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  1. #2826
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Rider View Post
    Ended up hammered but not as bad as the last one, wherein I coughed up a lung shortly after crossing the finish line.
    You say that as if hacking up a lung is a bad thing.

  2. #2827
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    I just got off the TT bike. The fit is still off, but it's better. I did a scheduled training ride, which included some lengthy efforts above FTP. I had to go on PE and HR because I don't have power on that bike. It was hard, and the numbers sort of bear that out! I noticed that my heart rate, once I started the TT efforts, went to a "sweet spot", right at or a little above LTR, and just sat there. I've never seen it do that before - and it DID hurt! I stayed in the aero bars the entire efforts, and I was going pretty fast on the flats, but that damn TT thing is slower uphill. That's a function of ill fit, I'm sure. I've got some more saddle fiddling to do.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  3. #2828
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    Nice job, Sara.

    When my HR pegs and I can't push it much harder, I'm tired. Like yesterday during criss cross. Tough day on the bike. Lots of lingering effects from the strength work the day before. I bet I start to see some form next week.

  4. #2829
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Takes me a bit to recover from the strength work as well, though it doesn't make me as sore as it did before I had done them a few times. I have a day off, after two cycles of strength last night, with TallWife joining me for one of them.

  5. #2830
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
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    Strength work impact on TSS is a function of duration, intensity AND most importantly the amount one has done and for how long. I am a Cat 1 when it comes to strength training. i have been doing it consistently since 1977. I can do a strength maintenance workout with zero impact to TSS or in fact aid recovery. Likewise, i can crush it and take on fatigue.

    When i trained with the Russians, they had a torture strength circuit at their cycling gym. We had to do 10 sets of 10 to 15 reps over 6 exercises designed to strengthen the pedal stroke. We had to move as quickly as possible from exercise to exercise. The routine took about an hour. After completion, we would quickly get on our bikes that were set up on a trainer and ride 8x 4 to 5 minute low cadence intervals. Now that hour circuit kicked my ass for a couple of days. We had to do that twice per week from October to January 1. Most of the racers hated it but the Russian pros that they trained did it just as we did but with a lot of weight.
    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  6. #2831
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    I think I could do with a shot of testosterone. Water back.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  7. #2832
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    I'm doing a charity ride tomorrow. Poker run. Sigh. When you're shut down for racing, ya gotta do what ya gotta do. I'll do some tempo on the way out and maybe on the way back. Depends if there's beer at the barbeque. Hopefully I won't get run over by a bent. The charity is a local one for kids with cancer, and the brother of the victim rides with us. So at least there's that going for it.

  8. #2833
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    I did a local charity ride a couple of weeks ago, a metric century. It showed me to be in a strange place - I'm considerably faster than that crowd (used to be my crowd) now, while still being considerably slower than experienced racers. They did have home made chocolate chip cookies the size of small pancakes.
    Regards,
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    Demain, on roule!

  9. #2834
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Stay safe Shovel.

  10. #2835
    Old Road Racer Cleave's Avatar
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    I don't mind charity and other fun rides as long as I stay out of charity ride pacelines.
    Thanks.
    Cleave
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  11. #2836
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by revchuck View Post
    I did a local charity ride a couple of weeks ago, a metric century. It showed me to be in a strange place - I'm considerably faster than that crowd (used to be my crowd) now, while still being considerably slower than experienced racers. They did have home made chocolate chip cookies the size of small pancakes.
    Chuck, you bring up my conundrum....I'm "considerably" faster than my casual ride friends (except for a few of the guys, who I CAN hang with for some stretches), but I am a slug compared to serious/experienced racers. As a thread on the 33 said, I'm A Crappy Bike Racer.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  12. #2837
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    I spent a fair amount of time in that "betwixt and between" phase as I worked my way up the learning curve. In its simplest expression, my primary goal when I started training was to "hang with the big dogs". For a long time, that meant falling off the back of tougher and tougher packs of dogs. I finally got to where I could hang with -almost- any group, except for those times (like significant climbs) when a group is going to totally splinter. And of course there are some small get togethers of truly fast guys I'd have no business joining. But being able to do the "A" training race, knowing I wasn't going to be dropped, was a huge accomplishment for me. So what I'm saying is: if you keep up the focused training, you'll get there, and when you do, it will be a real blast. When you can respond to the hard efforts and say "Hey, I'm still here." it's a great feeling.

