Hermes

TT workout on Fiesta Island. Got there before it became hot and the wind picked up.

revchuck 

Two hours yesterday with an hour of it in Z3. 1:45 at endurance pace today, with 5x2' VO2 intervals averaging 130%.

Three weekends from now I'm going to do centuries on two consecutive days, just because I've never tried that before. Then I'm going to take a break from the bike for a short while, haven't figured out exactly what I'll be doing. In mid-December, I'll have at least a week off the bike as well due to having to do a PSA test and visit with my radiological oncologist to see how my prostate cancer is doing. I'm going to try to schedule my colonoscopy during that week as well so I can get that out of the way without messing up my riding.

Getting old ain't for wimps.

Hermes

Saturday - 2.5 endurance ride along the coast and on the way back hit fog rolling in off the ocean. WTF. I find the constant power endurance rides very fatiguing compared to short hard neuromuscular or anaerobic threshold intervals.

Sunday - no riding but a leg strength training workout at the gym.

revchuck 

Today's workout was a repeat of the one above, but with one more interval. I did it in the afternoon rather than in the morning, and apparently I'm not an afternoon person. This one felt harder, power was down about five watts from the last time and I did the last one right at the coach-imposed power floor...barely. At about the 1:30 point in the last two-minute interval it felt like the pavement turned into peanut butter. According to Training Peaks, I was about at 700 kj at that point so it shouldn't have been a lack of fuel, guess it was just accumulated fatigue. Recovery week starts tomorrow.

LAJ

I agree, @Hermes. Z2-3, never stop pedaling, at the end of a block, just hurt.

Hermes

Long constant power workouts are rigged against us.

sarals 

Flying my butt off at work and getting home late every night. Makes for great training, especially with the shorter days.

Back is better, it gets stiff, but it's coming along. I'm pretty ginger about hard efforts on the bike, but I did let things hang out at the velodrome last week. I'm feeling a bit sluggish, and I am certainly not on form right now. However, "I will rebuild".

In other news, one of my team mates (Y, @Hermes) broke her left collarbone in a cross race this past Sunday. She's going to be out for eight weeks. She's our team leader and our chief recruiter for other master's women (she's been leading recruitment rides as well as organizing them). That's a shock and loss!!

Hermes

I saw that YW broke her collarbone on Facebook and already hated it.

3x20' efforts on Fiesta Island yesterday followed by upper body strength training.

It is interesting that Fiesta Island is actually hard to ride. For a racer used to 40 feet of climbing per mlle (Canada TT course) of riding, flat terrain should be easy. However, it is not. Holding constant power on flat terrain with varying wind conditions almost seems harder than the trainer if that is possible. Even though wind should have a similar effect as a hill, it does not offer the same feeling as climbing a slight grade. It just seems like it is harder without making it easier to make power.

I assume over time, I will improve both mentally and physically such that the flat terrain will not be a factor.

revchuck 

@Hermes - I find it interesting that you have a hard time maintaining steady power on the trainer - IME, it's easier to do that on a trainer than on the road in any conditions. I'm with you concerning the wind, though. I once used a route along the Mississippi River levee that followed the bends in the river and was lined with alternating trees and pastures on the side across from the levee. Steady power was a pipe dream on that road!

Heathpack 

@Hermes, I think it will get easier.


I was torn when I first got the TT bike as to whether riding on the trainer was better vs on the road. On the trainer, I am much better about hitting power targets, so you get a big bang for your buck with the workouts. But on the road, you get to practice bike handling, which is a huge factor when you're riding a weirdo TT bike. However the big thing I noticed on the TT bike is that making power seems very different to me whether you are going uphill, going downhill, or on flats. I don't know that I ever really appreciated the difference quite as distinctly on the road bike- the differences are there for sure, but its much subtler and you have more ways to vary your posture/position on the bike to change your power output. Whereas it seems to me on the TT bike that you just have to develop the ability to put out power in all terrains, its like you have to work each of these abilities separately.


So bottom line is that I try to do all the TT workouts on the road and I try to include flats, up and down hill sections routinely. It definitely gets easier, so I think its just a matter of practice and adaptation. Who knows for sure, though? Each of us makes power a little differently, I think.

Hermes

I have no problem maintaining constant power on the trainer, on flat terrain, hilly terrain, climbing and etc. It is the "feeling" or level of power that is different. It is easier for me to make 250 watts climbing versus flat to rolling terrain with wind versus perfectly flat terrain with wind. Generally, I have to reduce my power by 10% when on the trainer versus the road vis a vis FTP. I find that I have to reduce my power for workouts with perfectly flat terrain versus climbing.

revchuck 

Ah, got it. I do recall doing a long (~20 mile) steady climb in Utah and noticing how easy it was to hold my power in a relatively narrow range.

Hermes

Here is article about the differences in how our energy and muscles work when climbing and going fast on flat terrain.

Climbing vs time-trialling: same effort, different power output | CyclingTips

Hermes

BTW, the CyclingTips article probably has detractors, haters, lovers and so whats. IMO, it is more food for thought.

