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  1. #76
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Today is pace effort on the road bike that will total ~100'. Similar effort tomorrow but on the TT bike. Saturday is an opener for a 30K TT Sunday morning about 2 hours away. Then I'm off to visit my son in Sonoma County for 5 days: with wife, sans bike. Major rest week, with lots of food and wine consumption.
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  2. #77
    Don't mince words Red Rider's Avatar
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    Rode some hills today. Time to prime the legs for next month's races.
    When my feet hit the floor in the morning, Satan shudders and says, "Oh, *****, she's awake!"

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  3. #78
    Old Road Racer Cleave's Avatar
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    I wish there were bigger hills closer to the coast in SoCal.
    Thanks.
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  4. #79
    Senior Member VanceMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cleave View Post
    I wish there were bigger hills closer to the coast in SoCal.
    Heh. I don't think you're going to get a lot of sympathy on that one, Cleave.

  5. #80
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cleave View Post
    I am glad that the terrain is flat near my house closer to the coast in SoCal.
    fify.

    Granted, the terrain around Long Beach is flat although VSP has 45 degree climbing albeit short. If one starts south of Newport Coast Drive on PCH by the shopping center and commences an effort all the way to the highest point via Newport Coast Drive, it will be similar to what RR was climbing. The last 3/4 of a mile was 10% grade, as I recall.

    Cleave took me on a climbing ride up Newport Coast Drive.
    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  6. #81
    Senior Member Allegheny Jet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzTallRider View Post
    Today is pace effort on the road bike that will total ~100'. Similar effort tomorrow but on the TT bike. Saturday is an opener for a 30K TT Sunday morning about 2 hours away. Then I'm off to visit my son in Sonoma County for 5 days: with wife, sans bike. Major rest week, with lots of food and wine consumption.
    Please report to the " how fat I am" thread upon arrival back home.
    oldschool areodynamic brick

  7. #82
    Senior Member ericm979's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cleave View Post
    I wish there were bigger hills closer to the coast in SoCal.
    You're not close to Decker/Mulholland/Topanga/etc? There's some nice climbs there.

    I lived in Westminster when I started serious cycling. No climbs near there, just the river trail.

  8. #83
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
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    I was not sure where to put this video since it is cool but not a race video. MEA and I did a motor pacing / training session at Hellyer Track. We lined up our supervisor / motor pacer and scheduled the session. We were the only ones that showed up so we had the track to ourselves on a beautiful morning. I wanted to try the Fast Forward wheels behind the motor to see if the turbulence affected handling. We had some wind in a couple of places on the track. The front five spoke is more finicky behind the motor when there are cross winds. It was not a problem but there is a point where too much wind will render the 5 point less than optimum.

    I decided to shoot some video using my iPhone. I shot MEA and she shot me. I made the video using iMovie and my initial idea was to create a cool video with some great music. However, once I put the two of us on the same video behind the motor, there were some areas of work that need attention.

    Her position is getting close to perfect and we are going to try 167.5 cranks. However her back is flat but she needs to turtle her head more. That was not a goal behind the motor. She could possible go down a couple more millimeters.

    My position is much improved but compared to hers, I could go down 4 cm. That may be an exaggeration but I am too high keeping in mind I am 5 cm lower than last year. If I can get 3 to 4 cm lower at my current power, I may be more competitive with my friend who won state this year in pursuit in our age group.

    And yes, she is going faster than I am but not by much. I put in her fastest segments while the only video I have of me is the middle laps of the effort. On the last lap she was doing 36 mph in 90 gear inches which is about 130 rpm. She is in the pole lane and I am farther up track so I am covering a longer distance.

    I find we learn a lot by taking and reviewing video. I hope you like my videography keeping in mind it was shot with an iPhone!

    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  9. #84
    Old Road Racer Cleave's Avatar
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    Hermes, it must be nice to have a facility like that to yourself for training and video analysis. That is surprisingly good video from a cell phone. (Yes, I know it's not just any cell phone.) You make one point which is one of my biggest interests in getting a power meter; finding the sweet spot for TT position versus power.

    I may go on an easy and flat ride on my TT bike tonight as I'm still recovering from my weight loss episode.
    Thanks.
    Cleave
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  10. #85
    Old Road Racer Cleave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ericm979 View Post
    You're not close to Decker/Mulholland/Topanga/etc? There's some nice climbs there.

