout, then tried to go around for the win, falling short. Great finish to watch.
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  9. #584
    Let's do a Century jppe's Avatar
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    I improved a whopping 5 seconds in my 2nd 10 mile Time Trial. Whooped dee doo!!! Ideally I need to be 90-120 seconds faster.

    I still have not been doing any intensity rides to speak of and it really raises it's head in an individual TT. In fact I really let my HR drift down way too much in the TT and just wasn't putting out the power I needed to the last 5 miles. But, I was only able to get in a 5 minute warmup due to track duties so that probably contributed a little. My focus has been on endurance riding and that is coming along really well. And now the weather is being uncooperative in letting us train like we'd normally like to.
    Ride your Ride!!

  10. #585
    gone ride'n cyclinfool's Avatar
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    It has been heavy rain since Sunday here. When I woke up at 5AM it was either the trainer at the gym or out for the 6AM training ride, there was a break in the rain and my partner showed up outside my garage a few minutes after 6 - so off we went. Today was 9 minute over/under intervals. 3 efforts of 2 minutes sub LT & 1 minute above, then a 6 minute rest and repeat 3 times. Both my partner and I could not get the HR elevated properly in the first interval, we both commented we felt tired. The second interval had a hill right near the start - we hit it hard, my HR hit 185 by the top and from that point on in the workout I had no problem hitting the numbers. I just needed to get the cob webs out.

    Good workout, I am glad tomorrow is a day off. I canceled the PT for tomorrow due to the weather, we will try again for next Wed.
    "Of all the things I ever lost I miss my mind the most." Mark Twain
    If all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

  11. #586
    Senior Member Allegheny Jet's Avatar
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    CF, Doing 2 minutes sub LT then 1 min over LT intervals probably will not show a HR above the LTHR within 3 minutes dur to HR lag. On Sunday I did 5' Z4 intervals with my power just at LT and my HR did not get into Z4 during any of the intervals. My Z4 HR is 149 bpm and I would top out at 146-148 bpm. When I do 4 min Z5 intervals my HR will hit Z4 and even Z5 at the very end. The HR seems to reach the upper levels after the first couple efforts. For short 3' intense efforts it is best to use PE to gauge work.
    oldschool areodynamic brick

  12. #587
    gone ride'n cyclinfool's Avatar
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    AJ,

    You are probably at a much higher fitness level than I. I see my HR move fairly quickly, not immediate - several second of lag but not minutes. I would not expect to hit above LT immediately but after 60 seconds of effort I would expect to see HR there or close - at least for me. Throughout the season I usually use PE but have switch backed to the HRM so as not to fool myself. PE is a good indicator but there is definitely a mood component, us engineers like gauges not guesses
    "Of all the things I ever lost I miss my mind the most." Mark Twain
    If all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

  13. #588
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyclinfool View Post
    AJ,

    You are probably at a much higher fitness level than I. I see my HR move fairly quickly, not immediate - several second of lag but not minutes. I would not expect to hit above LT immediately but after 60 seconds of effort I would expect to see HR there or close - at least for me. Throughout the season I usually use PE but have switch backed to the HRM so as not to fool myself. PE is a good indicator but there is definitely a mood component, us engineers like gauges not guesses
    Power meter or stopwatch. Time over a fixed distance traveled is power. HR is very inaccurate for those type of efforts.
    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  14. #589
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Picked up the new bike (pic's soon) and everything is set except a cassette for the Zipp's. The training wheels have a 11-28 Shimano 105, but I'm thinking the Zipps would think a cassette like that would bring the neighborhood property values down. Not sure whether to go with Ultegra, D/A, or SRAM PG-1070. I have a D/A RD. Opinions?
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  15. #590
    Senior Member Allegheny Jet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzTallRider View Post
    Picked up the new bike (pic's soon) and everything is set except a cassette for the Zipp's. The training wheels have a 11-28 Shimano 105, but I'm thinking the Zipps would think a cassette like that would bring the neighborhood property values down. Not sure whether to go with Ultegra, D/A, or SRAM PG-1070. I have a D/A RD. Opinions?
    I'd probably get Ultergra or Sram and buy a 11/23 and 12/25 for the same $ as the DA. Giving you have a crit cassette and a RR cassette.
    oldschool areodynamic brick