    I'm just getting back to that point now, after having fallen off the pace post-crash. Not quite where I was in January in some important areas, but I'm getting closer and closer.

    I did 5' criss-cross intervals and then over-gear intervals this morning. That range a bit above FTP (~110%) is one of the areas where I'm not where I was just yet. Hard for me to hold the target power, whereas before it wasn't an issue (and the target was higher). At the same time, I can crank out more power when fatigued than I used to, which is of value. If the 40K on Tuesday comes down to a sprint (not likely!), I'm "Going Gary" on everyone.

  13. #2838
    Senior Member Allegheny Jet's Avatar
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    Our track races were rained out tonight. The last four races I intended to do we're rained out. Doubt is creeping in. I wanted to do a crit in Columbus on Sunday but one or our boys is visiting. Guess I will be riding in the cementery on Sunday doing hard lap/ tempo lap for one hour.
    oldschool areodynamic brick

  14. #2839
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Lots of obstacles this season. Good thing you are so good at sorting out how to do your needed workouts.

  15. #2840
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    AJ, as AzT said, your experience is showing! Hang in there.

    AzT, I did the over-gear intervals yesterday, the 110% and 115%. Man, they were hard! I don't know what my power really was, the TT bike doesn't have power, but PE told me I was burying myself. I'm at that extra 1 - 2% right now, I can see the subtle differences it makes. Thinking about the men's Cat 5 road race I did, and how disappointed I was with not staying in the peloton (I promised myself and Shovel that I would), I see that I did do pretty well, in reality. I was there. I set a PR for over 9 miles, half of that on my own. I could NOT have done that in January. So, yes, I am stronger, probably a little smarter, but OMG do I have a long way to go.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  16. #2841
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    All of us have a long way to go, in our own way.

    Sara, you have done remarkably well, and you are just beginning. Age group racing is where it's at in Masters. You can race up most of the time, and then race on the same page as everyone else. I don't think you've had a chance to do that yet. If PSG is your first shot, then just race smart. You will have the strength.

    Pardon me while I get ready for my fred ride.

  17. #2842
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    All of us have a long way to go, in our own way.

    Sara, you have done remarkably well, and you are just beginning. Age group racing is where it's at in Masters. You can race up most of the time, and then race on the same page as everyone else. I don't think you've had a chance to do that yet. If PSG is your first shot, then just race smart. You will have the strength.

    Pardon me while I get ready for my fred ride.
    "Is that what you're wearing"?

    Have fun, Shovel - be careful!!
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  18. #2843
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Headed out for a recovery ride on the TT bike. I'll bring my saddle tools with me and plan to adjust. What I arrive at for fit after this ride is what I'll have for PSG. It will work.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  19. #2844
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    The adventures of shovelfred, part 2. Long. Warned.