Heathpack 

I have no idea if the physics/science is right. But I totally appreciate that on the TT bike, I notice a lot of differences in the qualitative feel of the pedaling, depending on what I'm doing. Up/down/flat combined varyingly with pedaling slow/normal/fast. I do all those things in different combos and they all have their own unique feel. Interestingly I like all these different combos. In short: I like pedaling. Good thing, I guess, since that's all you do in a TT.

I also notice major differences in the pedaling quality on the MTB vs road bike vs TT bike. Huge differences in the leverage you can get on bikes with different postures and in which you can move around much more.

Pedaling musings.

Racer Ex 

We incorporate a lot of different sensations when gauging an effort. When we have input that is less familiar (changing gradient, changing to a different position, throwing in wind) we can have difficulty processing the feedback loop, which often creates a break in focus. Or a break in focus keeps us from doing a good job in processing the feedback loop. Loss of focus could be internally or externally created.

Some folks here have seen some of my TT files from various courses; they are pretty much flat lines. I have a small set of internal and external inputs, and a pretty limited conversation in my head. Up/down/flat really doesn't change anything other than tweaking the effort up or down to hit my targets. That comes from hours and hours on the TT bike on a wide variety of courses. It also comes from visualization prior to riding the course.

"The more I practice, the luckier I get" so to speak.

The physics of riding uphill vs. downhill or switching to a fixed gear or an oval chain ring changes the feedback loop. And it can change the total load through each pedal stroke, especially if you're a choppier peddler. Most PM's have at most 4 strain gauges; you're looking at a sampling of power, not 100% of effort. So change where you apply power in the stroke because of a gradient change (which also changes your effective position on the bike) and yep, power readings will be different.

That's part of the "indoor" training issue. Add in localized heat dissipation and localized ambient 02 degradation and you will end up with lower targets.

Bandera

Fitted out the old FG for long distance w/ two bottle cages, re-mounted the frame pump as usual.
With 100 miles to cover and long distances between available water for the upcoming "FG Death March" I stole the low spoke count front CF composite wheel from the CF Merckx and fitted a double bottle cage behind the saddle.

Drove down to the midpoint of the route for a dress rehearsal/shake-down this AM.
15 miles into the 10-15mph wind and back w/ cadence & HRM fitted in mid-80's temps.

Been riding this machine for 39 years in one configuration or other, takes zero concentration to put it where it needs to be on any road surface.
The old school steel road racing machines can make excellent FG conversions.

70GI will work fine if I put out the grunt and relentlessness in my usual style.
A more aerodynamic wheel can't hurt and might freak out my old teammate that I'm going all Hi-Teck on him.

Bottles behind the saddle are Out, they F-up the ride quality and jounce around annoyingly, back to one in a jersey pocket.
I'll call ahead this week to make SURE that the H2O/food stops we used before still exist on the route.

Glad I'll have a sturdy ex-trackie teammate to share pace with, a nice seafood supper and a few Shiner Bocks when done.
Certainly not a "Race" (but I will Sprint at the end) and it gives the Elderly something to do while waiting for re-runs of "Murder She Wrote".

-Bandera

Racer Ex 

Sunday TV has never been the same since Welk went to Youtube.

Racer Ex 

Two plus hours on the MTB yesterday. Beautiful 75 degree day. Decided to go explore a bit, and follow in the footsteps of the Donner Party. Drove the bike out to Verdi and parked near a bunch of ATV trailers near the start of Henness Pass Road. (Note: images not mine, got to remember to bring the Camelback on longer rides like this so I have some room and don't have to stuff my pockets to overflow)



A few feet into the ride I crossed from Nevada to California. Next 5 miles was straight up at 5-8%. Hit the junction overlooking Dog Valley, one of the Donner's stops:



Checking out the signs I could ride down and out north towards Crystal Peak and the old mine, or continue to the summit of Henness. Upward. This section of road was laden with quartz, speaking to the volcanic nature of the area; a few years ago an earthquake cluster was centered a few miles away, 602 quakes later things calmed down. For now.

Picked up a small sample to fill the pocket space from my jacket.

At the "summit" of the pass, around 6600', hit another junction. Continue up 6.5 miles to Verdi Peak or down into Stampede/Boca valley?

Upward.

By this point the temp had dropped into the low 60's and the wind kicked up. Following my usual protocol when riding long in the mountains I had brought a jacket. Glad I did.

Riding through the light and shadows of the forest, the road opened up into bright sunlight. in 1994 a wildfire burned 4000 acres here; reforestation has started but it's still a pretty stark contrast. Through the old burn and continue up. Stop to enjoy the view:



Donner Party camped near the upper reservoir. Hit another junction. Left looked like a straight up bit of wash, right was a less steep climb and the road in better shape. Figured this was likely the road to Verdi Peak.

Wrong.

Another 25 minutes of climbing and I was in the 8000' area. Had passed the 6.5 mile mark, and hadn't seen or heard anyone, it was getting colder and the sun was dropping. Figured 1:45 of non stop climbing was enough. Time to turn around and head home.