  16. #591
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Allegheny Jet View Post
    I'd probably get Ultergra or Sram and buy a 11/23 and 12/25 for the same $ as the DA. Giving you have a crit cassette and a RR cassette.
    You don't want that 11 cog for both?
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  17. #592
    Senior Member Allegheny Jet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzTallRider View Post
    You don't want that 11 cog for both?
    I love the 18 too much while training and on the road. I can always pedal a few more revs. in the 12 if needed since torque wouldn't be a limiter.
    oldschool areodynamic brick

  18. #593
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    I guess I'll have to work on those 40mph sprints in a 12!
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  19. #594
    Senior Member Allegheny Jet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzTallRider View Post
    I guess I'll have to work on those 40mph sprints in a 12!
    Exactly!, a 53/12 @ 120 rpm = 41.4 mph. Any faster and you'll go plaid.
    oldschool areodynamic brick

  20. #595
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    But you have me confused on the 18, Jet:

    11-12-13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23
    12-13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23-25
    12-13-14-15-16-17-18-19-21-23 <= Shimano only, and the only 18 in that general range.

    I agree you want tight spacing in that 17-19 range.
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  21. #596
    Senior Member Allegheny Jet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzTallRider View Post
    But you have me confused on the 18, Jet:

    11-12-13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23
    12-13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23-25
    12-13-14-15-16-17-18-19-21-23 <= Shimano only, and the only 18 in that general range.

    I agree you want tight spacing in that 17-19 range.
    Don't be confused, I was wrong. The cassette on my CF race wheels is 12/23 and my training/riding wheels is 12/25. If I race with the PowerTap wheel I switch cassettes to fit the type of race.
    oldschool areodynamic brick

  22. #597
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
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    IMO, an all Shimano drive train is the smoothest and quietest. I have SRAM red cassettes and they are fine, just not as quiet and smooth. YMMV.
    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  23. #598
    gone ride'n cyclinfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
    Power meter or stopwatch. Time over a fixed distance traveled is power. HR is very inaccurate for those type of efforts.
    I totally agree that a power meter is the way to go. I am just not ready to make that investment. It is not time over a fixed distance that equals power because there are a lot of other variables such as wind resistance, grade, and system losses. Its torque times angular velocity that equals power. That is how your power meter measures it.

    BTW - I was riding a rode named Hermes road tonight, thought you might like that.
    "Of all the things I ever lost I miss my mind the most." Mark Twain
    If all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

  24. #599
    gone ride'n cyclinfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
    IMO, an all Shimano drive train is the smoothest and quietest. I have SRAM red cassettes and they are fine, just not as quiet and smooth. YMMV.
    What is your feeling about campy? I have both a chorus and ultegra drive trains, IMHO the campy is the smoother, the ultegra is a little quieter.
    "Of all the things I ever lost I miss my mind the most." Mark Twain
    If all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

  25. #600
    gone ride'n cyclinfool's Avatar
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    Those morning interval training rides must be doing some good. Today was supposed to be a rest day, we have been under a big low pressure all week and it has been rainy. Tomorrow is another training ride but the weather looks awful. So when I looked at the radar at 4:30PM and I saw a clear spot for what looked like about 4 hours I decided to participate in a club ride with a group I had not ridden with before. We did 38 miles over rolling terrain, 5 riders (including me) broke off early. We were cruising in the mid 20's for a lot of the ride, the terrain was rolling with no really long hills, just the usual short climbs. But as the small group mixed around I was easily able to close a gap when it occurred. I was riding my steel bike, the one I had the rear hub rebuilt on a month ago. At around mile 17 the front wheel started barking - the bearings were going out in it as well. I had to fight that for the last 20 miles. When it occurred I refrained from taking the lead and cycled back when it was my turn to pull, everyone understood as anyone close could hear my wheel when it was barking. It felt good to be able to maintain that pace for the full ride - we ended with an average of around 18.5 which I consider to be a very good pace considering it' not even June yet. The rain held off.

    Now I just hope it rains in the morning, if it does not my training partner will be outside my house at 6AM and I will pay hell for deviating from the plan.
    "Of all the things I ever lost I miss my mind the most." Mark Twain
    If all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

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