    I lived in Westminster when I started serious cycling. No climbs near there, just the river trail.
    Hi ericm979, I live in Long Beach so you know the terrain. As Hermes noted, the climbing with the easiest access is Newport Coast and Spyglass Hill, but it's 20+ miles to ride down there. Turnbull Canyon is a bit closer but it's ugly getting there unless you ride the river trail all the way there. The best climbs that I can ride to are Palos Verdes Peninsula. However, the ride to get there is really bad going through Wilmington. I like riding in the Santa Monica Mountains but that's the worst drive as I have to go through the West Side and traffic is always bad. The easiest car travel is the San Gabriel Mountains (GMR, Highway 39, Baldy). Overall, I try to avoid driving to get to training since I drive to races so often.
    Thanks.
    Cleave
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  11. #86
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Nice, Hermes. The video is right up there in quality with that posted from 'real cameras'.

    According to our wind tunnel guy, lower is not always less resistance, but then he pushes the 'everyone is different' mantra, and I believe part of it is to get everyone in for tunnel time. <shrug>
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  12. #87
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzTallRider View Post
    Nice, Hermes. The video is right up there in quality with that posted from 'real cameras'.

    According to our wind tunnel guy, lower is not always less resistance, but then he pushes the 'everyone is different' mantra, and I believe part of it is to get everyone in for tunnel time. <shrug>
    One would speculate that the least frontal area is getting close to optimum position. Then it gets down to the shape of the airfoil. So lower may be less area but a poorer shape. If I had local access to a wind tunnel, I would use one in a heart beat. I have to fly with bike(s) to the tunnel.

    Cleave, I have heard the mantra of finding the sweet spot for a lower position versus power. Given what I have observed for MEA and me, lower is better. The problem is that changing to a new position requires adaptation so that initial measurements may be wrong. This is where a tunnel would be valuable so that one would know the ideal position and then work incrementally over time to see if one can get there.

    However, your position is very good. For comparative purposes, here you are close to the Terminator. We will not discuss how you got there. BTW, it is an exclusive club to belong to of which yours truly is also a member.

    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  13. #88
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Hermes, that was nice of you!

    Great video. Your choice of music was appropriate, too. Excellent job!

    Cleave, I have been privileged to study MEA's aero position in much the same fashion as you did the Terminator. The only issue was that she went by so fast I couldn't get more than a glimpse. I hate that!

    "Hunger Games" in spin class today. What was good about that was the game is timed, calculated efforts - in RPM and friction. We started with 5 15 second on one minute off seated efforts at 110 RPM, then the friction was increased, and an OTS easy pace was done for five minutes, then seated 30 second on one minute off efforts at 100 RPM. Finally, we did 4 20 second high friction 90 RPM efforts with one minute recovery between each. I felt really good on each of them! I really feel spin class can be beneficial, if it's done properly. It has been for me. My spin instructor knows the game, she's read Joe Friel and she's a cyclist, as I've said. Interestingly, as I've improved, she's ramped up the efforts, but there are more people in that class then ever before! No one has left, and no one complains. Pretty special!
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  14. #89
    Don't mince words Red Rider's Avatar
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    Shop ride this morning. Usually this is low-key enough that I use it for a recovery ride.

    Today 3 race teammates joined on and we went longer and faster than usual. At the top of Cantelow I caught up to them; they were just a few seconds ahead of me. Granted, they were taking it easy, versus my almost red-lining and shattering my legs.

    Good training for me.
    When my feet hit the floor in the morning, Satan shudders and says, "Oh, *****, she's awake!"

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  15. #90
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Rider View Post
    Shop ride this morning. Usually this is low-key enough that I use it for a recovery ride.

    Today 3 race teammates joined on and we went longer and faster than usual. At the top of Cantelow I caught up to them; they were just a few seconds ahead of me. Granted, they were taking it easy, versus my almost red-lining and shattering my legs.

    Good training for me.

    Way to kill it, girl!!
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  16. #91
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    I went out for an easy recovery ride after yesterdays hammer fest. I was taking it easy. So then, why did I elevate my heart rate to ridiculous levels and set PR's on portions of the ride? Easy is getting easier? I dunno...

    It's here...
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  17. #92
    Don't mince words Red Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarals View Post
    I went out for an easy recovery ride after yesterdays hammer fest. I was taking it easy. So then, why did I elevate my heart rate to ridiculous levels and set PR's on portions of the ride? Easy is getting easier? I dunno...

    It's here...
    Recovery fail.

    But a good ride,anyway.
    When my feet hit the floor in the morning, Satan shudders and says, "Oh, *****, she's awake!"

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  18. #93
    Old Road Racer Cleave's Avatar
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    Hi, I don't do recovery rides with groups unless they are specifically designated as recovery rides. Even then, if someone tries to push the pace, I drop off the back and say, "See you later."
    Thanks.
    Cleave
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  19. #94
    Senior Member tony2v's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarals View Post
    I went out for an easy recovery ride after yesterdays hammer fest. I was taking it easy. So then, why did I elevate my heart rate to ridiculous levels and set PR's on portions of the ride? Easy is getting easier? I dunno...

