Advertise on Bikeforums.net



User Tag List

Results 1 to 24 of 24
  1. #1
    The Site Administrator: Currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes,please contact my assistnt admins for forum issues Tom Stormcrowe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    South Florida
    My Bikes
    Techna Wheelchair and a Sun EZ 3 Recumbent Trike
    Posts
    16,014
    Mentioned
    10 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)

    Thinking about making a move.....thoughts?

    We're thinking about moving the Racing Forums out to the main page, as a category.

    Inside would be:

    1. Juniors Club(For the Newbies and <23 crowd)
    2. The 33 (Officially named, "The 33", y the way....)
    3. Masters Club(50+)



    with pointer links on the main index, like regional Forums has.
    on light duty due to illness; please contact my assistants for forum issues. They are Siu Blue Wind, or CbadRider or the other 3 star folk. I am currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes. I am making good progress, happily.


    . “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”- Fredrick Nietzsche

    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." - Immanuel Kant

  2. #2
    Travelling hopefully chasm54's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Uncertain
    Posts
    6,894
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Great idea. But some of us were talking and thought it might be better to just call the Masters sub forum "Masters" without any defining age limit. Self-selection will probably work fine, and some of the 40+ crowd might like to talk to us old farts from time to time.

  3. #3
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Central Coast CA
    My Bikes
    2011 Prius Three, Specialized Venge, Felt B16, Look 566, Giant TCXW
    Posts
    4,226
    Mentioned
    25 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by chasm54 View Post
    Great idea. But some of us were talking and thought it might be better to just call the Masters sub forum "Masters" without any defining age limit. Self-selection will probably work fine, and some of the 40+ crowd might like to talk to us old farts from time to time.
    Doubt it.

    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  4. #4
    Senior Member VanceMac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Socal
    Posts
    4,176
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Makes much more sense. You'll get a vocal 10% who decry the change as apocalyptic, then forget it even happened 15 minutes later.

  5. #5
    Senior Member jdon's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    4,175
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Do it
    Quote Originally Posted by maddmaxx View Post
    How are you ever going to live in the real world if you can't get along with people who don't believe what your do?

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Tilting at Windmills
    My Bikes
    Lots of'em
    Posts
    546
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Being low on chips, I'm all in.

    My only real concern would be a loss in the signal to noise ratio.

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    South Louisiana
    My Bikes
    Cannondale CAAD9
    Posts
    3,841
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Tom - Sounds good. I agree with chasm54 that we shouldn't associate a number with the Master's subforum.
    Regards,
    Chuck

    Demain, on roule!

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Boulder, CO
    Posts
    7,326
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I'm thinking it is a good idea in concept but may need a little adjustment.

    Attenuates the wisdom across too many places. will the experienced folks really hang out in the newb forum and answer questions, or will it jsut be the kiddie pool? Where will the senior & masters newbies post? Main race forum? Newb/junior? 33?

    Calling it "the 33" is cute but exclusive for those of us already in there. Folks new to the site wont know what it is. Is that what you intend?

    Is there a main road race forum, with those three subforums, or is that the 33? Or is the 33 the RTT/shooting the bull forum?
    ...

  9. #9
    Travelling hopefully chasm54's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Uncertain
    Posts
    6,894
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by valygrl View Post
    I'm thinking it is a good idea in concept but may need a little adjustment.

    Attenuates the wisdom across too many places. will the experienced folks really hang out in the newb forum and answer questions, or will it jsut be the kiddie pool? Where will the senior & masters newbies post? Main race forum? Newb/junior? 33?

    Calling it "the 33" is cute but exclusive for those of us already in there. Folks new to the site wont know what it is. Is that what you intend?

    Is there a main road race forum, with those three subforums, or is that the 33? Or is the 33 the RTT/shooting the bull forum?
    Good points, valygirl. I'm less worried about spreading out the wisdom because at least we'll all be in one forum, and I envisage a good deal of cross-fertilisation between the 33 and the other two sub-forums. I was assuming the 33 became the new racing forum with masters and juniors as two sub-forums, but agree both that that needs clarifying and that "the 33" needs explanation. As for the kiddie pool, I'd certainly be happy to drop in there from time to time, the more so now that I'm sponsoring a youth team. I'm sure that some other old gits with more experience than I of how things happen in the US would do the same. Maybe a mod could be found with an interest in coaching/junior racing?