    The idea was to ride to this charity ride and back and get some work in. On the way out, I warm up and then hit the gas for 30-40 minutes of tempo/SST/threshold. I felt good so I knew this would be a good day. I arrive at the ride HQ, register, stash my swim trunks for later, top off my bottles, and get ready to start. Only 15 minutes wait time. Good. We ride easy through town. When we hit a section of long flat road I tell the front of the group that I want to get some work in. They can work with me, ride my wheel, or let me go, their choice. Nobody has any issue with it. I start taking 3 minute pulls. A small group is behind me. They rotate through but only the front two. No problem. Three pulls later and it's down to three. Two more pulls and it's me and one guy, Johnny, a Cat3 cross racer. I'm doing SST to threshold pulls. Johnny and I work for a bit and then he's gone. I decided to keep going and meet up at the first rest stop. I have to stop to get my poker card. So I wait for 15 minutes and none of the front group is anywhere. I decide to move on. I hit the next section, a 13 mile loop with some climbing, at good solid high tempo pace. When I wrap back around to the rest stop, there's Johnny. Hmmm. He latches on and we ride for about 10 miles at low tempo, chatting. We go through the next rest stop, but Johnny is fading on the hills. He's got a compact with an 11-28. I'm on a standard with an 11-23. So I wait at top of the grades but he's OK on the flats. After the next rest stop Johnny is falling apart. We decide that maybe it would be best if he limped in. There were still plenty of riders on the course, he had his cell, and he lives in the area. So I went on ahead, wicking it up for another 10-12 miles of mid tempo to finish it off. I pull into the ride HQ, change into my swim trunks, and drop the core temp in the pool. Temps on the day ranged from 85-95 degrees. I get out of the pool, and ask where the barbeque was. They won't even start cooking for another hour. Damn. I'm down at least 2Kcal and I gotta eat. So I changed back into my kit, headed into town, sat down and had a slice of pizza (barbequed chicken and mushroom) and a beer (Brooklyn Lager). I finished up, and rode endurance home into a headwind. I ended up with 100 miles and 280TSS. During the times I was alone I tried a few town line sprints at about 70% effort, no problem with the shoulder. It was sore when I got home, but that is to be expected. So I met all of my goals for the day. Got a good workout in, had some fun, and tested my shoulder without hurting it.

    Thanks for reading.

  20. #2845
    Old Road Racer Cleave's Avatar
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    ^ Sounds like a heck of a ride and a whole lotta fitness.
    Thanks.
    Cleave
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  21. #2846
    Packfodding 3 caloso's Avatar
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    I had a similarish day as Shovel. I met some teammates at 7, we rode over to Davis, did the Wheelworks ride, and rode back. I finished with 93 miles and 269tss. I considered riding around the park a few times to get the even 100, but then thought better of it.
    Cyclists of the world, unite! You have nothing to lube but your chains!

  22. #2847
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Shovel, shame on you for hurting all of those nice Freds!!! (Heavens, I'm mean!)

    About an hour of recovery on the B2 this morning. I did a little more fiddling with the fit. It's not quite right, maybe Magic Fitter Ex can have a look at me and the bike on Monday and do some hocus-pocus on it. Other than that, I can ride it as is - even though I feel a little scrunched up on it.

    On another note, the carbon wheelset arrived today. They're on the CAAD, along with Koolstop Salmons, and I will try it tomorrow for a short ride. I may be racing those wheels this week - I didn't expect that.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  23. #2848
    Travelling hopefully chasm54's Avatar
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    Looking for a bit of advice, please. Until now I have been racing sparingly, maybe one crit/circuit race per fortnight. That has been easy to work into a training plan. For the next few weeks I am going to be racing two or three times per week, a mixture of crits and road races. Mostly Tuesdays and Saturdays or Sundays, with the occasional Thursday thrown in.

    Obviously I'm going to back off the intensity on the intervening days. I'm thinking I'll maintain the volume, though, with several hours of low-intensity endurance/recovery rides on Wednesday, Friday, and whichever of the weekend days I won't be racing. Any observations?
    There have been many days when I haven't felt like riding, but there has never been a day when I was sorry I rode.

  24. #2849
    Packfodding 3 caloso's Avatar
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    I wonder if you would be better off with just hour-ish recovery rides, assuming you have banked the volume over the spring.
    Cyclists of the world, unite! You have nothing to lube but your chains!

  25. #2850
    Travelling hopefully chasm54's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by caloso View Post
    I wonder if you would be better off with just hour-ish recovery rides, assuming you have banked the volume over the spring.
    Say more, please? I have banked a lot of volume over the winter/spring, and I'm absolutely on board with the need not to overtrain, but the races will mostly be short (40-50 minute crits, two-hour RRs once a fortnight) and I'm thinking just make them my HIIT sesions and continue to build the rest of the time. I've been reading some stuff about how increasing volume while decreasing the proportion of high-intensity work seems to give good results and thinking about how that mig play out during the racing season.
    There have been many days when I haven't felt like riding, but there has never been a day when I was sorry I rode.

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