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  1. #101
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
    Nice pics Sara. Six pins in the number and none of the through the hole with all the pins lined up in the direction of the airflow.
    Hermes, thank you! Nothing quite so honest as being out in public working so hard you could care less what kind of a face you're making! Thanks for the "pin" tip - I'm still trying to sort out that art. At least the numbers go on right side up, now. I may try AzT's suggestion of the spray on adhesive.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  2. #102
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarals View Post
    I may try AzT's suggestion of the spray on adhesive.
    I try to never go out without it. If I forgot to bring it and couldn't borrow some, it'd bother me the whole race. And with the glue, 4 pins (minimum per the rules) is fine. Without it, I feel like I need 8 to keep it aero, and then I'd be too heavy!
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  3. #103
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarals View Post
    Hermes, thank you! Nothing quite so honest as being out in public working so hard you could care less what kind of a face you're making! Thanks for the "pin" tip - I'm still trying to sort out that art. At least the numbers go on right side up, now. I may try AzT's suggestion of the spray on adhesive.
    Racing is all about details and incremental improvement. It is the process not the results that matter. Results will come.

    I use the spray adhesive but only for TTs and track. The glue can be problematic to remove from your jersey. On my skin suit, I really do not care. According to USA cycling rules there must be at least 4 pins in the number. So for TTs, I glue on the number and then install four pins in line with the airflow. As an aviator, you have to see the merit in this.
    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  4. #104
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
    The glue can be problematic to remove from your jersey.
    I don't know if it is the specific glue I use, or the technique, but so far I haven't had this problem while using it every race. I have two jerseys, and both look fine so far. No glue buildup, and no noticeable deterioration of the fabric. I lay the jersey out and decide exactly where the number will go, dust the back of the number lightly with 3M "77" spray, let it dry a few seconds, and then press the number on and pin it. Using another glue I borrowed once wasn't nearly as secure. I see people racing with flapping numbers, even in TT's, and shake my head. Details!
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  5. #105
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
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    I use the same technique and glue but I have the Voler skin suits which has the slippery material. I suspect it is a function of the fabric where the glue may adhere better to the fabric than paper.
    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  6. #106
    Senior Member George's Avatar
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    Hi sarals, how do you like the Look, for the racing your doing?
    George

  7. #107
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
    I use the same technique and glue but I have the Voler skin suits which has the slippery material. I suspect it is a function of the fabric where the glue may adhere better to the fabric than paper.
    Makes sense. We'll see how well it does with a Hincapie skinsuit - buying one from a teammate Sunday, if it fits.
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  8. #108
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzTallRider View Post
    Makes sense. We'll see how well it does with a Hincapie skinsuit - buying one from a teammate Sunday, if it fits.
    Tall order....

    ...oops!
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  9. #109
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Hermes, I absolutely see the merit in having an "aerodynamically clean" attachment of that number. On the one photo what jumped right out at me was the cupped number plate and how much air that was probably grabbing (not that I'd feel in my current state of fitness). No question that it looks shabby! AzT, I have some of the 3M adhesive - I use it to mount photos - I'll try it out on an older jersey with an old number bib (am I the only one who doesn't throw those things away?).
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  10. #110
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by George View Post
    Hi sarals, how do you like the Look, for the racing your doing?
    Hi, George!

    Is that your current bike I see as your avatar?

    The 566 has one really great thing going for it. It corners like it's on rails. I have ridden motorcycles for ages, and the best handling ones I ever ridden don't have a thing on that Look. It's stable, always feels planted, gives great feedback, and it is not bothered by surface irregularities. It will change lines without protest, too - although it took a little time to get used to the quick steering. The faster it goes, the better it corners - it's a joy on descents!

    Now, the not so great things. There are two, and I'd weigh them equally. The rear triangle is soft, and power transfer is mushy. The bike doesn't "jump" when you stomp on the pedals - it soaks up some of that energy. The other foible (not a flaw) is that the seating position is rather upright. I can't get as low as I'd like hence as aero. It has a high head tube. I've dropped the stem one spacer on the steerer, and I turned the stem over, as well. It's better, but still not right. The bike was designed as a "sport tourer" (my description) and it does that superlatively. However, those things that make it so great as a distance bike hinder it in criterium style racing. Mind you, I'm a rank novice, and the bike is just fine for me at my current level. I will outgrow it, though.

    How do you like yours?
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  11. #111
    Senior Member George's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarals View Post
    Hi, George!

    Is that your current bike I see as your avatar?

    The 566 has one really great thing going for it. It corners like it's on rails. I have ridden motorcycles for ages, and the best handling ones I ever ridden don't have a thing on that Look. It's stable, always feels planted, gives great feedback, and it is not bothered by surface irregularities. It will change lines without protest, too - although it took a little time to get used to the quick steering. The faster it goes, the better it corners - it's a joy on descents!