  10. #10
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Western MA
    My Bikes
    Yes
    Posts
    11,875
    Mentioned
    36 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    In a utopian world, the proposed organization...new racers, racers, masters racers, makes a lot of sense. However, before any change is made, the history and culture of the existing forums should be reviewed.

    New racers just aren't going to want to hang around with new racers. That's not how racer's minds work. It's always cat up, now. Get out of Cat5 as soon as possible. Everybody is sketchy except me. I'm sure that there are a few people out there contemplating racing that would like to hear from others that recently made the jump, but I think most would rather ask someone who has raced for a while. I also wonder how much Juniors and U23's will want to collaborate with themselves. So I just don't see a value for a U23 forum unless they have been asking for it. Steering threads to that subforum won't work unless we are going to be checking ID's.

    The 33 is the 33. The signal to noise ratio is low. It can be snarky and sometimes nasty. People can get defensive. Piling on is common. But it is the default place for racers here. Everyone is welcome including new racers as long as they have thick skin. No amount of forum renaming or moving will change that culture. I have no problem with it, but somebody does, on a regular basis.

    The 50+ racing forum is different. No thick skin is required. Snarky stuff is rare. It's a very friendly place to both newcomers and established racers. Looking in from the 33 it must look like the geriatric kiddie pool. That's fine, at least the water is warm and there aren't any sharks. If moving the forums would change this culture, then I'd be against it. BTW not everyone is 50+ in that forum.

    My advice would be to leave the 33 alone and move the Masters 50+ Racing forum under Road Cycling and rename it to Masters Racing (30+).

  11. #11
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Central Coast CA
    My Bikes
    2011 Prius Three, Specialized Venge, Felt B16, Look 566, Giant TCXW
    Posts
    4,226
    Mentioned
    25 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I go with Shovel.

    People are going to gravitate towards what attracts them. The 33 has it's stalwarts, so does this place. I believe a "New Racer" forum would in time, too. Sure, most people there would want to move on quickly, but I think it's needed.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  12. #12
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    San Francisco Bay Area
    My Bikes
    Too Many
    Posts
    8,347
    Mentioned
    27 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I agree with Shovel and Valygrl.

    IMO, learning to race is an apprenticeship. New racers learn from more experienced journeymen racers and mentors who are willing to share experiences. And smart new racers take advantage of the advice and some do not.

    IMO, the 50+ racing forum has a culture that wants to grow the membership and learn from each other. I like the fact that I have met racers on the 50+ racing forum and raced with them and know them socially.

    I also like that most of the 50+ posters actually race and I like that all disciplines / technologies (road, track, mountain and cyclocross) are included.
    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  13. #13
    Idiot Emeritus sarals's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Central Coast CA
    My Bikes
    2011 Prius Three, Specialized Venge, Felt B16, Look 566, Giant TCXW
    Posts
    4,226
    Mentioned
    25 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
    I also like that most of the 50+ posters actually race and I like that all disciplines / technologies (road, track, mountain and cyclocross) are included.
    It's a viable forum! I hope the new racing forum is, too.
    Racer Ex..."Don't know if the shop is under new ownership. If not feel free to shoplift stuff and break bottles in his parking lot."

  14. #14
    rugged individualist wphamilton's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Alpharetta, GA
    My Bikes
    Nashbar Road
    Posts
    6,092
    Mentioned
    19 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I wonder how many people lurk those forums without participating or even racing? From that broader perspective, if that's frequent, the move and consolidation makes sense.

  15. #15
    Travelling hopefully chasm54's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Uncertain
    Posts
    6,894
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    My advice would be to leave the 33 alone and move the Masters 50+ Racing forum under Road Cycling and rename it to Masters Racing (30+).
    I agree with a lot of what you say, shovel, but not with this. I wouldn't like to see us move from being a sub-forum of 50+ just to become another sub-forum of road. The principal attraction of the idea, for me, is to establish the racing forum.