    It's here...
    I know what you mean Sara. I went out yesterday for my recovery ride watch people ride by and stayed in the small chainring smiling. Yet somehow I set two PR.......WTH!
    Track class tonight, then Keirin racing Tues night for the A/B racers. Where's my arm pads?

  20. #95
    Old Road Racer Cleave's Avatar
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    Tried to make the best of what was supposed to be a significant building week for nationals. My gastric distress really drained me and I didn't want to do more damage by coming out of it too hard.

    I was finally able to get on the bike on Wednesday and did 15 flat miles in 59 minutes (riding time). Thursday was 22 miles with my heart rate firmly and purposefully in the middle of Z2. Just for variety and to keep myself acclimated to my TT position I rode 30 miles on Friday in Z2 HR on my TT bike. I was starting to feel human after that ride.

    I did 46 miles on Saturday with a couple of short forays into Z3, including getting on this guys wheel during the headwind return trip. He was pretty strong and reasonably smooth doing 25 MPH into the wind. I thanked him well before he turned off. A gesture that I think he appreciated since he didn't try to drop me.

    I originally wanted to do 100 rolling miles on Sunday but my riding buddy had to cancel and I definitely didn't feel up to doing it solo (I can only talk to myself so much.) Ended up doing my club ride with a few extra miles to get to 100 Km. It was somewhat hilly and on the biggest climb I got to mid-Z3 and held it. Did a hard effort on a rolling section of the route and tried to do my share of pulling on the rest of the ride. Legs are tired today.

    Amping up the intensity this week.
    Thanks.
    Cleave
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  21. #96
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    I was tired in spin class today. Kadria picked up on my low energy right away, and then grilled me afterwards about my sleep cycles (not great as of late). I also had, umm, saddle sores (the kind we ladies get) and that was enough of a distraction to keep my cadence down. It really affected my form, too, although I was okay OTS. I guess two days of riding well spent me more than I expected, plus my weight is down (see the Fatty thread).

    I really need to get going on a training plan and schedule. I haven't finished the first chapter of Friel, yet. Get moving, Sara....
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  22. #97
    Travelling hopefully chasm54's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarals View Post
    I was tired in spin class today. Kadria picked up on my low energy right away, and then grilled me afterwards about my sleep cycles (not great as of late). I also had, umm, saddle sores (the kind we ladies get) and that was enough of a distraction to keep my cadence down. It really affected my form, too, although I was okay OTS. I guess two days of riding well spent me more than I expected, plus my weight is down (see the Fatty thread).

    I really need to get going on a training plan and schedule. I haven't finished the first chapter of Friel, yet. Get moving, Sara....
    Sara, you really have to start taking seriously your need to recover. One day you go out on a "hammerfest". The next you go out on a "recovery" ride during which you go faster than ever before and take your HR to (I quote) "ridiculous" levels, and the day after you do a spin class? None of us are nineteen any more, training like that doesn't make you fit, it just makes you tired. It would me, anyway...

  23. #98
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasm54 View Post
    Sara, you really have to start taking seriously your need to recover. One day you go out on a "hammerfest". The next you go out on a "recovery" ride during which you go faster than ever before and take your HR to (I quote) "ridiculous" levels, and the day after you do a spin class? None of us are nineteen any more, training like that doesn't make you fit, it just makes you tired. It would me, anyway...
    I know. Believe me, I know. I refuse to buy into my age. It's a complex form of denial, and I know it's not doing me any good. That's why I need a plan. And someone to kick me in the ass every now and then.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  24. #99
    Resident Alien Racer Ex's Avatar
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    Sara, the need for recovery is not age related, the duration for recovery is. Riders in their 20's over train as much or more than riders our age. They bounce back a bit quicker is all. Sending you a PM regarding a plan.

    90 minute climbing ride today. Legs were better than expected after swimming in lactic at the crit yesterday. Hot here...102 on the SRM. 45 minutes into the ride I proceed up Can de los Muertos Piernas. It's an old access road that averages 13.5% for a bit over 1/2 a mile with pitches to 18%. Brutal. Did a few more short "normal" climbs and came home and jumped in the pool to cool off.

    Coach asked for .8 IF. I ended up at .79 for the ride.

  25. #100
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Racer Ex View Post
    Sara, the need for recovery is not age related, the duration for recovery is. Riders in their 20's over train as much or more than riders our age. They bounce back a bit quicker is all. Sending you a PM regarding a plan.
    Ex - thank you. That's very kind of you!
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

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