    Now, the not so great things. There are two, and I'd weigh them equally. The rear triangle is soft, and power transfer is mushy. The bike doesn't "jump" when you stomp on the pedals - it soaks up some of that energy. The other foible (not a flaw) is that the seating position is rather upright. I can't get as low as I'd like hence as aero. It has a high head tube. I've dropped the stem one spacer on the steerer, and I turned the stem over, as well. It's better, but still not right. The bike was designed as a "sport tourer" (my description) and it does that superlatively. However, those things that make it so great as a distance bike hinder it in criterium style racing. Mind you, I'm a rank novice, and the bike is just fine for me at my current level. I will outgrow it, though.

    How do you like yours?
    Thanks for the reply sarals, I rode motorcycles for years and sometimes I wonder why I stopped. On the other hand I'm glad I took up cycling.

    I like my Look was better than my Specialized Roubaix, that I just sold, but I to wish it were a little stiffer. When I'm out sprinting, I feel like I should be going faster than the effort I putting into it, but I think a lot of that is just me. The fastest I've gone on a 30 second sprint is 27 mph. When I'm doing sprints I usually do 30 second sprints, I take 2 min. rest between sprints and by the time I get done my legs feel like noodles.

    I really like the bike, but I think I would like to get something with a little more snap to it. I have the XL and I added the FSA 32 mm setback seat post and that helped me get down as low as I care to be. I got fit a few weeks ago and I have 60 cm from the nose of my saddle to the center of the handlebars, with a 6 cm drop. The fitter told me I probably should be on a 60 cm bike. The Look is only 57.4 so that was giving me a little problem. That setback seat post put me pretty close to where I have to be. I really feel balanced on the bike now.

    Your right on with what you said about going down hill. I was going 35 mph down hill and I was tempted to let go of the handlebars, just to see how it would feel. I was hardly holding onto the bars and it was really stable.

    Anyhow I've been eyeing the Cervelo R 3. I haven't taken it out for a ride yet, but looking at the BB it looks like it should be stiffer than the Look. The down tube is also bigger, but the head tube is longer than the Look, but that's on the 60 cm bike. It really sounds like the bike would do the trick for me and the price is right, but I have to wait and see what happens around here. I just paid $175 for the seat post $180 for shoes $75 for new Shimano pedals and $120 for a Romin saddle. All that in this month, not counting $300 for the fit. So I've got to cool it for a bit.
    George

  12. #112
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by George View Post
    Thanks for the reply sarals, I rode motorcycles for years and sometimes I wonder why I stopped. On the other hand I'm glad I took up cycling.

    I like my Look was better than my Specialized Roubaix, that I just sold, but I to wish it were a little stiffer. When I'm out sprinting, I feel like I should be going faster than the effort I putting into it, but I think a lot of that is just me. The fastest I've gone on a 30 second sprint is 27 mph. When I'm doing sprints I usually do 30 second sprints, I take 2 min. rest between sprints and by the time I get done my legs feel like noodles.

    I really like the bike, but I think I would like to get something with a little more snap to it. I have the XL and I added the FSA 32 mm setback seat post and that helped me get down as low as I care to be. I got fit a few weeks ago and I have 60 cm from the nose of my saddle to the center of the handlebars, with a 6 cm drop. The fitter told me I probably should be on a 60 cm bike. The Look is only 57.4 so that was giving me a little problem. That setback seat post put me pretty close to where I have to be. I really feel balanced on the bike now.

    Your right on with what you said about going down hill. I was going 35 mph down hill and I was tempted to let go of the handlebars, just to see how it would feel. I was hardly holding onto the bars and it was really stable.

    Anyhow I've been eyeing the Cervelo R 3. I haven't taken it out for a ride yet, but looking at the BB it looks like it should be stiffer than the Look. The down tube is also bigger, but the head tube is longer than the Look, but that's on the 60 cm bike. It really sounds like the bike would do the trick for me and the price is right, but I have to wait and see what happens around here. I just paid $175 for the seat post $180 for shoes $75 for new Shimano pedals and $120 for a Romin saddle. All that in this month, not counting $300 for the fit. So I've got to cool it for a bit.
    George, you're welcome! I see we agree on the bike. Hey, that Cervelo is a nice machine. No question! I'm going to wait a bit so I can see how my racing unfolds before I do anything about another bike. I've casually eyed other machines - Felt F1s, Cervelos, Colnagos, Specialized Tarmacs and Look 595s. Casually!