    I've said enough, both here and in the 33. Obviously I'll go with what is decided.

  16. #16
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Western MA
    My Bikes
    Yes
    Posts
    11,875
    Mentioned
    36 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Hey, we are all getting our say and we don't have to agree. I can see your point and it makes a lot of sense.

  17. #17
    Old Road Racer Cleave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    SoCal
    My Bikes
    Bicycle Transportation: 2013 Ford Focus Electric, 2010 Toyota Prius
    Posts
    4,954
    Mentioned
    9 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Hi Tom, I agree with shovelhd about the "culture" of each forum. I used to spend a lot of time in the "33" because that was the only place to read and "converse" about amateur racing. However, I am NOT snarky by nature (well maybe a bit inside my head) and filtering through the snarkiness is kind of a chore for me. I still lurk in 33 but I don't spend a lot of time there because even though the signal-to-noise ratio is lower than in the 41, it's still higher than I like. BTW, one person's signal may be another person's noise. Also, BTW, I understand the culture of the 33 and I don't want to change it. It's just not my regular cup of tea.

    As for this sub forum, obviously the culture is much more to my liking. I like the fact that it's in a spot where older Masters racers are more likely to find it, rather than younger Masters. At least in my locale, younger Masters have a much different mindset towards racing and all levels of racers than older Masters. Somewhat joking, but not completely, I think younger male Masters (under 50) haven't had enough of a decline in testosterone to temper some of their thinking.

    In fact, in SoCal, we have an unofficial but very active network of 55+ / 60+ Masters that have been able to re-shape some races out here. Our latest "triumph" was getting this year's district criterium championships separated as they have been in prior years. This year's promoter wanted to combine 55+ and 60+ together (scored separately) and an email campaign got us separate races which ALL of us preferred. (Combined races can greatly change race dynamics.)

    What I'd like to preserve is the calmer, gentler, and more encouraging nature of this sub forum. Of course if it becomes a Masters-any-age sub forum, I hope some of the more boisterous Masters will self-select themselves to post in a more boisterous sub forum.
    Thanks.
    Cleave
    "Real men wear pink."
    See my cycling photos at http://www.pbase.com/cleavel/bicycling
    See my bikes at http://www.pbase.com/cleavel/mybicycles
    Visit my blog at http://cleavesblant.wordpress.com/
    Lightning Velo Cycling Club: http://www.lightningvelo.org/

  18. #18
    Elite Rider Hermes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    San Francisco Bay Area
    My Bikes
    Too Many
    Posts
    8,347
    Mentioned
    27 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Cleave makes some great points.

    I like the racing content of this forum and it is meant to be factual and constructive.

    I like banter, humor, occasional trash talking and debate. It is always about the balance.

    In some ways, a boutique racing sub forum tucked away in a 50+ beginner / recreational forum may be the way to go.
    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Einstein

  19. #19
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Phoenix, AZ
    My Bikes
    Giant Propel, Cervelo P2
    Posts
    5,487
    Mentioned
    8 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Holy cow... we racers aren't just a top-level forum, we are a whole danged section.

  20. #20
    powered by Racer Ex gsteinb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    teh Jersey
    Posts
    16,394
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    well, here it is.

  21. #21
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    South Louisiana
    My Bikes
    Cannondale CAAD9
    Posts
    3,841
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
    well, here it is.
    And so we are! Thanks, Gary.
    Regards,
    Chuck

    Demain, on roule!

  22. #22
    Travelling hopefully chasm54's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Uncertain
    Posts
    6,894
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Looks good. I hadn't realised it might be a top-level domain, but I like the idea. Obviously the 33 will remain the most active forum, but I hope a few of its more elderly residents drop in here from time to time - now they knowthis place exists.

  23. #23
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Western MA
    My Bikes
    Yes
    Posts
    11,875
    Mentioned
    36 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Ibtl

  24. #24
    powered by Racer Ex gsteinb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    teh Jersey
    Posts
    16,394
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    fair enough

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •