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Old 09-13-05, 07:53 PM   #1
eric1508
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XTR down to Deore. Is there REALLY that much difference?

OK, bear with me here. I am not here to say that XTR or XT or LX are not good components. I am just asking you it you think that maybe Deore and even Avilio could be about the same in most areas other than maybe a few grams in weight?
This is where I'm coming from. I have had a few Kleins and a few Treks and a few Gary Fishers. With components ranging from XT to Avilio. My current Gary Fisher has a Deore Rear derailer and shifters and an Avilio front derailer. (I recently traded in my old Klein with some extra money so I could get both a road bike and a mountain bike. So they came with lower end components.) I was expecting to maybe have some issues or just a sloppy feel with the shifting but was pleasantly surprised that this new low end stuff works GREAT! Actually, it feels better than my XT stuff on my did. So I asked one of the guys at the bike shop about it and he said that, other than weight, a Deore component is about the same as an LX or XT and so on. I know they lighter materials in the more expensive stuff but we are talking a few grams. Other than that, he seemed to think that the reliability and performance would be about the same. And I would'nt have beleived him myself if I didn't have first hand experience.
So it just makes me wonder why so many people feel the need to spend SO much more on the higher end components when there isn't much difference (or atleast in my experience). I understand that the nicer bikes come with the higher end stuff but other than that it would seem like unless you REALLY need to save a few grams in weight, you don't really need anything more than, say, Deore.
What do you guys think? What have you experienced yourselves?
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Old 09-13-05, 09:43 PM   #2
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Wow, Im surprised the only difference between xtr and deore is weight. For the huge gap in prices, I would think it is more durable, lighter, stronger and overall better. But I really don't know much about why one is better than the other, thats just my guess ^^
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Old 09-13-05, 10:42 PM   #3
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XTR lasts longer before it develops play, is lighter, has cartridge bearings in the jockey wheels. I think it has a lighter spring too. I dont really care though, because Shimano shifting sucks compared to SRAM. I run X.9 and love it to death.
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Old 09-13-05, 11:01 PM   #4
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Right now I'm riding my dads bike with alvio all around, and my riding buddy has all xt. We ride lots of single track, some technical dh (on a ht), and some pretty tough uphill stuff. My dads bike goes out of tune every ride (2-3 hours). I'm grinding the gears if I don't adjust, clean, lube (sometimes 2 hours of labor) after every ride whereas my buddy can go a 8-10 rides before tuning and he barely has to adjust. Also his bike's shifts are noticable more smooth and quiet, peddling is easier, etc. The first time I took my dads bike out I felt the same as you, but man it's a PITA now and thats why I'm gettin my stumpy tomrrow.

It's like comparing a ford gt to a porsche gt sure the ford is fast and handles for less, but come on, the porsche owns it.
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Old 09-13-05, 11:05 PM   #5
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I can go as many rides as I want without having to re-adjust my SRAM setup. I do throw it in a stand before and after each ride to check and make sure, but it always seems to be dialed...
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Old 09-14-05, 01:01 AM   #6
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I used to run Shimano Deore due to the fact Ithought it performed great, and for my style of riding, Fr/DH/DH racing, they are going to be broken reasonably often. Now I run a Shimano Alivio, road equivalent to deore and I am happy. The higher end stuff seems as though it doesnt need to be adjusted as often, it is lighter and marginally a crisper shift. However most people buy it for the wank factor.
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Old 09-14-05, 05:25 AM   #7
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My friend and I went on a 25 mile ride the other day. He has a Klein with full XT and I have a Gary Fisher with Deore, Avilio, Deore. The ride consisted of a lot of technical stuff so shifting was constant. I never even had a hickup durring the whole 2 and a half hours of the ride. If anything, he was grinding a few gear at times. Now his setup was older than mine so that might account for his issues but I had absolutely none. I have been riding it pretty hard for the last few months and have yet to adjust anything. So maybe Avilio is when it starts gettinga little rough, I don't know, but atleast Deore seems rock solid to me.
And as for durability, I know they might us so TI in maybe XTR but the all alluminum of Deore should show where much faster than any of the others. But I guess only time will tell.
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Old 09-14-05, 05:30 AM   #8
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I think people like it 'cause it says XTR. It just looks sweet. You know us bike guys are about one-upping each other with a seatpost... derr. if you ever step back and look at that it's kinda ridicuous though!
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Old 09-14-05, 05:55 AM   #9
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The way I see it is that building a high spec bike is as much fun as getting out and riding. Its kinda like the guys that spend silly money modding their cars and putting big shiny alloys and body kits on them . Its a hobby at the end of the day, and if someone wants to cover their bike in expensive kit then thats up to them.
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Old 09-14-05, 06:16 AM   #10
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sorry, i cant help myself, i have to point it out! ITS ALIVIO, as in alive, not avilio
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Old 09-14-05, 06:31 AM   #11
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I find the higher end you go the crisper/quicker the shifts and the less tuning you have to do. Deore works fine though. Where there is a real difference though is in hubs or something like that. You'll notice a huge difference between a Deore hub and an xtr hub.
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Old 09-14-05, 06:34 AM   #12
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Personally, I think that XTR/X.O level of component is completely unnecessary unless you are a top racer. Or want to look like one. Or make sure everyone knows you have made the ultimate financial committment.

I have no experience with Deore except for a pair of v brakes I bought for a bike. They work fine but are nowhere near the performance level/feel/adjustability of XTR v-Brakes. I don't think weight is the only difference there. That is the only comparison I personally have.


My geared bike came with a mix of lx and xt. old lx pod shifters, front lx derailler, rear xt derailler. I have put on the new XT cranks. They have worked as flawlessly as could be expected. I think XT is the Weight/Durability/function/price pinnacle of the shimano line.

As far as your new lower end stuff working as good or better as your old XT. That is where the technology trickles down to. 2005 deore probably has the same level of technology as 2001 XTR.

I think deore is fine componentry, by the way. I am with you that if I was building a geared mountain bike from the ground up with shimano, I would probably build it with a mix of lx/deore. On a new build I am doing this fall I have purchased all SRAM stuff anyway. I don't like being forced into combo brakes/shifters and rapidrise.
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Old 09-14-05, 06:51 AM   #13
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I agree with your comments on shimano forcing people into combined brake/shifter units and rapid rise stuff. However I have recently bought rear mech, shifters and front mech in last years XTR so the shifters are separate units allowing me to run non shimano brakes and the mech is non rapid rise, and the finish is a nicer colour. And the best bit, it cost me less than XT. I can't say for sure if I would have bought XTR at full price. I would have liked to, but I think I may just have gone for XT. Anyway, not an issue I've got full XTR now and haven't had to pay a price that makes you feel sick when you scratch it on the first ride out.
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Old 09-14-05, 06:54 AM   #14
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Just a quick thought on the combined units. Doesn't anyone else think that Shimano will be forced into continuing to produce non integrated shifters/levers, as surely they are loads of riders out there that want to run shimano gearing with the likes of Hope or Magura brakes.
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Old 09-14-05, 08:03 AM   #15
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sorry, i cant help myself, i have to point it out! ITS ALIVIO, as in alive, not avilio
Oops! My dyslexia must have kicked in.
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Old 09-14-05, 08:24 AM   #16
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I understand that the nicer bikes come with the higher end stuff but other than that it would seem like unless you REALLY need to save a few grams in weight, you don't really need anything more than, say, Deore.
Good points above in terms of weight and performance. I'd also point out that some of the difference is in the details. I've got a Deore rear derailleur that shifts well enough when properly tuned, but the barrel adjuster is soft, crappy plastic that's torn up enough that making adjustments is a pain in the a**.

I've got an X.9 going on as soon as I can carve out a little time to work on the bike, but even just from taking it out of the box and playing with it, I can tell it's been engineered a bit better and just feels like more of a "precision" part. Is that worth the total price difference? Maybe, maybe not, but that type of stuff is important to me.
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Old 09-14-05, 11:48 AM   #17
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I'm just getting back into the sport, and I'm trying to figure out what sorts of components I should be looking for in certain price ranges on certain bikes...

I want to try and find the relationship between Shimnano and SRAM c'ponents. Is the below accurate?

XTR = X.0
XT = X.9
LX = X.7
Deore = SX-5
Alivio = SX-4

thx!
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Old 09-14-05, 01:15 PM   #18
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Seriously, with my new bike that im getting. Im hoping to get deore components to start out. Otherwise Ill be upgrading. I really dont know anything about any component lines other than shimano, thats why thats all im getting.
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Old 09-14-05, 03:11 PM   #19
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Most people who buy Corvette are not into car racing.
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Old 09-14-05, 03:35 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turkish
I'm just getting back into the sport, and I'm trying to figure out what sorts of components I should be looking for in certain price ranges on certain bikes...

I want to try and find the relationship between Shimnano and SRAM c'ponents. Is the below accurate?

XTR = X.0
XT = X.9
LX = X.7
Deore = SX-5
Alivio = SX-4

thx!
X.0, Avid 7 - A class by itself (SRAM needs to make their group labelings consistent)

XTR = X.9
LX/XT = X.7
Deore = SX-5
Alivio = SX-4

Acera = junk
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Old 09-14-05, 03:53 PM   #21
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now to be fair, acera really isn't all that bad if it's well tuned... i'm running full acera on my hardrock, and after some fairly hard riding, it's still right as rain.
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Old 09-14-05, 04:33 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopper
Now I run a Shimano Alivio, road equivalent to deore and I am happy.
Errrr No.
Alivio is a step lower than Deore and is a MTB gruppo

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Old 09-14-05, 04:59 PM   #23
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Good image Raiyn, but wouldn't it have been easier to just type it out?
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Old 09-14-05, 05:01 PM   #24
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Good image Raiyn, but wouldn't it have been easier to just type it out?
Perhaps, but people seem to understand better with graphics
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Old 09-14-05, 07:27 PM   #25
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Goes back to my old saying that the bike doesn't make a good rider... It's the Rider who's responsible....

Deore, SRAM, whatever level, it don't really matter.... They will ALL work for what they were designed for. Some "might" last slightly longer, but mainly the paperclip weight savings is what it's all about...

After 1 or 2 mud holes, what's a few grams anyway?

Go figure.... I'm not impressed by XTR or anything "Top of the Line".

What's in a Name....
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