    I could use a bike fit on my Look. It is too small for me (it's an XS, 49cm), but only slightly so. I don't know that I'd spend the money for a fit just to be told what I already know! Anyway, I love my 566, it's a beautiful bike to look at (yeah, I did say that!), and it does ride very well. Good enough for this old lady!
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  13. #113
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Here is today's Saturday Morning Ride. I once again tried to stay with the A group. It was smaller group today because there are a lot events going around here, and many folks were partaking. I didn't get warmed up properly (my old litany) and went off the front with three fast riders early, only to pay for it. I was dropped at the bottom of Fishwife Hill (wheat from the chaff climb), but actually did okay on that little climb - carnage was done, though. I was offered the wheel of a gal I know (Hermes, I think you know of her - I'll talk more about her in a little bit) to bridge back up to the front group, and we picked up stragglers along the way. There was pretty good headwind and I wasn't playing that correctly, and I blew and went off the back. I managed to pick up with another rider a little further on, who dropped me in the rollers, but I got him again on a climb (yes - I passed someone on a climb!). We went back and forth for a bit after that. That little competition got us both back to the main group (at a regroup point), and I stayed with the A group until we left the Forest. The only reason I popped off the back there was because I was almost taken out on a really high speed corner by a rider who was trying to avoid a sandy patch in the road and moved into me.

    Here's where I talk about Donna, Hermes. I think you may know her from the track. She mentors, or did, at the Early Bird crits, and she's coached for years. To make this long story longer, she and I started talking at one of the regroup points. She knew I had started racing, but she didn't know anything else. I didn't know she was a coach! When the group left, she offered advice along the way, and then she told me "grab a wheel and hold it". I did. After my (damn) near crash, she joined back up with me and gave me a wealth of information. She had been watching me!

    Here's the gist:
    1) I have the fitness, but NOT the skills (I don't know what I'm doing).
    2) I'm a competent, even very good, bike handler ("you ride motorcycles, don't you?" she asked me - "for more than forty years, yes").
    3) I tend to be overgeared, spinning too high, and there is no RPM left when I need to make a jump.
    4) I'm a SPRINTER, she said that was very obvious, and I have potential to be a decent one (even now).
    5) I need more races, a coach, and that reading the Joe Friel book is a great start (it arrived yesterday).

    I may ask her to coach me. I know she would.

    Sometimes things just fall in your lap!
    Last edited by sarals; 07-28-12 at 07:23 PM.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  14. #114
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    Actually the best things always do fall in one's lap!

  15. #115
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lprice1023 View Post
    Actually the best things always do fall in one's lap!
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  16. #116
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    So sarals needs to do some sprint work. Excellent.

    As for fitting your Look, any reputable fitter will give you a refit on your new bike for a nominal fee. If your fit is truly off right now, then they'll true it up as best they can and save the full fit for the new bike.

    I love my Felt. Like your Look, it also handles extremely well, but also like your Look, it has a soft rear triangle. Great for comfort, but I always wonder what I'm throwing away. If I could replace it, though, I'd replace it with an F1. That is, unless there was a pro deal on something else I like.

  17. #117
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Shovel, I loved my Felt F85 (my first road bike) and I love my B2. Jim Felt is a nice guy, too - I met him (I think I said that once). As for looks, I just am totally smitten by the AR, but I understand it's not suitable for crits. The F series (5 through 1?) would do for sure! Top of my list!!

    You think your F - series has a soft rear triangle? Wow. At your level you HAVE to be giving up something there, I'd think.

    Me. A sprinter! Whoda thunk it??
    Last edited by sarals; 08-02-12 at 10:12 AM.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzTallRider View Post
    One tip with the Garmins is that it's a good idea to move the files from the Garmin to a folder on your hard drive. It speeds up Garmin processes to not have old files (doesn't have to sort through the files to find new ones for upload, nor does it have to convert their format for firmware upgrades), and it protects your data (assuming you backup your hard drive). My work flow is this:

    1. Daily: Upload from Garmin to Strava using the Strava website
    2. Daily: Upload to TrainingPeaks.com using their utility, which is a free download
    3. Daily: Make post workout notations in the uploaded TraningPeaks.com workouts
    4. Weekly: Pull the workouts into WKO+ (from withing WKO+). These will then include the notes.
    5. Weekly: Move (not copy) the files from the Garmin to my hard drive
    6. Weekly: Email the .wko files to my coach.

    When I was also keeping GC up-to-date:
    7. Import .fit files into GC from the hard drive

    Doesn't take as long as it looks.