When I'm off the beaten path I pretty much hold back on the descents, especially on fire roads where you hit sections of marbles over hard pack. 35 minutes later I was back in Verdi. Took the Donner Party a whole day just to get the wagons to Dog Valley.

Spoiled in having great trails right out my door, really need to do these types of rides more often. Watching it rain right now. Hitting the gym then probably Zwift it for a bit.

revchuck 

Nice!

Heathpack 

@Racer Ex, I love the MTB ride. Just the overall vibe of going out there are riding and seeing where it goes.

revchuck 

Recovery week. 1:00 at recovery pace Monday, rest day Tuesday, 1:30 recovery pace yesterday. Today was 2:00 endurance pace with an hour at Z3 in the middle of it, felt good. Rest day tomorrow.

Got my flu shot yesterday. My sinuses started draining last night and went into faucet mode around lunch today. This isn't listed as a side effect of getting a flu shot, but anecdotally it seems to happen a lot. I don't feel that bad, but it bothers the hell out of me.

Endurance pace ride Saturday, then nose returns to grindstone for a few days before lightening up for next weekend's long rides.

revchuck 

I'm glad yesterday was a rest day, I got about 50 TSS just blowing my nose. It was apparently due to some kind of allergy. Much better today.

1:30 at endurance pace on an almost perfect day for riding. My legs are feeling good, ready to return nose to grindstone. That starts tomorrow.

I've got a new goal event for next year: Cheaha Challenge Ultra, 124 miles, >13k of climbing. That's three times as much climbing as I've done on a ride. I may crash and burn...then again, I might just do it.

Heathpack 

No way! Such a small world. This event is organized by the mother of one of our surgery residents. I've heard all about it and seen the drone videos (which were taken by the resident who I work with). It sounds like a really great event, he keeps trying to talk me into flying back to Alabama with him to do it. This year, I can't do it, its the day after the SoCal State TT. He is going to be so stoked though when I tell him you're going to give it a whirl. That family is so into that event and making it as awesome as it can possibly be. You are in for a treat (in a maximum suffer kind of way).

Heathpack 

Some TT workouts for me this week. That is going better, I'm happy to report. Not feeling like a monster on the TT bike by any means. But a little less like a titmouse. So moving in the right direction. I have a race next weekend, so that should be interesting...


Yesterday I had some not-too-hard intervals to do before the Fri morning coffee ride. But it rained in the morning, so we turned the morning coffee ride into a happy hour beer ride. I did my intervals on the road bike and then we just did some climbing on the mountain bikes. Why mountain bikes? No real reason (we were riding on the road), except we knew there would be some sand/rock/debris where we were going and there was.


We wound up doing 1200 ft of climbing over 19 miles. Slowpoke style. Only 5 of us rode, but 4 more came to happy hour. It was really fun.


Here's one of my nightcrawler friends coming up the valley we climbed into. Its called Mentryville and the road is a normal maintained road but closed to traffic and surrounded by a county park. They keep the road in good shape because there are some oil and gas wells up in the hills and they need to be able to have occasional access to the wells, although most of the road access comes from another direction.





Today we did a 50 mile/4200 ft ride up to Devil's Punchbowl, the ride start is about a 30 min drive for us. The Punchbowl is a weird geologic formation with this big upwelling of rocks from tectonic movements. Out in the desert north of town. Good day for it, it was cloudy and cool. So beautiful, with the sage all covered with yellow flowers and the deep golden grasses and the ground wet and dark from the rain, with Joshua Trees looming over everything.


I hung back at the start to wait for a friend who didn't roll out of the parking lot right away. I really wanted to be up front with the fast people, because they are the best pace liners. Took me 7 miles/35 minutes (to the top of the first climb) to catch the fast people, I was working it. My friend didn't even try, just wound up riding with the medium-fast group.


We had fun pace lining through the desert and stopped for a photo op.





My friend Nina, in the foreground of this pic, has been off the bike for 14 month with a disastrously-botched clavicle fracture repair. Behold the power of spin class, she is strong right now.


Finally we got to that final climb into Devil's Punchbowl, which comes after 10ish miles of going slightly up, around 3%. But the Punchbowl climb is 1.2 miles at around 8.2% ave grade. Its tough and my legs were kind of toasted after chasing people for the first 7 miles. Got dropped and wound up arriving 2-3 minutes after everyone else.


Here's the Punchbowl rocks. weird, right?





And here we are, happy to be taking a little break:





Then back on the road again, back through the same desert that we came in through. I never took any pics (these are pics texted to me by friends), I was sure someone would get something of the sage blooming madly. Nope. But you can really get a feel for the desert roads in the pic, it will have to do.





Tomorrow a local women's MTB clinic, although it might rain again.


And Nina says to me on today's ride: Hey do you want to do the Triple Bypass in Colorado with us this summer? We already have a 5 BR house and a little group going. OMG. Tempted, even though I'm a pit of misery at altitude. I'll look and see if they have a shorter route, because I really like the people who are going.