    GC didn't really add value for me over WKO+, and I had to go to a pre-release to get it to read the new version of the Garmin 500 files. That release would leave a DOS window open anytime the program was up, and closing it closed the program. So I stopped keeping it up to date. Probably fixed now, but I'm already awash in data.
    Not wishing to digress from Sarals' thread, but I find this post, along with your TRIMP one that followed, to be very interesting. I bought a Garmin 500 recently and hope to get a power meter around Christmas time, so I would like to get more of a handle on this stuff. I currently upload to Garmin Gonnect I'll have to think out a strategy for the next season - obviously a coach would need to understand it also.

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  20. #120
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    I have much to report. It's been a BUSY week.

    Lots of high intensity training. LOTS of high intensity training, which was capped by this ride last night. It was a "Ladies Only" ride, but the group was comprised of Don Chapin/MBRT Team riders (one was the women's rep for the team) and two other fast gals, one of whom is VERY fast. I started at a deficit, because I had an intense spin session in the morning (lots of interval training), and I was on day six of high level training (I needed a rest). The ride went out quickly, and then got even quicker and I had trouble staying in contact - but I did. What was very nice was the three times I blew and had go OTB, someone would come back and pull me back up to the group. I always made it back up, too. On the climbs, I didn't suck, but I couldn't climb with those gals. Wow. On the way back we did a fast pace line, rotating at 30 second intervals and held a huge pace (into a 10MPH headwind) for over three miles. I took the last pull, went too long (like I do - stupid Sara, stupid Sara!), popped and when I rotated off, lost the last wheel in the line and had to slow way down. They waited for me, once again - and during the last portion of the ride I had a long talk with Jen (the Team rep) who offered all sorts of great advice, and then said "we'd be glad to have you" (on the team). YES!!!! Also, when I looked at the data on Strava last night I had absolutely killed (for me) many portions of that ride. In perspective, the younger, fitter, more experienced women were quite a bit faster than little ole me, but I didn't do badly at all.

    I went with a coach. I am going to have structured training, built around my (silly) work schedule and life style. It's past time to get really serious.

    I bought a (used) Cycleops Powertap. Now I AM getting serious.

    Time for a little rest - just today!
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  21. #121
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by valygrl View Post

    Valygrl, I bought this setup:

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/110928025083...84.m1497.l2649

    It's used, but the price was right. I'll have to do one of two things - it's going on my Look 566, which has Easton EA90 Aero wheels on it (which I really like). 1) Use the existing rim and take the front wheel (a Mavic CXP-33) wheel off of my Giant CFR Team and put that wheel on the Look so they're closely matched, or 2) have the Cycleops hub laced into my Easton Rim (I'll still be using my 12 - 28 cassette in either case).
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

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    Awesome Sara - love how you are "all in" on racing.

    edit - I posted at the same time as you. That's a great deal on that powertap wheel!
    Last edited by valygrl; 08-02-12 at 10:18 AM.
    ...

  23. #123
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by valygrl View Post
    Awesome Sara - love how you are "all in" on racing.

    edit - I posted at the same time as you. That's a great deal on that powertap wheel!
    I couldn't afford it, but I couldn't pass it either - I agree, it was a great price (I wonder what's wrong with it???? [SHUDDER])

    My new coach said he can use heart rate, and I'd need to get another zone evaluation, but he'd much rather I use power. So...yes, I'm all in, and maybe not much will happen, but I'm going to really enjoy the ride!

    Hugs, you!! XOXOX!!
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  24. #124
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    sarals jumps into the deep end head first. Fortunately the pool was filled yesterday.

    Look at all the stuff you did yesterday. Congratulations on finding a team to ride with and some mentors to help you out on race days. Choosing a coach is a big decision, probably the biggest one short of deciding to go all in. That's a great decision. Structured training is the key, and in my opinion what you need the most, more than anything else. It's going to change your life. You will get more rest. You will have to give up on some of the social things you love so much, but if you do it right, they can be worked in, at least a little bit. You will learn patience and restraint, for example, how to let the group ride away from you when they wick it up on an easy day. These things pay off on the race course.

    I would not re-lace the Powertap unless the Open Pro has signs of fatigue or the wheel is tired. Those rims have a tendency to crack at the spoke holes. I had the same wheel w(actually, it was an SL+ wireless version) which I bought used from a tri-geek coach in Canada. I used it exclusively for training, putting about 3K miles on it and never had one problem. I sold it for more than I paid for it. A used Powertap is a great first step into power.

    It's going to be quite fun to watch your progress.
    Last edited by shovelhd; 08-02-12 at 10:32 AM.

  25. #125
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarals View Post
    I couldn't afford it, but I couldn't pass it either - I agree, it was a great price (I wonder what's wrong with it???? [SHUDDER])
    That's on the low side for a wired unit with everything. The high end is about $400.

    I like having HR data with power. The older straps are getting harder to find but you should be able to find one if you want one.

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